Why no difference?

[seebs]

I say again... Certain specific groups do pretty well.

Go ahead and look up the felony rate among Quakers. I mean, since it stopped being illegal to be one.

 

[CSMR]

Bellman:
If there is no discernable difference between Christians and other groups of people, how do you discern them in order to make this observation?
I believe there are some differences.
What sort of difference would you expect?

 

[The Bellman]

Bellman:
If there is no discernable difference between Christians and other groups of people, how do you discern them in order to make this observation?
I believe there are some differences.
What sort of difference would you expect?

I would expect some sort of difference. I would expect a group of people who know the Truth to be happier and have happier relationships, at the least. There is, however, no evidence that this is the case.

 

[seebs]

I would expect some sort of difference. I would expect a group of people who know the Truth to be happier and have happier relationships, at the least. There is, however, no evidence that this is the case.

On reflection, why would you expect such a thing?

 

[psychedelicist]

God isn't too keen on slavery.

However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance. You may treat your slaves like this, but the people of Israel, your relatives, must never be treated this way. (Leviticus 25:44-46 NLT)


If you buy a Hebrew slave, he is to serve for only six years. Set him free in the seventh year, and he will owe you nothing for his freedom. If he was single when he became your slave and then married afterward, only he will go free in the seventh year. But if he was married before he became a slave, then his wife will be freed with him. If his master gave him a wife while he was a slave, and they had sons or daughters, then the man will be free in the seventh year, but his wife and children will still belong to his master. But the slave may plainly declare, 'I love my master, my wife, and my children. I would rather not go free.' If he does this, his master must present him before God. Then his master must take him to the door and publicly pierce his ear with an awl. After that, the slave will belong to his master forever. (Exodus 21:2-6 NLT)


When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)


When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)


Slaves, obey your earthly masters with deep respect and fear. Serve them sincerely as you would serve Christ. (Ephesians 6:5 NLT)


Christians who are slaves should give their masters full respect so that the name of God and his teaching will not be shamed. If your master is a Christian, that is no excuse for being disrespectful. You should work all the harder because you are helping another believer by your efforts. Teach these truths, Timothy, and encourage everyone to obey them. (1 Timothy 6:1-2 NLT)


The servant will be severely punished, for though he knew his duty, he refused to do it. "But people who are not aware that they are doing wrong will be punished only lightly. Much is required from those to whom much is given, and much more is required from those to whom much more is given." (Luke 12:47-48 NLT)

 

[Risen Tree]

Strawman. You gotta take the verses into cultural context.

 

[psychedelicist]

Strawman. You gotta take the verses into cultural context.

How so? If the bible is the word of god, it would have nothing to do with the cultute of that time. If slavery was truly immoral, he would have outlawed it in that time as well. But as we see this is not the case.

 

[Norea]

I can't remember when the study was done so I suggest everyone take a grain of salt with this one. I heard somewhere that there was an experiment done on some college kids to see what factors changed their chances of cheating or not. According to the study 30% of students that answered that they cheated happened to be of one form of religion or another. Where as atheist students, according to this study, 29% cheated. Now with that being said, such a study probably just concludes it no better than chance that your faith or lack thereof changes your personality and behavior.

-- Bridget

 

[CSMR]

How so? If the bible is the word of god, it would have nothing to do with the cultute of that time. If slavery was truly immoral, he would have outlawed it in that time as well. But as we see this is not the case.

I don't think that slavery is in all circumstances and societies immoral, but that argument is wrong. Not all immoral things are outlawed.

 

[CSMR]

I can't remember when the study was done so I suggest everyone take a grain of salt with this one. I heard somewhere that there was an experiment done on some college kids to see what factors changed their chances of cheating or not. According to the study 30% of students that answered that they cheated happened to be of one form of religion or another. Where as atheist students, according to this study, 29% cheated. Now with that being said, such a study probably just concludes it no better than chance that your faith or lack thereof changes your personality and behavior.

-- Bridget

You haven't put the statistics properly. What you say doesn't rule out the possibility that all religious students cheated, nor does it rule out the possibility that only 1% or religious students cheated. Also such statistics don't give causation or lack of it, since it may be that people tend to be more religious who cheat (because they want forgiveness) or who don't (because they don't feel they have to change their lives so much).

 

[Norea]

Well like I said I heard this somewhere a while back. But all I remember was it was a 30% for so-called believers and 29% for so-called non-believers.

-- Bridget

 

[psychedelicist]

I don't think that slavery is in all circumstances and societies immoral, but that argument is wrong. Not all immoral things are outlawed.

Really? In what society would slavery be in any sense moral?

 

[CaDan]

I say again... Certain specific groups do pretty well.

Go ahead and look up the felony rate among Quakers. I mean, since it stopped being illegal to be one.

But y'all do have to answer for (or at least explain) Dick Nixon.

 

[Norea]

Hey duh pick on Tricky Dick Nixon!

-- Bridget

 

[seebs]

But y'all do have to answer for (or at least explain) Dick Nixon.

Hey, if Kerry can be Catholic, and Bush can be a Methodist, Nixon can be a Quaker.

To be fair, I think Quakers have committed some serious errors in the past... But I think the group's record as a whole does call for some kind of explanation.

 

[WaZoO]

Hey, if Kerry can be Catholic, and Bush can be a Methodist, Nixon can be a Quaker.

And I can be a 60 story tall flying bunny rabbit with telepathy.

 

[Buzz Dixon]

And I can be a 60 story tall flying bunny rabbit with telepathy.

Didn't Gamera fight you in amovie back in the 60s?

 

[Norea]

Yea she could beat up on Mecha-Godzilla!

-- Bridget

 

[Jedi christian]

And it doesn't mean they're MORE happy, either. Do you have anything to suggest that christians are, in fact, more happy?

I was simply trying to make the point you can't measure happiness!

 

[Jedi christian]

Surveys show that marriages of christians have no greater (in fact, slightly less) success than those of atheists.

Sorry, more information required before this can even be admitted as evidence.
Please cite specific surveys! Your doing the exact thing you told me not to do.
And, by the way, where did you get those statistics? Athiest websites?