Why is there no middle ground in parenting?

[TexasSky]

-Ok allow me to fall off of my soapbox for a second and state my OPINION (NOT FACT!!! AND NOT FOR EVERYONE!!)

My wife and I are 100% all natural birth- we'd do it at home but we're renting and not too sure how the landlord (a good friend of ours) would feel about it so we're going the Natural Birthing Center route w/ a midwife supporter. We feel that it's the way to go, that it is the healthiest route for mom and baby- regardless of statistics (c'mon folks we know they're doctored on both sides) it is the way that works best FOR OUR FAMILY.

When I say medical birth- I mean just that- one with interventions, scheduled c-sections, etc. You can make arguments against it, but people make arguments for it as well (hence elective c-sections). It is not our place to judge- even if you think it's wrong, it is not your child and you have NO right to tell that parent how they should birth the blessing God gave them. End of story- YOUR way isn't the only way and it isn't even necessarily the "best" way, but it is YOUR WAY and your right to do it that way.

I've read quite a bit about attachment parenting and loosely used- yes we all do it- strictly used only a select few do. When Fish is talking about attachment parenting, I think she's being more strict with the term (not necessarily judgmental, just strict). We've told people that we're probably not going to co-sleep nightly and they immediately go to "But attachment parenting is so good for the baby! Statistics show..." We will be attached to our children, we won't have them going to daycare (not that I judge those who do) and we'll be co-sleeping occasionally but initially (who knows what we'll do when the kid shows) we're not planning on it being a regular thing.

Seige,

I think people who are most against your plans are people who have known a mother whose live was saved by medical intervention or whose baby's life was saved by medical intervention.

They cannot imagine not wanting to have the best possible emergency care available if something doesn't go right.

That said, I know many people like you and your wife who recognize that women birthed children for centuries without such care. All I can suggest is that you go back and study the mortality rates for moms and babies in those eras, and that you take every precaution you can to be prepared for the worst case scenarios of your natural births.

 

[seige]

That said, I know many people like you and your wife who recognize that women birthed children for centuries without such care. All I can suggest is that you go back and study the mortality rates for moms and babies in those eras, and that you take every precaution you can to be prepared for the worst case scenarios of your natural births.

This is actually really great advice! Whether we had our birth at home or at the birthing center we wanted to make sure we had an OB or someone on speed-dial in case something did happen. We do have "worst-case scenario" plans made (or we're making them now) which is just the intelligent way to have a natural birth, I think. You must plan for the worst-case scenario- that you or your baby might need medical attention, however, WE BELIEVE that planning for medical attention just in case and treating birth as a "medical event" are two different things. Thanks for the advice!

 

[Leanna]

Msdahl ... thanks

seige, do you have netflix? You can watch The Business Of Being Born on the computer then... they have a play it now option for that one.... I liked it more than I thought I would....

 

[gracepaints]

You'll note that it doesn't mean you have to breastfeed, be duct-taped to your child at all times, or use cloth diapers

A Duct-tape baby carrier!!! Now, there's something that I bet hasn't been made out of duct-tape yet. Hmm.......

 

[BeanMak]

The best advice I was ever given- "Everyone grows up because of or inspite of our parents"

There were plenty of times my husband and I would look at each other and say, "oh well, they can always work it out in therapy"

Let it free you

 

[ShannonMcCatholic]

Ladies (I guess other guys aren't as involved in this?) I appreciate your responses... hey, we only got one "Breastfeed or you're a terrible parent" response! I think that's pretty good!

I'm sorry if I do sound frustrated... I guess I am. My wife has a TON of other pressure on her and she doesn't need to hear the following (which she has heard- though I took some liberties with the "exact" quotes):

"If you don't cloth diaper your child then you are doing as much damage as dropping a nuclear warhead on a rainforest every day."

"You aren't going to quit school and be a stay at home mom? Don't come to me when your kid has no moral compass because you aren't home to teach it to him/her!"

"You're not going to on-demand feed after a few months? Who are you to tell your baby when to eat? Don't you eat when you are hungry? I can't believe you're just going to let your child sit there and starve. It's a form of child abuse."

"You will actually consider spanking your child? Better hope nobody sees you or they'll call CPS! Is that how you want your child to respond to things, violently, when they are trying to solve problems?"

She has enough pressures as it is and magazines like the one I mentioned in the OP do NOTHING for first-time mothers. How many of you felt "not good enough" as a new mother? These magazines just promote that! It's such junk!

As we can see from some people's posts, there are strong a opinions about all of these things- and I support your right to have these opinions but why does everyone have to do what you did?!

Regardless of what we do as parents I fully support everyone's right to do what they feel is best for their child- be it formula feeding, spanking, disposable diapers, or whatever. God entrusted you with this child and I know that with His support you'll do great and raise a wonderful God-loving child.

Thank you to those not chiming in with statistics- and especially thank you to those who have said that statistics can be manipulated. After reading some of these mothering magazines I think that mothers must be stupid to read these and think they are quality magazines. Maybe 1/2 their brains fell out when they had their baby... (JUST KIDDING!) You're giving me hope!

I'm coming in late on this--but I think this is one of the things which is really part of becoming whoever it is you will be as parents (which continues to evolve as your child gets older and if you have more children).

As with all things- I think pretty much everybody does the best they can do at the time, and wise people can see that their best isn't always necessarily what their child needs and then work to offset that lack the best that they can.

I think all of the defensiveness and zealotry comes from insecurity, which I think is absolutely pandemic among adults in general.

You might want to take this as a cue to really think about the first few weeks after the baby is born, and to work to limit visitors and phone calls--ceating a peaceful environment for you and mom to have time to figure out who you are as parents of this new child. I have found that keeping people away for those few weeks (we have one party when baby is baptised and everyone gets to meet and hold baby) allows me and my husband to just get to know baby and gives us time to listen to our instincts and only get advice when we reach out and purposefully ask for it. After that firs month or so, I feel like an expert on my new baby, I feel like I really know him or her, and that makes me better able to shrug off other people's zealotry about everything.

Babies aren't born in isolation, the are born into a family--with many different people with many different needs. While it is true that baby's needs are more immediate, I don't think it is true that baby's needs are more important. Every parenting decision we make is (or ought to be) a complex weighing of what is best for everyone in the family. For example, while breastfeeding is likely an objectively 'better' form of infant feeding--if mom is in pain, and is overwhelmed and exhausted and beginning to feel resentful of baby--well subjectively breastfeeding might no longer be 'better'. Or if quitting school will,in the long run, make a parent more resentful of their child(ren)-then those couple of years of cazy schedules and sacrifice will be a better choice for that family. I dunno with all things, people seem to have a hard time taking things which they view as objectively the best options and extrapolating other people's circumstances which might make something else subjectively better.

 

[Robinsegg]

Sounds like you're gonna be a great dad!

The more I read I see that for everything parenting and pregnancy related there are STRICT lines drawn. For instance:

breastfeeding vs. bottle feeding
breastfeeding vs. formula feeding
breastfeeding on demand vs. scheduled breastfeeding
cloth diapers vs. disposable diapers
spanking vs. no spanking
stay-at-home mom vs. working moms
natural birth vs. hospital birth
circumcision vs. no circumcision

There are actually some of us that have a middle ground on some of these issues (sorry, haven't read the thread, just the OP).
One *can* both breastfeed and bottle feed . . . I pumped milk so others could feed baby.
While *we* didn't give our kids formula, I've seen other moms supplement with formula, either at a certain age/demand, or for lack of supply, etc.
I've seen some families use cloth diapers at home and disposable ones out.
We spank rarely, and for specific offenses. We use other forms of discipline (and other punishments, they're different), but also spank when needed.
Some moms stay at home and work from home.
Other issues can't have a middle ground. After all, one can *hardly* half-way circumcise their son
But that doesn't mean we have to be judgmental about others' parenting choices. We can choose to accept them for who they are and how they parent, w/o having to be "validated" by them making the same choices we
do.
Rachel

 

[bugaboo]

You might want to take this as a cue to really think about the first few weeks after the baby is born, and to work to limit visitors and phone calls--ceating a peaceful environment for you and mom to have time to figure out who you are as parents of this new child. I have found that keeping people away for those few weeks (we have one party when baby is baptised and everyone gets to meet and hold baby) allows me and my husband to just get to know baby and gives us time to listen to our instincts and only get advice when we reach out and purposefully ask for it. After that firs month or so, I feel like an expert on my new baby, I feel like I really know him or her, and that makes me better able to shrug off other people's zealotry about everything.

Excellent advice!

 

[Hadassah]

I'll third that!

 

[seige]

Went to a bbq yesterday and it was more of the same junk... how frustrating. What I found funny was that it mirrored many of the "guy" conversations I have seen:

Guy conversation:

Guy 1: "I went hiking yesterday."
Guy 2: "I've hiked for two weeks before."
Guy 1: "I've hiked for a month."
Guy 2: "I've hiked 30 miles a day for two weeks."
Guy 1: "I don't really hike, I climb, just without ropes or harness. It is so steep I probably should use them though."
Guy 2: "I do climb, free climb with only my upper body. I actually duct-tape my feet together so I won't use them."

Two "new" moms:

Mom 1: "We're going to use environmentally friendly disposable diapers."
Mom 2: "We cloth diaper."
Mom 1: "We use only glass bottles when I pump."
Mom 2: "I never pump- always breast feed."
Mom 1: "I actually decided not to use any diapers whatsoever- we just trained our child like our dogs- she goes outside to poop."
Mom 2: "However you parent, we parent better. We're more green, organic, "natural," or whatever than you. Whatever way you are doing it is wrong."
Mom 1: "We are better than you infinity plus one whatever you say."

It wasn't quite like this, but it more or less boiled down to this, essentially a "mine's bigger than your's" argument between mothers. I wanted to slap them both and say- "You're both doing the best you can and your kids will turn out fine. In 20 years it WILL NOT MATTER whether you glass bottle fed or plastic bottle fed. The fact that you care about your child and their health means you're doing fine." (Note: I didn't say "whether you disposable diaper or cloth diapered your kid" because I didn't want to hear "Your diaper will still be in the landfill!" Even though we may make a personal choice to cloth diaper because we feel it is the responsible thing to do, I still support a parent's decision to disposable diaper their kid- We're going to worry about us and not spend our time judging other parents who are doing the best they can!)

 

[bliz]

You might enjoy developing more inter-generational friends... There's usually a wider range of topics of conversation...

 

[Robinsegg]

You might enjoy developing more inter-generational friends... There's usually a wider range of topics of conversation...

True enough I find that I talk about any number of things with people who have older children, people who don't have children, than I do with parents of kids my kids' ages. It can be kinda nice to talk to someone about something other than kids.

However, if you find yourself part of a "one-upmanship" conversation, start just saying affirmative things about the other person's parenting, and not offering your own. These conversations are often more about the other person feeling validated (or better than someone else) in their parenting decisions than real attempts at conversation. Once they feel you're not going to try to denigrate their choices, they may calm down and have a real conversation

Rachel

 

[immersedingrace]

Mom 1: "I actually decided not to use any diapers whatsoever- we just trained our child like our dogs- she goes outside to poop."

There is actually a diaper-free method of child raising. It's called Elimination Communication, in case you hadn't already made a concrete decision on cloth or disposable. While I admire anyone who may choose that route, I don't have the patience, or the stomach to clean up all that poop and pee off my couch &/or floor!

 

[jgonz]

In 20 years it WILL NOT MATTER whether you glass bottle fed or plastic bottle fed.

Actually, I hate to bring this up, but it _might_ matter, if someone is using plastic bottles that still have the chemical BPA, which leeches into the liquid in the bottle. Also, it also _might_ make a difference in 20 years about which type of formula someone uses on their baby... Take my oldest son (now 24, who was formula fed like his older sister). He had reflux, but back then they didn't do anything about it, he just puked all the time. Anyway, the ped recommended we switch to soy formula and we did. It helped a "little" but the puke stank worse than milk based... Anyway my point is that I didn't know that soy formula has been processed so intensely that the soy is toxic for some babies. It can cause thyroid issues. And, my son has thyroid issues. Nothing severe, but he does. I wonder about the bottles too... That chemical is toxic and went into his system. Did that contribute to his thyroid issues? We don't know for sure, but it's possible.

It still comes down to researching (which I didn't have the luxury of doing since I didn't have the internet 25 yrs ago) and making the best choices you can with the amount of information you have when you're making the choices. One thing that's nice is that I have grown & changed as I got older and continued to have children... to the point that how I parent is Radically different than how I parented 20- 25 yrs ago.

 

[GolfingMom]

I've said it once and I'll say it again...

WELCOME TO PARENTING.

 

[moonkitty]

I saw something this morning at theonion.com that reminded me of this thread:

(In case any of you are not aware of it, The Onion is an on-line satire site.)

 

[ChristianMama84]

I see it this way: Every parent thinks their way is the best way and if they didn't then they would do something else. I realized this when I was talking to my friend who had a baby nine months after me and wouldn't take my advice 100% of the time. lol

 

[Called2Grace]

I am finding though that this time around, I don't really care as much about what other people think or say. Although that could be becuase I can be a bit of a cow

With my daughter, I was absolutely beside myself with worry that I was doing something *wrong* becuase of some of the things people said to me, so I know what you mean.

I think when she was a bit older and before I fell pregnant with Alex, I was also one of the obnoxious ones who would do that to others too....which I feel really bad about.

Motherhood = guilt in a lot of cases, use this time to develop a thick skin and a sense of humour. Laugh at those that insist on playing that game.

 

[Leanna]

I think you need to step back from those people and ask yourself if you are around the wrong people or if you are taking the conversations the wrong way. Its one or the other.

 

[heart of peace]

I will admit that I stand in absolute AWE of women who are able to have a completely natural childbirth! I was guilt stricken for a long time after having my son that I couldn't have a natural birthing time. I no longer feel guilty at all, yet I still have such a deep respect for women who are able to birth children med free.