Why is the creation:evolution debate important?

Siderite · Nov 29, 2006

As you maybe aware, I have my own personal opinions on this topic; however, I would like to find out why people debate this topic.

Why is it important to you?

Thanks for your input

CC add: MOD Hat

Mjonller · Nov 29, 2006

Meh, nice way to "see the other side" as in see another person's ideas and debate them. Plus its fun to see some Fundy rant on something stupid.

Hydra009 · Nov 29, 2006

Not to be rude, but this question gets asked A LOT. There are many threads about it.

http://www.christianforums.com/t4210994-origins-debate-what-difference-does-it-make.html
http://www.christianforums.com/t4057998-importance-of-crevo-discussion.html

Siderite · Nov 29, 2006

Then, if you wish, you may ask an admin to delete.

Hydra009 · Nov 29, 2006

No, it's fine. You might get some new responses, just informing you that most people here have already answered the question before.

Siderite · Nov 29, 2006

Hydra> OK, thanks

BandyOne · Nov 29, 2006

Siderite said:
As you maybe aware, I have my own personal opinions on this topic; however, I would like to find out why people debate this topic.

Why is it important to you?

Thanks for your input

Because if we do not fight Creationism it will eventually turn and bite our butts,
and turn the schools into something like the schools of religion they have in Pakistan,
( you know, the ones with the nodding children )
schools for turning out religious zealots and fanatics.

Pete Harcoff · Nov 29, 2006

Because the application of proper science has very real socio-economic benefits and therefore it's in the best interest to have a properly educated workforce to realize those benefits.

Or put another way, the policies some creationists advocate are actually bad for the United States (or whichever country they reside in).

thaumaturgy · Nov 29, 2006

Pete Harcoff said:
Or put another way, the policies some creationists advocate are actually bad for the United States (or whichever country they reside in).

But if it's a matter of just a little science in a brutishly short life versus an ETERNITY IN HELL being tortured beyond rational levels of imagination. I am pretty sure a good creationist will prioritize differently.

For them science be damned.

thaumaturgy · Nov 29, 2006

I debate the topic because it's generally fun. I roomed with a philosophy major in unnergrad and got bit by the bug of just arguing stuff.

I also dearly believe that science has the most to offer. Creationism is a mask for people's general dismissal of science.

Not everyone should be a scientist, not everyone can. But when a scientist says something those who gainsay it must realize they've entered the arena.

If they can't support their ideas by the rules of the science game then they fail.

Creationism in the U.S. is being rammed down our throats and cloaked in the cloth of "righteousness" and "goodness". Frankly it sickens me that some people despise the very science that can make sense of their lives.

A4C · Nov 29, 2006

I think it is important for people to know truth (if they want to be free that is)

Hydra009 · Nov 29, 2006

A4C said:
I think it is important for people to know truth (if they want to be free that is)

Truth discerned through...?

thaumaturgy · Nov 29, 2006

Hydra009 said:
Truth discerned through...?

The Bible.

For example: Leviticus 11:20 tells me that 4-legged fowl that creep along th ground are "abominations". That would seem to be truth right there.

And Deuteronomy 14:7-8, the famous cud-chewing rabbits.

Deuteronomy 14:11 tells me quite truthfully that bats are unclean birds.

In Joshua Chpt 8 the israelites defeat an abandoned town. You gotta admit, that sure sounds reasonable.

So, yeah, there's truth to be found here.

TeddyKGB · Nov 29, 2006

A4C said:
I think it is important for people to know truth (if they want to be free that is)

It seems to me that intellectual freedom is less about the truth itself and more about how to get there. If God indeed created the universe in 6 days 6000 years ago, then he went to some lengths to make it look like he did not. Whatever his reasons, it does not seem like he would be too interested in our coming to that conclusion by freely applying our intellects.

CinNaMin46 · Nov 29, 2006

The debate is important because....athiests think that by proving evolution they are disproving God. Christians think that by accepting evolution they are rejecting God.

thaumaturgy · Nov 29, 2006

CinNaMin46 said:
The debate is important because....athiests think that by proving evolution they are disproving God. Christians think that by accepting evolution they are rejecting God.

Actually, speaking as an atheist, I don't believe in evolution so I can disprove God. I believed in evolution LOOOOONG before I stopped believing in God.

I truly hope that creationists don't think evolutionists cleave to evolution because they want to deny God.

This has always been the most frustrating thing about the debate. It is as if there are people out there who believe that scientists pursue specific knowledge with some ulterior motive (to destroy god) when, in all my years in the sciences (about 24 years now) I've never met ONE who did that. Not one.

I think it is easy for some creationists to throw this accusation around. It is dishonest and, well, frankly, evil.

Hydra009 · Nov 29, 2006

CinNaMin46 said:
The debate is important because....athiests think that by proving evolution they are disproving God.

I can't recall a single time that I've seen an atheist here positively say anything along those lines. Atheists may fiercely argue against both creationism and Christianity, but it's generally understood the two terms are not interchangeable - that debunking one person's biblical literalism on the topic of biology is a very different thing than debunking an entire religion or theism in general, since obviously, not all Christians and not all theists believe in creationism.

Rather, in creationists' attempts to portray their religion as a science, they often make empirically testable claims about nature - like the claim that the world is 6,000 years old. These testable claims/religious beliefs are therefore subject to potential falsification. So then when they get torn to pieces, the perception is that this is an attack on theism in general and Christianity in particular - even though it's dubious if that's the critic's intent. This perception wouldn't happen if people advanced their religious beliefs honestly, as religious beliefs, rather than attempting to disguise them as a rival scientific theory.

USincognito · Nov 29, 2006

CinNaMin46 said:
The debate is important because....athiests think that by proving evolution they are disproving God. Christians think that by accepting evolution they are rejecting God.

What an odd assertion to make. I, an atheist, constantly gripe about the injection of apologetics into what should first and foremost be a science based discussion and some of the most effective, soberly-dedicated-to-the-debate posters supporting evolution here are Christian.

These two facts would seem to fly in the face of your assertion.

Proselyte · Nov 29, 2006

Though the age old argument is interesting, I don't think it's of paramount importance, for it is not at the heart of salvation, and neither one can be proven. One requires faith, and the other is subject to constant revision and estimation.

I don't think many converts are won on either side, and usually each side wants to prove their point while casting a doubtful eye on the fellow debater.

It's good forum flame fodder though.

TasManOfGod · Nov 29, 2006

To be a Christian (be Christ like) and then deny Adam and creation or the flood of Noah which Christ, whom Christians follow, referred to makes little sense to me. Also Christs geneology is traced back to Adam and the number of years so involved are ~6000 . I for one will always remember who was my redeemer and paid that price for it.
So is science trying to say they know better than Christ or if you want to live in this world and be a Christian you cannot go to a public school or you must lie in exams. Is that the way you all think your founding fathers wanted it to be in the US? Is this not in itself the interference of Governments over "religious freedom "

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