Why does the earth rotate?

Kylie · Oct 2, 2015

The Earth rotates because the gas cloud it coalesced from billions of years ago was rotating. And that was rotating because of a thing called conservation of angular momentum as it contracted due to a little thing called gravity.

Funnily enough, the OP does have a link, and the link says this exact same thing.

Since you were the OP, I would have thought you'd be aware of it.

However, nowhere in your OP or the link you provided was there any claim that the Earth rotates because a big hunk of rock smacked into it, as you seemed to say science claims.

So I will ask you again - show me a valid scientific source that claims the Earth rotates because of a collision.

dad · Oct 2, 2015

KTS said:
The Earth rotates because the gas cloud it coalesced from billions of years ago was rotating.

Funny story. We wait for proof of any kind.

However, nowhere in your OP or the link you provided was there any claim that the Earth rotates because a big hunk of rock smacked into it, as you seemed to say science claims.

Fair enough, in this instance, what you have smashing is not a planet, but a shockwave from some supposed nearby supernova! For the moon, they do have a smash up of a large physical body. The simple question arises, did you see any nearby supernova send a shockwave that started us rotating? Or, is is just that you need that to explain things without creation?

"There’s so much dust that has gathered together that pieces begin to slam into each other, eventually forming asteroids and these are pulled in by the gravity of the spinning star. This goes on for billions of years, with everything bumping and crashing together. Bigger and bigger pieces are formed as the asteroids collide and stick together, all the while they are all spinning in the same direction."

http://www.planetsforkids.org/why-does-the-earth-spin.html

Except they aren't spinning the same direction at all.

"
As the planets condense they too have a portion of the system's momentum and as they condense will conserve it, with the same axis as the sun. All the planets can be observed to fit this model, except Uranus and Venus. They both rotate in a different direction than the norm for our system. It is believed that this is because of collisions during their formation that knocked them in a different direction. "

https://www.quora.com/Why-does-the-Earth-rotate

So the cosmic comical crash up derby science invented involves imaginary little molecules on up to asteroids and planets.

Kylie · Oct 2, 2015

dad said:
Funny story. We wait for proof of any kind.

The mechanism is quite well understood. We have seen countless examples of things starting to rotate as they contract towards a center point.

Fair enough, in this instance, what you have smashing is not a planet, but a shockwave from some supposed nearby supernova!

Our sun is not the first generation of star, you know. There have been stars that lived and died before ours.

For the moon, they do have a smash up of a large physical body. The simple question arises, did you see any nearby supernova send a shockwave that started us rotating? Or, is is just that you need that to explain things without creation?

Are you actually asking if someone saw the supernova that occurred before our solar system even existed?

"There’s so much dust that has gathered together that pieces begin to slam into each other, eventually forming asteroids and these are pulled in by the gravity of the spinning star. This goes on for billions of years, with everything bumping and crashing together. Bigger and bigger pieces are formed as the asteroids collide and stick together, all the while they are all spinning in the same direction."

http://www.planetsforkids.org/why-does-the-earth-spin.html

Except they aren't spinning the same direction at all.

First of all, this is contraction due to gravity.

Secondly, the vast majority is spinning in the same direction. Objects that are not are quite rare in the solar system, and their behaviour can be explained by various methods, including impacts. (And do NOT twist my words here - this is not an explanation of what STARTED them spinning, but what caused them to change their spin.)

"
As the planets condense they too have a portion of the system's momentum and as they condense will conserve it, with the same axis as the sun. All the planets can be observed to fit this model, except Uranus and Venus. They both rotate in a different direction than the norm for our system. It is believed that this is because of collisions during their formation that knocked them in a different direction. "

https://www.quora.com/Why-does-the-Earth-rotate

So the cosmic comical crash up derby science invented involves imaginary little molecules on up to asteroids and planets.

And as I said before, this involves a CHANGE of spin, not the BEGINNING of spin.

ecco · Oct 2, 2015

dad said:
The simple question arises, did you see any nearby supernova send a shockwave that started us rotating?

I flushed my toilet and did not see a bright flash and did not feel a shockwave, but the water in the toilet was rotating as it went down the drain.

Was it god working mysteriously?

dad · Oct 2, 2015

KTS said:
The mechanism is quite well understood.

Inside your make believe fairy tale never never land dreamscape invented pasts,,,yes. Of course. Total conjecture and godless twaddle, of course.

We have seen countless examples of things starting to rotate as they contract towards a center point.

Great, so why are planets rotating other ways than in your dream world? In what way does watching a toilet flush and water swirl mean that creation made all the universe like that? You guys should give your collective head a shake.

Our sun is not the first generation of star, you know. There have been stars that lived and died before ours.

No. The sun is the sun. God created it FOR me. For you. For us. That is why it exists. Stars are not the sun, and you do not have a clue how big they are, what they are really all about, or how far they are. Period. Just to get out of the starting gate you would NEED to NOW that time exists where stars are to have distances. You are nowhere close to reaching that simple point yet. Everything you utter is fantasy and baseless regarding the universe and stars. Don't even waste outr time talking unless and until you know whether time exists out there as it does here.

Are you actually asking if someone saw the supernova that occurred before our solar system even existed?

Yes. That shows you made it up, cause you saw nothing. You invented a model of how the universe runs BASED on earth and area, and this present state laws, and fabricated the universe laws you claim from that. Totally worthless.

First of all, this is contraction due to gravity.

Gravity is a near earth present state feature. Whether gravity exists as we know it on earth in the future, you have no idea. Whether it exists as it does here exactly in deep space I dare you to try to prove. You look at things you know not how big or far away, and assume gravity as we know it is doing all that we see done. Pretty lame.

Secondly, the vast majority is spinning in the same direction.

Thankfully God has a sense of humor, even in creation! he made enough spin another way so as to show us that science is a joke and not to be believed! he busted science before it existed!

Objects that are not are quite rare in the solar system, and their behaviour can be explained by various methods, including impacts.

Yeah right, tooth fairies, spaghetti monsters, various smash ups you invent, etc etc. Whatever special pleading you care to invoke to explain things and cannot begin to prove. Pathetic.

(And do NOT twist my words here - this is not an explanation of what STARTED them spinning, but what caused them to change their spin.)

Same difference. For the earlier fantasies you have molecules and smaller imaginary items smashing into each other and causing spin, later you have planets and whatnot doing it. Total imagination. Godless conjecture. A violation of fact and truth and an assault on the Christ of creation.

dad · Oct 2, 2015

ecco said:
I flushed my toilet and did not see a bright flash and did not feel a shockwave, but the water in the toilet was rotating as it went down the drain.

Was it god working mysteriously?

Funny you should mention that!

Justatruthseeker · Oct 2, 2015

Paul of Eugene OR said:
But that is your present understanding of the earth's history.

What were the earliest interpretations of the earth's history we can find? They are those that presuppose an earth aged 6000 to 10000 years.

Therfore, coming to understand that the earth has billions of years of history instead of thousands is NOT a presupposition. It came LAST not first.

No, an ancient interpretation came "first". The interpretation of a young earth came after those in the 3rd century mistranslated "hayah" according to their attempt to justify Jesu's lineage. But the creation of man has nothing to do when the earth was created.

http://godandscience.org/youngearth/old_earth_creationism.html

"

Beginning (re’shît): Hebrew scholar John Sailhamer states, “Since the Hebrew word translated ‘beginning’ refers to an indefinite period of time, we cannot say for certain when God created the world or how long He took to create it. This period could have spanned as much as several billions years, or it could have been much less; the text simply does not tell us how long. It tells us only that God did it during the ‘beginning’ of our universe’s history.”30 Whitefield notes that re’shît does not allow an instantaneous creation. The word suggests a period of time of unstated length which precedes the conditions described by Genesis 1:2. “Genesis 1:1 places no limits on how old the universe may be.”31 C. John Collins suggests that the perfect verb form used in Genesis 1:1 distinguishes “the beginning” from the six-day creation narrative of Genesis 1:3-31, which is written with the wayyiqtol verb form.32 The time period between “the beginning” and the creation week is unstated in the text.
Created (bara): The Hebrew word for “created” (bara) means to create out of nothing. It is a completed verb form, meaning only that the creation was accomplished at some point in the past.
“The heavens and the earth” (ha’shamayim we ha’erets): This Hebrew phrase (known as a merism) means “all the raw materials needed to make sun, planets, stars, nebulae, galaxies, molecules, atoms”33, “the entire universe”34, or “the organized universe, the cosmos.”35 This matches perfectly with the view of the big bang beginning—a cosmological singularity from which all matter, energy, space and time originated, and clearly supports ex nihilo creation as described in Genesis 1:1 and Hebrews 11:3: By faith we understand that the universe was created by the word of God, so that what is seen was not made out of things that are visible."

From the energy of which God (mind / consciousness) is.

"Both young-earth and old-earth creationists believe God created all life. OECs believe God created the earliest primitive micro-organisms on earth approximately 3.8 billion years ago and continued to create life through the “days” of creation (long epochs of time), including all plant life, sea and flying creatures, land animals including primitive bipedal primates, and finally humanity’s actual historical parents, Adam and Eve, God’s “crown-jewel” of creation, made in His image (Imago Dei)."

Although this too is not correct. He created life on 6 distinct occasions after 5 destruction's occirred.

"Young-earth and old-earth views on God’s creation of plant-life reveal significantly different interpretations of Scripture. The young-earth view is well stated by John MacArthur: “He created them as fully mature, fully developed…He did not create just seeds and cells…He made trees with already-mature fruit…The garden itself was created mature, fully functional, and therefore with the appearance of age.”47 But what does Genesis say?

And God said, “Let the earth sprout [dasha] vegetation, plants yielding seed, and fruit trees bearing fruit after their kind, with seeds in them, on the earth,” and it was so. The earth brought forth [yatsa’] vegetation, plants yielding seed according to their own kinds, and trees bearing fruit in which is there seed, each according to its kind.

The old-earth interpretation differs in several important ways. First, the old-earth view posits the sun is already present, having been created “in the beginning,” as part of “the heavens and the earth” (ha’shamayim we ha’erets), as opposed to the young-earth view in which the sun is not created until the fourth day of creation (the day following the creation of plant life). Second, Genesis 1:11 does not literally state that God created vegetation and trees fully formed. Rather, it says that God commanded the earth to sprout vegetation and trees. The Hebrew word translated “sprout” (dasha) means “to cause to sprout or shoot forth,” and “brought forth” (yatsa’) means to “come out or go forth.” There is no mandate that God created fully-formed plants and fruit trees. Third, the Hebrew phrase translated “and it was so” in Genesis 1:3-31 merely indicates the completion of God’s commands. (It is the waw-consecutive form of the imperfect verb “to be” and has the completed action meaning.) This phrase does not mean that the command was achieved immediately. It only indicates completed action (see footnote 34), but not when the action was completed.48 “And it was so” means God’s command, “the sprouting of vegetation, plants yielding seed, and fruit trees bearing fruit,” was fully completed. These completed processes (“plants yielding seed and trees bearing fruit”) require seasons and years, not just 24-hours. Textual evidence, therefore, seems to favor a view much longer than 24 hours."

So really there is no argument at all that a young earth creationist view came first. It is a a view of the 2nd to 3rd century and after. Moses understood when he wrote of "ancient days" - he was not talking about a mere 2,000 years prior. It can't be reconciled with scripture - because it is an incorrect translation of latter days that the earth is young.

EDIT: Plus you still haven't justified why you refuse to apply your cosmological views to only imaginary accelerating twins and not what you claim is an actual accelerating universe?

Justatruthseeker · Oct 2, 2015

But enough avoidance of why the earth rotates - and we know it doesn't rotate according to mainstream theories - since IBEX and Voyager falsified every theoretical model they had of the solar system.

Also those aligned Nebula defy any explanation under mainstream theory of galactic formation.

https://www.spacetelescope.org/news/heic1316/

But all fit well in actual scientific theory (EU).

dad · Oct 2, 2015

Justatruthseeker said:
No, an ancient interpretation came "first". .

Scripture is ancient, and the Ancient of Days is ancient. Any record covering creation would be ancient. I didn't notice any of the apostles of Jesus claiming that there was some distinction is creation week. And Jesus is God and created it all, so He ought to know.

Eph 3:9 - And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ:
Col 1:16 -For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things werecreated by him, and for him:

No one at all. That is hooey. Even the angel talking about it forgot to mention worship Him that created the stars billions of years before the sun and earth...etc'

5 And the angel which I saw stand upon the sea and upon the earth lifted up his hand to heaven, 6 And sware by him that liveth for ever and ever, who created heaven, and the things that therein are, and the earth, and the things that therein are, and the sea, and the things which are therein, that there should be time no longer:

Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, 7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters

Justatruthseeker · Oct 2, 2015

dad said:
Scripture is ancient, and the Ancient of Days is ancient. Any record covering creation would be ancient. I didn't notice any of the apostles of Jesus claiming that there was some distinction is creation week. And Jesus is God and created it all, so He ought to know

No Jesus isn't, but we'll save that for another time. Or maybe not.

No one at all. That is hooey. Even the angel talking about it forgot to mention worship Him that created the stars billions of years before the sun and earth...etc'

That's right - worship Him that created it - not the one He created it through or for.

http://biblehub.com/colossians/1-15.htm
15He is the image of the invisible God, (just as we are the image of God) the firstborn of all creation. (i.e. the first and only thing God directly Himself created - his only-begotten son - because through that son and for him all other things were created - by God's power) 16For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been created through Him and for Him.…

http://biblehub.com/luke/18-19.htm
19And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone.

Because knowing he was not God, but that God worked through him and for him. In defense of those false accusation leveled against him, he replied:

http://biblehub.com/john/5-30.htm
30"I can do nothing on my own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and my judgment is just, because I do not seek my own will, but the will of Him who sent me.

Because knowing he was not God, but that God worked through him and for him. In defense of those false accusation leveled against him, he replied:

"http://biblehub.com/mark/14-56.htm
55Now the chief priests and the whole Council kept trying to obtain testimony against Jesus to put Him to death, and they were not finding any.

Because knowing he was not God, but that God worked through him and for him. In defense of those false accusation leveled against him, he replied:

http://biblehub.com/john/5-18.htm
17But He answered them, "My Father is working until now, and I Myself am working." 18For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God. (the false accusation) 19Therefore Jesus answered and was saying to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, unless it is something He sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, these things the Son also does in like manner.…(his defense against those false accusations of being God, that he was not claiming to be God)

Jesus directly defended himself against that false accusation. Any other misinterpretations of scripture are simply because they misinterpret them - also leveling false accusations against Jesus.

Loudmouth · Oct 2, 2015

AV1611VET said:
What's its binomial?

Or, as I suspect, is it just an unnamed dot on a piece of paper in a game of connect-the-dots?

It is a conclusion drawn from genetic evidence which you refuse to address.

AV1611VET · Oct 2, 2015

Loudmouth said:
It is a conclusion drawn from genetic evidence ...

In other words, an unnamed dot on a piece of paper.

Loudmouth · Oct 2, 2015

AV1611VET said:
In other words, an unnamed dot on a piece of paper.

That's not what I said. Please stop twisting my words.

dad · Oct 2, 2015

Justatruthseeker said:
No Jesus isn't

You don't get a vote as to whether Jesus created all things and is God. Not particularly interested in your opinion either. Jesus and His Father are One.

That's right - worship Him that created it - not the one He created it through or for.

Jesus created all things the bible says six ways from Sunday.

19And Jesus said to him, "Why do you call Me good? No one is good except God alone.

Because knowing he was not God, but that God worked through him and for him.

Not at all. God with us is His name. God coming to earth as a man. Every bit God.

In defense of those false accusation leveled against him, he replied:

http://biblehub.com/john/5-30.htm
30"I can do nothing on my own initiative. As I hear, I judge; and my judgment is just, because I do not seek my own will, but the will of Him who sent me.

He laid down His life no one took it. He limited Himself while here, it is very wrong to claim that means He was not God.
Jesus made it clear He was the I AM. He was here before Abraham. I would suggest you leave your cult while there is hope.

joshua 1 9 · Oct 3, 2015

KTS said:
And if we were to accept that as an answer, wouldn't that be the only answer we'd eve need? What causes people to get sick? Goddidit! And we'd leave it at that, and never learn about hygiene. And we'd live in a world with much more sickness than we have now.

Moses talks a lot about hygiene. At one time the people who followed the teaching of the Bible did much better at avoiding the plague then the people who ignored the teaching we find in the Bible. Although today Science does seem to go beyond the Bible. Science recommends a plant based diet where the Bible allows some meat. Most people do not follow the Bible or Science in their recommendations for healthy living. Christians do tend to have better health and they do tend to live at least 5 years longer then non christians.

joshua 1 9 · Oct 3, 2015

dad said:
You don't get a vote as to whether Jesus created all things and is God. Not particularly interested in your opinion either. Jesus and His Father are One.

Jesus created all things the bible says six ways from Sunday.

Not at all. God with us is His name. God coming to earth as a man. Every bit God.

He laid down His life no one took it. He limited Himself while here, it is very wrong to claim that means He was not God.
Jesus made it clear He was the I AM. He was here before Abraham. I would suggest you leave your cult while there is hope.

Jesus is the Word of God. The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.

Justatruthseeker · Oct 3, 2015

joshua 1 9 said:
Jesus is the Word of God. The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us.

Yes - he is the Word - and it was that first Word God spoke and Jesus (Michael) came into existence. God then created all other things through that Word and for that Word (the only-begotten son - because the Word is the only thing God personally created/spoke into existence). The Word did become flesh and dwelt among us - just God didn't. The Word then took his rightful place at the right hand of his Father - who created him. And one day the Word will return and herald the coming of God - who will then dwell with mankind. No one has seen God at any time, He has been hidden since the very beginning.

And this is why billions will be lost at the end. Believing Jesus was God - they will fall down and worship before the feet of the wicked one when he comes claiming to be Christ - and by extension in their beliefs - God. He does not come for the lost - but for those who believe. http://biblehub.com/matthew/24-24.htm

Jesus defended himself repeatedly against false accusations that he was God.

http://biblehub.com/john/5-18.htm
17But He answered them, "My Father is working until now, and I Myself am working." 18For this reason therefore the Jews were seeking all the more to kill Him, because He not only was breaking the Sabbath, but also was calling God His own Father, making Himself equal with God. (the false accusation) 19Therefore Jesus answered and was saying to them, "Truly, truly, I say to you, the Son can do nothing of Himself, unless it is something He sees the Father doing; for whatever the Father does, these things the Son also does in like manner.…(his defense against those false accusations of being God, that he was not claiming to be God)

Jesus directly defended himself against that false accusation. Any other misinterpretations of scripture are simply because they misinterpret them - also leveling false accusations against Jesus. Accusations of godhood that Jesus repeatedly denied. That belief crept into the church in the 3rd century.

We know all of their accusations against Jesus were false. Why then should we accept that same accusation Jesus denied simply because he is not around personally to defend himself any more? Yet his words of defense against false claims of being equal to God in order to put him to death were written for all to read.

Justatruthseeker · Oct 3, 2015

KTS said:
And if we were to accept that as an answer, wouldn't that be the only answer we'd eve need? What causes people to get sick? Goddidit! And we'd leave it at that, and never learn about hygiene. And we'd live in a world with much more sickness than we have now. Such an answer would mean we'd never develop the tools that we have that allow us instantaneous communication around the world, or any of the other things we use to help save lives and enrich our society.

Is that a world you'd want to live in?

The fact that you are able to even read this thread is proof that being satisfied with "Goddidit" is a poor answer.

Only "You" are claiming God did it when people get sick - or people that feel the need to blame someone.

God instituted laws of cleanliness - Almost the entire law of Moses concerns foods that are unclean - cleanliness practices - hygiene. Laws given to help prevent that sickness.

Tornadoes - Hurricanes - etc are not acts of God. They are natural events.

There is only one being in control of this planet - if you feel the need to blame someone - blame him. Stop trying the "Goddidit" spiel when He in fact didn't do anything except institute laws to prevent that sickness - hygiene practices.

http://biblehub.com/1_john/5-19.htm

AV1611VET · Oct 3, 2015

Justatruthseeker said:
Tornadoes - Hurricanes - etc are not acts of God. They are natural events.

Then why do scientists blame them on Jesus Christ (El Niño) and some feminine alter-ego (La Niña)?

Unless, of course, a Christian tries to attribute the weather to God.

Psalm 83:15 So persecute them with thy tempest, and make them afraid with thy storm.

Then they're all over us, trying to sterilize that passage.

Justatruthseeker · Oct 3, 2015

AV1611VET said:
Then why do scientists blame them on Jesus Christ (El Niño) and some feminine alter-ego (La Niña)?

Because they too prefer to level false accusations against him.

Unless, of course, a Christian tries to attribute the weather to God.

Psalm 83:15 So persecute them with thy tempest, and make them afraid with thy storm.

Then they're all over us, trying to sterilize that passage.

Because all things were created by God - so all things belong to Him. And when God chooses to control the weather - you will know it. It will like the pillar of fire and whirlwind - not behave naturally.

http://biblehub.com/exodus/13-21.htm

Why don't you add a little context into that.

http://biblehub.com/psalms/83-15.htm
12Who said, "Let us possess for ourselves The pastures of God." 13O my God, make them like the whirling dust, Like chaff before the wind. 14Like fire that burns the forest And like a flame that sets the mountains on fire,… 15So pursue them with Your tempest And terrify them with Your storm. 16Fill their faces with dishonor, That they may seek Your name, O LORD.… 17Let them be ashamed and dismayed forever, And let them be humiliated and perish, 18That they may know that You alone, whose name is the LORD, Are the Most High over all the earth.

So we find it is but a supplication to God - not anything God is telling us He did. Strike one AV for taking things out of context.

Why does the earth rotate?

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