Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Because you've been mischaracterizing my posts and arguing with me about them.
Good for you, I guess? My point still stands though.
When they are just doing their job?
Well it seems I come across examples of this everyday...just crossed another one.
WATCH: ICE Sued After Videos Capture Pastor Shot With ‘Chemical Pellets’ at Peaceful Protest
I bet that pastor was attacking them or someth....
https://www.reddit.com/r/illinois/s/09n0juVcj3
If there are people having trouble understanding why people dislike how iCE is doing their work, I'm hoping folks will be willing to share some examples. I'll do my bit when I can.
Strange. Because Obamas numbers were actually quite high. So that doesn't make senseI suspect some of the antipathy towards ICE is the shock of actual enforcement of immigration law by ICE, especially in cities where for many years or decades ICE enforcement was so negligible as to be invisible and unheard of in those cities.
Hmmm. I wonder if it was morning how they managed to carry out thwir activities then. In as much as they were never noticed but did their work without trying to intimidate and scare. Because there are certainly stats of neighbouring counties that show there was ice activity over the last few decades.Indeed, LA County Mayor said ICE “was not present” and “was not present for so long.” They simply were accustomed to minimal to invisible existence of ICE for a long time.
So the bolded supports my position, “neighboring counties” doesn’t reveal anything of other counties.Hmmm. I wonder if it was morning how they managed to carry out thwir activities then. In as much as they were never noticed but did their work without trying to intimidate and scare. Because there are certainly stats of neighbouring counties that show there was ice activity over the last few decades.
Strange. Because Obamas numbers were actually quite high. So that doesn't make sense
Strange. Because Obamas numbers were actually quite high. So that doesn't make sense
Is it though?(Biden's admin is another story)
This theory falls apart in the light of the above data. It comes down to rhetoric and the methods employed by ICE.At the risk of sounding cynical...
I think the superficial answer is the accurate one on this.
An old white guy (perceived as having racist views on extraneous issues) deporting non-white people elicits a different reaction from some folks than if a younger non-white guy (perceived to have more progressive values) deports non-white people.
Were abuses of power and unprofessional conduct from agents happening during the raids and round-ups that happened under Obama? Almost certainly. But they would've been much less visible, as the prevalence of the "HD video recording device in everyone's pocket" was much lower back then, so you didn't have a hundred people standing around filming every interaction and uploading it to where millions of people could see it.
Is it though?
View attachment 371592
A heck of a lot more people were deported under Biden than under Obama (or Trump).
This theory falls apart in the light of the above data. It comes down to rhetoric and the methods employed by ICE.
You're welcome to show evidence of that.So the bolded supports my position, “neighboring counties” doesn’t reveal anything of other counties.
^^^^Has absolutely not germane to my comment of, “I suspect some of the antipathy towards ICE is the shock of actual enforcement of immigration law by ICE, especially in cities where for many years or decades ICE enforcement was so negligible as to be invisible and unheard of in those cities.”
I’ll proceed now and address your faulty assumption by stating Obama’s “numbers were actually quite high” can logically co-exist with my statement “I suspect some of the antipathy towards ICE is the shock of actual enforcement of immigration law by ICE, especially in cities where for many years or decades ICE enforcement was so negligible as to be invisible and unheard of in those cities.”
Obama’s “quite high” numbers aren’t contradictory to my bolded statement, neither are the two inconsistent.
Make comment makes perfect sense when one comprehends Obama’s “quite high” numbers weren’t predominantly and/or substantially from specific areas. It’s your confusing high numbers and by bolded comments as mutually exclusive “that doesn’t make sense.”
"almost certainly" he says....with 0 evidence.Were abuses of power and unprofessional conduct from agents happening during the raids and round-ups that happened under Obama? Almost certainly. But they would've been much less visible, as the prevalence of the "HD video recording device in everyone's pocket" was much lower back then, so you didn't have a hundred people standing around filming every interaction and uploading it to where millions of people could see it.
If there wasn't, that would make the ICE agency under Obama literally only law enforcement agency in the country that didn't have cases of abuse of power or complaints about aggressive behavior."almost certainly" he says....with 0 evidence.
Who exactly hates ICE?When they are just doing their job?
Well it seems I come across examples of this everyday...just crossed another one.
WATCH: ICE Sued After Videos Capture Pastor Shot With ‘Chemical Pellets’ at Peaceful Protest
I bet that pastor was attacking them or someth....
https://www.reddit.com/r/illinois/s/09n0juVcj3
If there are people having trouble understanding why people dislike how iCE is doing their work, I'm hoping folks will be willing to share some examples. I'll do my bit when I can.
When that was an option, sure. If you've been handed a tool for the job that's easier to use, why not make use of it? Trump's "at the border" and "away from the border" numbers also plummeted for the few months that he had that tool at his disposal in 2020It would appear that Biden's are mostly under the "covid emergency" category...
Not once the COVID emergency option (Title 42) was sunsetted. That part at the end of the graph was still Biden, who was President through the whole of 2024."At the border" and "away from the border" appear to be far lower.
This would fall under the "methods" part of my post.Those would be the much more visible types of apprehensions people are upset about, correct?
As far as public visibility (and people seeing it on social media), the covid related ones would be far less visible I would think.
This was really only relevant for 2020/2021. Trump was still President in 2020. By 2022/2023 - and certainly by 2024 - concerns about COVID exposure were falling off, and as I pointed out, the COVID emergency provisions expired in 2023 (and were, in fact, something that the left did voice concern over). And the George Floyd protests were pretty well wrapped up by the end of 2021, if not sooner.My reason for thinking that is because the kind of people who would want to watchdog ICE and alert the pubic to their potential misdeeds would be the same kind of people who would've been more inclined to be staying home and socially distancing during covid, fair to say? Also compounded by the fact that the social justice activists had a different law enforcement related social awareness endeavor they were focused on.
Reader's digest version:
Biden's deportations were less visible/less scrutinized due to
- It was done in the name of covid (any draconian measures done in the name of covid were embraced by progressives)
- Progressives were far more likely to be staying at home to avoid viral exposure, and the ones who weren't, were protesting Local PD abuses in the wake of the George Floyd killing
So ICE-related matters took a back seat
Maybe for the first part (the social distancing and staying home during covid), but I still remember a lot of the "law enforcement excessive force" activism seemed to still be more heavily centered around Local PDs well into 2022 and 2023.This was really only relevant for 2020/2021. Trump was still President in 2020. By 2022/2023 - and certainly by 2024 - concerns about COVID exposure were falling off, and as I pointed out, the COVID emergency provisions expired in 2023 (and were, in fact, something that the left did voice concern over). And the George Floyd protests were pretty well wrapped up by the end of 2021, if not sooner.
I'd also note that there weren't significant protests against ICE during Trump's first term either. So, what changed? Trump is still an old white dude, but he and his circle have ramped up their rhetoric, and ICE has employed increasingly draconian and disturbing tactics in highly visible ways.
Maybe. But that's a pretty long way from your original argument now, which was:For progressives to "go hard" on anything a Democratic president is doing with regards to immigration, the country would have to be devoid of any other "high value political targets"
I agree that left-leaning people are less likely to protest things done by left-leaning administrations (just like right-leaning people are less likely to protest actions by right-leaning administrations). But the lack of any significant protests against Trump's immigration policies during his first administration (which were more or less identical to Obama's) makes it pretty clear that the problem isn't just Trump. And if we look at what Trump and his officials are saying, and what ICE is doing, there are some obvious differences to how things were done in 2017-2020 that I think make for a far simpler explanation for the current vitriol.At the risk of sounding cynical...
I think the superficial answer is the accurate one on this.
An old white guy (perceived as having racist views on extraneous issues) deporting non-white people elicits a different reaction from some folks than if a younger non-white guy (perceived to have more progressive values) deports non-white people.
I agree that left-leaning people are less likely to protest things done by left-leaning administrations (just like right-leaning people are less likely to protest actions by right-leaning administrations). But the lack of any significant protests against Trump's immigration policies during his first administration (which were more or less identical to Obama's) makes it pretty clear that the problem isn't just Trump. And if we look at what Trump and his officials are saying, and what ICE is doing, there are some obvious differences to how things were done in 2017-2020 that I think make for a far simpler explanation for the current vitriol.
The picture of an 8-year-old handcuffed by ICE is fake and was created using artificial intelligence
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?