Why do people fear/hate Ellen White?

[freeindeed2]

The same reason people hate the bible: because it shows how wicked they are!

Interesting that you equate her with the Bible as a standard for determining who is and who isn't wicked. It speaks volumes.

Just for the record, I don't hate her and I certainly don't fear her.

 

[djconklin]

Originally Posted by OntheDL
The same reason people hate the bible: because it shows how wicked they are!

Interesting that you equate her with the Bible as a standard for determining who is and who isn't wicked. It speaks volumes.

In practical, down-to-earth terms her writings do do that. But, if you are assuming that he is only using EGW to determine who is wicked then I believe that you are in error--for she always points to the Bible--that is our ultimate rule and guide.

 

[freeindeed2]

Apparently that isn't the question.

"Late in 1980, a professional survey was conducted which enabled researchers to discover, among other things, the differences between the Christian attitudes and behaviors of Seventh-day Adventists who regularly read Ellen G. White's books and those who do not. The results were very revealing. Eighty-five percent of those who read Mrs. White's books indicated that they had an intimate relationship with Jesus Christ, while only 59 percent of the non-readers did. Eighty-two percent of the readers had the assurance that they were "right with God," while only 59 percent of the nonreaders did. Daily personal Bible study was a habit with 82 percent of those who read Ellen White's writings regularly, while only 47 percent of those who did not read Ellen White studied their Bible regularly."

Found at http://www.whiteestate.org/issues/whitelie.html -- the study they refer to is: Des Cummings, Jr. and Roger L. Dudley, "A Comparision of the Christian Attitudes and Behaviors Between Those Adventist Church Members Who Regularly Read Ellen White Books and Those Who Do Not," April, 1982. Available from the Ellen G. White Estate.

Very interesting time-frame for doing this study after the whole Glacier View fiasco and the witch hunt that followed.

Has there been any follow-up study done at a time that wasn't centered around a conflict that penetrated to the depths of Adventism over a doctrinal issue such as the Sanctuary and the Investigative Judgment, the only unique doctrine of the SDA church as outlined in the writings of EGW?

 

[freeindeed2]

In practical, down-to-earth terms her writings do do that. But, if you are assuming that he is only using EGW to determine who is wicked then I believe that you are in error--for she always points to the Bible--that is our ultimate rule and guide.

But only as defined and interpreted through her writings.

 

[sentipente]

In practical, down-to-earth terms her writings do do that. But, if you are assuming that he is only using EGW to determine who is wicked then I believe that you are in error--for she always points to the Bible--that is our ultimate rule and guide.

Wrong on both points. 1. EGW never points to the Bible. She points to the Creator. 2. The Creator Himself should be our ultimate rule and guide.

 

[reddogs]

Wrong on both points. 1. EGW never points to the Bible. She points to the Creator. 2. The Creator Himself should be our ultimate rule and guide.

The Bible shows the Creator, as we say in the islands 'same dog/puppy'....

 

[freeindeed2]

The Bible shows the Creator, as we say in the islands 'same dog/puppy'....

"You search the Scriptures because you think they give you eternal life. But the Scriptures point to me! Yet you refuse to come to me to receive this life." Jo 5:39, 40

If they were the 'same dog/puppy' they could have found eternal life in the Scriptures, for they were already searching those.

 

[Jimlarmore]

It seems that the critique of Ellen White goes far beyond just disagreement, it goes to the realm of making her look as a extremist or mentally unhinged writer. Anyone that reads her writtings knows that is not the case, yet it seems that many hate and fear what is in her writtings.

Thanks Rojo for this thread,

I am not an EGW scholar at all. I have only read the Great Controversy and the Desire of Ages. I am currently reading Patriachs and Prophets. From all I can gather I am impressed with sister Whites loving tone and style to her writings. You can tell she really loves her Lord and is very concerned for those who would be reading her writings. Several times she directly addresses the reader of her words to look to Jesus and to study the Bible for themselves.

I have read many things in the past that has been very critical of her and her writings. After being blessed the way I have by reading her writings myself I find it hard to read the critics words with an open mind anymore. Just as I have problems with Bible critics who put the scriptures down I have problems with those who nit pick sister White's writings. Don't get me wrong I have never placed her writings on the same par with the Bible that is not what I am saying. It's just I can feel the workings of the Holy Spirit on her writings as I can on the scriptures.

God Bless
Jim Larmore

 

[djconklin]

Originally Posted by djconklin

In practical, down-to-earth terms her writings do do that. But, if you are assuming that he is only using EGW to determine who is wicked then I believe that you are in error--for she always points to the Bible--that is our ultimate rule and guide.

Wrong on both points. 1. EGW never points to the Bible. She points to the Creator. 2. The Creator Himself should be our ultimate rule and guide.

Since God inspired the writers of the Bible and in it He specifically states that His thoughts are not our thoughts it seems logical to assume that the Written Word is His word to us.

Romans 15:4 For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope.

2 Timothy 3:15 And that from a child thou hast known the holy scriptures, which are able to make thee wise unto salvation through faith which is in Christ Jesus.

As for EGW, you are also in error:

Thus closed the last sermon Ellen White was to make at a General Conference session. She moved away from the desk and started to her seat, then turned and came back, picked up the Bible from which she had read, opened it, and held it out on extended hands that trembled with age. She admonished, "Brethren and Sisters, I commend unto you this Book" (reported by W. A. Spicer, then secretary of the General Conference, in The Spirit of Prophecy in the Advent Movement, p. 30). {6BIO 197.5}

 

[djconklin]

Originally Posted by djconklin

In practical, down-to-earth terms her writings do do that. But, if you are assuming that he is only using EGW to determine who is wicked then I believe that you are in error--for she always points to the Bible--that is our ultimate rule and guide.

But only as defined and interpreted through her writings.

It is interesting that she never taught that.

 

[NightEternal]

Very interesting time-frame for doing this study after the whole Glacier View fiasco and the witch hunt that followed.

Has there been any follow-up study done at a time that wasn't centered around a conflict that penetrated to the depths of Adventism over a doctrinal issue such as the Sanctuary and the Investigative Judgment, the only unique doctrine of the SDA church as outlined in the writings of EGW?

I would also be interested in seeing such a follow-up study.

 

[djconklin]

and the witch hunt that followed.

Assumes facts that aren't in evidence.

Has there been any follow-up study done at a time that wasn't centered around a conflict that penetrated to the depths of Adventism over a doctrinal issue such as the Sanctuary and the Investigative Judgment, the only unique doctrine of the SDA church as outlined in the writings of EGW?

We use the Bible, not Ellen White for that teaching:

http://www.harvesthands.org/judgment1.htm
http://www.harvesthands.org/judgment2.htm

Why the need to misrepresent?

 

[sentipente]

DJ, do you really think that in all her years EGW only commended one thing? Where do you find the phrase "Written Word?" Jesus is the Word. Arouse from slumber.

 

[djconklin]

DJ, do you really think that in all her years EGW only commended one thing?

I didn't say she did or didn't--do you have proof that she commended other things?

Where do you find the phrase "Written Word?" Jesus is the Word.

Jesus is whom the written word points to (selected texts):


Luke 4:21 And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.

John 2:22 When therefore he was risen from the dead, his disciples remembered that he had said this unto them; and they believed the scripture, and the word which Jesus had said.

John 7:42 Hath not the scripture said, That Christ cometh of the seed of David, and out of the town of Bethlehem, where David was?

John 13:18 I speak not of you all: I know whom I have chosen: but that the scripture may be fulfilled, He that eateth bread with me hath lifted up his heel against me.

John 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

John 19:24 They said therefore among themselves, Let us not rend it, but cast lots for it, whose it shall be: that the scripture might be fulfilled, which saith, They parted my raiment among them, and for my vesture they did cast lots. These things therefore the soldiers did.

John 19:28 After this, Jesus knowing that all things were now accomplished, that the scripture might be fulfilled, saith, I thirst.

John 19:36 For these things were done, that the scripture should be fulfilled, A bone of him shall not be broken.

John 19:37 And again another scripture saith, They shall look on him whom they pierced.

John 20:9 For as yet they knew not the scripture, that he must rise again from the dead.

 

[mva1985]

2 Chronicles 36:16 (NIV)

16 But they mocked God's messengers, despised his words and scoffed at his prophets until the wrath of the LORD was aroused against his people and there was no remedy.

 

[djconklin]

Excellant! Thanks for pointing out that verse!

 

[freeindeed2]

It is interesting that she never taught that.

Then why is it practiced by the SDA church. Her writings are considered authoritative. Do you have any examples where an interpretation of Scripture is accepted by the church that is counter to her writings?

 

[mva1985]

Excellant! Thanks for pointing out that verse!

DJ,

I would say the Lord showed it to me. I was actually searching for another verse and I found that one. It makes a profound statement.

 

[NightEternal]

Why always the need to equate questioning EGW with mocking, scoffing or attacking EGW? This is not FAF people. Get a grip.

And when are we going to see that debate subforum up and running BTW?

 

[freeindeed2]

Assumes facts that aren't in evidence.

Are you of the opinion that no pastors were fired, pressured to resign, or otherwise forced to seek other employment subsequent to the meetings that took place at Glacier View concerning Ford's presentation of his study?

Would you care to go on record than NO ONE lost their job over it? (other than Ford, obviously...but even that is ONE)

Or did you just not like the term 'witch hunt' to describe what took place? I have heard first hand from several that were fired or forced to resign, and there are lists of many others.

Looking forward to your answer.

We use the Bible, not Ellen White for that teaching:

http://www.harvesthands.org/judgment1.htm
http://www.harvesthands.org/judgment2.htm

Why the need to misrepresent?

Yes. I admit the church has definitely gotten better and doubled its efforts in order to appear that it derives its doctrines from the Bible alone.

Would you please give a link to where the doctrine of the IJ existed prior to EGW and the early Advent Movement, or some kind of evidence. Thanks.