Why do Christians have trouble with accepting Evolution?

Why do Christians have trouble with accepting Evolution?

Because mankind is clearly devolving. I don't see any other way to explain hipsters . .

Extraneous said:

Said the guy who sits in an envoronment of toxic waste and pollution, created by science, as he types away on his computer

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Those things are created by science? Are you sure? Science is nothing more than knowledge. People other than scientists decide how that knowledge is employed.

SteveB28 said:

Those things are created by science? Are you sure? Science is nothing more than knowledge. People other than scientists decide how that knowledge is employed.

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That's not entirely true. You again exult science above mans folly, as if it were holy, like God who alone is truth, just, and infallible. Science needs money to operate, and so they misuse that knowledge in order to preach fear mongering over things like global warming for example. No better way to rake in the financial backers than to create propaganda that politicians can use, and willing to pay for as well. Same with ToE, its nothing more than knowledge, but people misuse it.
Not to mention, scientists can follow a false doctrine just as other people can, and thats what ToE is, a false doctrine.

Extraneous said:

That's not entirely true. You again exult science above mans folly, as if it were holy, like God who alone is truth, just, and infallible. Science needs money to operate, and so they misuse that knowledge in order to preach fear mongering over things like global warming for example. No better way to rake in the financial backers than to create propaganda that politicians can use, and willing to pay for as well. Same with ToE, its nothing more than knowledge, but people misuse it.
Not to mention, scientists can follow a false doctrine just as other people can, and thats what ToE is, a false doctrine.

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You don't really have an idea about the world of science and how it operates.

But that's not unusual. The religiously fundamental are often in your position.

They attempt to besmirch science and scientists (except when it meets their needs of course) and they routinely replace evidence-based decision making with dogma.

SteveB28 said:

You don't really have an idea about the world of science and how it operates.

But that's not unusual. The religiously fundamental are often in your position.

They attempt to besmirch science and scientists (except when it meets their needs of course) and they routinely replace evidence-based decision making with dogma.

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I understand the ways of the world pretty well. I understand politics, and i understand also that science is not holy like you are preaching it to be. You are deluded to think its holy. Its not separate from mans folly, but is very much a part of it. As a human i can say this is true, but as a Christian i must say it even more. To say that science is above mans folly, and above his politics, deception and false doctrines, this is to put science where God alone sits. Science is anti Christ in that way.

Extraneous said:

No

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You just said:

For all we know those Churches destroyed good doctrine. Im not ready to say they preserved anything.

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So since you can't trust Christians who came before you to have preserved anything, then you can't trust the Bible since it's only because of them that you have a Bible.

That isn't a matter of debate. That's a matter of what is hard fact. Without Christians who existed prior to you you would not have a Bible to read.

-CryptoLutheran

ViaCrucis said:

You just said:


So since you can't trust Christians who came before you to have preserved anything, then you can't trust the Bible since it's only because of them that you have a Bible.

That isn't a matter of debate. That's a matter of what is hard fact. Without Christians who existed prior to you you would not have a Bible to read.

-CryptoLutheran

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I exalt Christ and Gods word. I know nothing of anything else.

Extraneous said:

I exalt on Christ and Gods word. I know nothing of anything else.

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And without Christians who came before you, you would know nothing of Christ or God's word.

-CryptoLutheran

Extraneous said:

I exalt Christ and Gods word. I know nothing of anything else.

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Oh, but you just boasted to me of knowing many things. I don't think you do, but that was your boast.

Which is the true claim please?

Christ alone. It a state on mind.

Philippians 3:12 Not that I have already attained, or am already perfected; but I press on, that I may lay hold of that for which Christ Jesus has also laid hold of me.13 Brethren, I do not count myself to have apprehended; but one thing I do,forgetting those things which are behind and reaching forward to those things which are ahead, 14 I press toward the goal for the prize of the upward call of God in Christ Jesus.

15 Therefore let us, as many as are mature, have this mind; and if in anything you think otherwise, God will reveal even this to you. 16 Nevertheless, to the degree that we have already attained, let us walk by the same rule, let us be of the same mind.

Our Citizenship in Heaven
17 Brethren, join in following my example, and note those who so walk, as you have us for a pattern. 18 For many walk, of whom I have told you often, and now tell you even weeping, that they are the enemies of the cross of Christ:19 whose end is destruction, whose god is their belly, and whose glory is in their shame—who set their mind on earthly things. 20 For our citizenship is in heaven, from which we also eagerly wait for the Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ, 21 who will transform our lowly body that it may be conformed to His glorious body, according to the working by which He is able even to subdue all things to Himself.

SteveB28 said:

Oh, but you just boasted to me of knowing many things. I don't think you do, but that was your boast.

Which is the true claim please?

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You misunderstand. Just as people misunderstand what the apostle Paul says in his writings. I follow him, therefore i should expect the same thing i guess. Paul knew many things, but its a state of mind im referring to, it about worship of God alone, and glorifying God alone. The natural man cannot receive the things of God. They are spiritually discerned.


1 Corinthians 2:2 For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.

ViaCrucis said:

And without Christians who came before you, you would know nothing of Christ or God's word.

-CryptoLutheran

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1 Corinthians 2:2 For I determined to know nothing among you except Jesus Christ, and Him crucified.

1 Corinthians 1:10 Now I plead with you, brethren, by the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you all speak the same thing, and that there be no divisions among you, but that you be perfectly joined together in the same mind and in the same judgment. 11 For it has been declared to me concerning you, my brethren, by those of Chloe’s household, that there are contentions among you. 12 Now I say this, that each of you says, “I am of Paul,” or “I am of Apollos,” or “I am of Cephas,” or “I am of Christ.” 13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?

14 I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius, 15 lest anyone should say that I had baptized in my own name. 16 Yes, I also baptized the household of Stephanas. Besides, I do not know whether I baptized any other. 17 For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel, not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of no effect.

Christ the Power and Wisdom of God
18 For the message of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. 19 For it is written:

“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
And bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.”

20 Where is the wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the disputer of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of this world? 21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world through wisdom did not know God, it pleased God through the foolishness of the message preached to save those who believe. 22 For Jews request a sign, and Greeks seek after wisdom; 23 but we preach Christ crucified, to the Jews a stumbling block and to the Greeks foolishness, 24 but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God. 25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

Glory Only in the Lord
26 For you see your calling, brethren, that not many wise according to the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called. 27 But God has chosen the foolish things of the world to put to shame the wise, and God has chosen the weak things of the world to put to shame the things which are mighty; 28 and the base things of the world and the things which are despised God has chosen, and the things which are not, to bring to nothing the things that are, 29 that no flesh should glory in His presence. 30 But of Him you are in Christ Jesus, who became for us wisdom from God—and righteousness and sanctification and redemption— 31 that, as it is written, “He who glories, let him glory in the Lord.”

Number 3 -- I give you the "non atheist" option of claiming "God did it" helping you out so you can get that "pile of dirt" to be a bit less daunting. But to be honest - - you must admit that as atheist you have to go with "pile of dirt will sure enough turn into a horse over time..." rather than "God planted amoebas on earth - the first eukarytoes and then all life evolved from that".

See it again --

3. Are you familiar with the "pile of dirt will sure enough turn into a horse over time - given a sufficiently large pile of dirt and a sufficiently long period of time filled with just-so stories" form of evolution? Or do you insist that God came here and scattered amoebas around to get things started?

The T.E.'s here DO have that second option - but as a "purist" - as an "atheist evolutionist" you don't.

There is no other Atheist "start" from that big bang onward - to the accretion disk of the solar system from which earth was formed -- right to the rabbit and sure-enough "horse" -- given a sufficiently large pile of dirt and a sufficiently long period of time.

And we all know it.

SteveB28 said:

Again, the theory of evolution says nothing about the origins of life, nor about the Big Bang.

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Your argument of the form "ignore that detail" ... "ignore the bigger picture that we are in fact claiming that a pile of dirt turns into a rabbit" -- is simply a "necessity" on your part - since the bigger picture reveals the flaw in your doctrine in such glaring terms, ---obvious EVEN for the low-information readers (whoever they may be).

The T.E. claim is that GOD - brings the bacteria and amoeba here by divine creation and THEN lets Darwin take over.

DARWIN said that such an idea is STILL a total denial of Christianity - because in fact Ex 20:11 IS NOT "another way to say... evolutionism's doctrine on origins - did it"

Extraneous said:

Im glad that some Christians understand science and question ToE, i however dont need to argue any of it because i have Pauls words which teach that we are to be holy, separate from the world, and to put away division. Anything worldly that divides us is our enemy .That alone makes ToE an enemy of the cross.

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Indeed - Christians PREFER science to the junk-science blind-faith religion of evolutionism.

BobRyan said:

Number 3 -- I give you the "non atheist" option of claiming "God did it" helping you out so you can get that "pile of dirt" to be a bit less daunting. But to be honest - - you must admit that as atheist you have to go with "pile of dirt will sure enough turn into a horse over time..." rather than "God planted amoebas on earth - the first eukarytoes and then all life evolved from that".

See it again --

3. Are you familiar with the "pile of dirt will sure enough turn into a horse over time - given a sufficiently large pile of dirt and a sufficiently long period of time filled with just-so stories" form of evolution? Or do you insist that God came here and scattered amoebas around to get things started?

The T.E.'s here DO have that second option - but as a "purist" - as an "atheist evolutionist" you don't.

There is no other Atheist "start" from that big bang onward - to the accretion disk of the solar system from which earth was formed -- right to the rabbit and sure-enough "horse" -- given a sufficiently large pile of dirt and a sufficiently long period of time.

And we all know it.



Your argument of the form "ignore that detail" ... "ignore the bigger picture that we are in fact claiming that a pile of dirt turns into a rabbit" -- is simply a "necessity" on your part - since the bigger picture reveals the flaw in your doctrine in such glaring terms, ---obvious EVEN for the low-information readers (whoever they may be).

The T.E. claim is that GOD - brings the bacteria and amoeba here by divine creation and THEN lets Darwin take over.

DARWIN said that such an idea is STILL a total denial of Christianity - because in fact Ex 20:11 IS NOT "another way to say... evolutionism's doctrine on origins - did it"

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Why do you insist on using PRATT strawmen like this ridiculous "pile of dirt" you keep going on about? Who do you think you're convincing?

BobRyan said:

Indeed - Christians PREFER science to the junk-science blind-faith religion of evolutionism.

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Yes, if it divides us then it should be considered rubbish.

Armoured said:

Why do you insist on using PRATT strawmen like this ridiculous "pile of dirt" you keep going on about? Who do you think you're convincing?

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Why do you insist on division rather than unity? ToE is not truth, its just a fallible theory. Some of it may be true but that doesn't mean its all true. Why would you cling to a fallible scientific theory, instead of Christ alone, undivided?

Again, the theory of evolution says nothing about the origins of life, nor about the Big Bang.[/QUOTE]

It does have to do with the origins of man, and life. It says life evolved from one form into another, over millions of years. ToE posters play with words, their arguments are framed only to argue. They use a lot of nonsense to argue nonsense.[/QUOTE]

True - it claims that the origins of all life that you see today -- is not only some very simple single-celled life form in the untestable only-imagined-past ... but in the atheist model it is "A pile of dirt" that will "sure enough turn into a rabbit given a sufficiently large pile of dirt - and a sufficiently long period of time filled with improbable just-so-stories".

BOTH the atheist and the T.E. however argue that "a single celled animal will -- sure enough -- turn into a rabbit over time no matter the impossibility of it -- given a sufficiently talented long period of time filled with improbable just-so-stories"

The idea that they present in that second case is that believing in such fiction, such mythology is well worth the glorious "hole-in-the-ground" ending that it promises to all - as the "UPSIDE" of that religion... and it is well worth the lake-of-fire-Rev20 ending as the "downside" of that option if it is in fact - wrong to believe such fiction about dirt and rabbits.

Even though abiogenesis and even the big bang idea are also evolution 'theories', the ToE is about the origin of species specifically.
But an atheist evolutionist has no other option than to subscribe to evolution in every sense.

Hieronymus said:

Even though abiogenesis and even the big bang idea are also evolution 'theories', the ToE is about the origin of species specifically.
But an atheist evolutionist has no other option than to subscribe to evolution in every sense.

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Abiogenesis and the Big Bang are not "evolutionary theories", and the Big Bang was first postulated by a Catholic priest.