why didn't god forgive us without Jesus?

[domi]

Jesus is the son of god aka god and he died to forgive our sins because when he was sent down by god *himself very confusing* it was because god was ready for forgive us. But if Jesus was god then why would he have to die to forgive us? If he had it in his mind to forgive us then why doesn't he just do that without having to sacrifice himself or n e thing else for that matter........ Talking about forgiving sins what sins have been forgiven and or changed science Jesus died for us. As far as i know from the nice life application bible aka the best bible on the face of the planet..... God punished us by making woman go though child birth and making them subordinate to men and making men work for a living.....which is exaclty what's still going on yah? so what's changed?

 

[Sketcher]

The sins had to be paid for. We could never pay, so Jesus came to pay the price Himself.

I'm not sure why Christians aren't free from the original curses on earth - but we will go to Heaven someday, where the curse no longer applies. Without Jesus this would not have been possible.

Here's a thought though: Jesus, though pure as pure can be, had to suffer and die.

" Remember the words I spoke to you: ‘No servant is greater than his master.’ If they persecuted me, they will persecute you also. If they obeyed my teaching, they will obey yours also. " - John 15:20

 

[Macca]

Jesus is the son of god aka god and he died to forgive our sins because when he was sent down by god *himself very confusing* it was because god was ready for forgive us. But if Jesus was god then why would he have to die to forgive us? If he had it in his mind to forgive us then why doesn't he just do that without having to sacrifice himself or n e thing else for that matter........ Talking about forgiving sins what sins have been forgiven and or changed science Jesus died for us. As far as i know from the nice life application bible aka the best bible on the face of the planet..... God punished us by making woman go though child birth and making them subordinate to men and making men work for a living.....which is exaclty what's still going on yah? so what's changed?

God has made the rules of the universe; including the boundaries for Satan.
God decreed that the wages of sin is death, so therefore someone had to die for sin; someone who didn't deserve to die.
If God doesn't obey the rules, then how can He expect anyone else to?
Macca.

 

[snoochface]

I think it's because we had to see the evidence of God's willingness to sacrifice for us, so we could better understand and appreciate his love for us. If he had just decided to forgive us, what would be our evidence of that? What would make us appreciate or even believe in it? Jesus' death and resurrection helps us believe in God's power and his desire that we be reconciled to him. It's a physical, tangible thing of which we have evidence, and it also helps us bring other people to God.

 

[mannysee]

Hi,

In Isiah chapter 53, there is a verse towards the end which says, "You (God) will see the travail (great pain) of his (Christ upon the cross) soul and be satisfied".
This suggests that God needs to be fully satisfied that the penalty for sin (which is breaking God's laws) is met. God is just, holy, and will judge the whole world.
We know that those who sit in the position of a judge in the courts of law are there to punish lawbreakers. Those who break the law must be judged, they can't just be let off scott free. What an outcry there would be if this happened! and you probably know or have read instances where people have been let off or the punishment has not met the crime, and the public has been in uproar over it. So, as we all are sinners by nature, it implies that left to ourselves, in due time God would sit as judge, and judge us in a righteous manner, as his office demands. The reason why Christ died is because he was a substitute in your place. He took your place as the sinner. He was innocent, you were guilty, and he carried the punishment that you deserve.
Can you see the grace and love here towards you?
Where sin abounded, grace did abound much more!
The idea of a sacrifice in a body form, goes back to the beginning of the Bible in the Old Testament and carries through in certain animals being sacrified by the Jews to God, to cover over their sins at that time. Finally, and in due time God himself as Christ came in a bodily form and suffered for sin, which finally met God's justice, or satisfied the punishment (back to Isiah 53).
As to what has changed in the world, not much. What has changed for you the believer is everything, thanks to God

 

[vinc]

I agree with and appreciate all the above replies.

I would like to add that Lord Jesus Christ aka the Son-God was sent by Father-God not only as a sinless lamb for the sacrifice of our sins but also to save us from our sins, help us to overcome our sins and to live as a pattern (an example) for all of us. And in all ways He was kept as a human being and was allowed to suffer all things as a human being. He was tempted and tested like us. He faced problems like us. He did all that Father-God commanded Him to do from birth till death. And He finally proved that if He can live such a sinless life (with the help of Father-God) then every human being can live such a life too. The life that He lived, every one of us can and shall live and What He is every one of us can and shall be. We are not to literally live as He lived, but to live in a way that His nature can be shown by us, in us and through us. So, if a person is seeing a Christian, s(he) is seeing a sub-replica of Lord Jesus Christ who is growing more and more into an exact-replica of Lord Jesus Christ. Now, it depends from person to person to how much extent they grow to be replica's of Lord Jesus Christ here on earth. And God has given us the Holy Spirit of God and the Word of God to help us in growing more and more into the likeness of Lord Jesus Christ.

And if He died and rose again, even we can now rise again after our death. Lord Jesus Christ was the first person to rise from the dead.

Now, Man and Woman are joint-heirs of the grace of life. They are equals and shall live like the Angels in Heaven after their earthly life. And the Husband is commanded to love his wife and give due respect to her and the Wife is commanded to love her husband and give due respect to him.

Now, if any Man/Woman sins, s(he) can go to Father-God directly (without the intervention of any Priest/Rabbi) in the name of Lord Jesus Christ and seek forgiveness from Him (through the precious blood of Lord Jesus Christ). As Lord Jesus Christ is now the one and only Mediator. The one and only High Priest who stands at the right hand of our Father-God in heaven who regularly intercedes for us.

So, now we ask forgiveness of our past sins so far committed and start a new life (turning as a new leaf) which is acceptable and approvable by God. And the moment we repent and ask forgiveness sincerely, we are forgiven by God. And after that we strive to live a sinless life as much as possible by us. We seek the help of the divine Holy Spirit of God to help us live a holy life on earth before God. God pours His divine Holy Spirit in us when we ask Him with a strong and sincere desire. And the Holy Spirit resides in us and will make us holy and teach us the ways of God and explains the Word of God to us. And having lived a life as Father-God wanted us to live, our souls are conducted to heaven after our death so that we may live in peace and happiness eternally.

If you read the New Testament completely you will know what is expected of us now (i.e after the death and resurrection of Lord Jesus Christ) and if you read the Book of Revelations you will know what is going to happen in the near and far future.

 

[domi]

Wow that was alot of reading. I see all ur points and I agree with them. Thanks for ur help. I think that ur right, just saying that god forgave us wouln't be enough, we would need hard tanagble evidance to belive it and also to modivate us to continue on the path of sinfreeness. Thanks guys.

 

[IKTCA]

Sister D:
Since I read your post, I have been asking the same question myself: why couldn't God forgive sins without Jesus? I have been thinking about this all week and I still don't have a clue.

In the Garden Adam and Even ate the forbidden fruit. Immediately, God took them out of the Garden. The only sin they committed was to eat the forbidden fruit. Couldn't he just forgive them of that one sin?

I committed so many sins. Even remembering them is painful sometimes. But Adam and Eve just ate the fruit. They didn't have lustful thoughts like I have. They didn't slander anyone like I have. They didn't use four letter words. They didn't hate anyone. They didn't cheat anyone for unjust gain like I have.

I violated countless commandments of God. I deserve death. The only way a man like me can be pardoned is through the cross. I can understand it.

But Adam and Eve? Did they also have to be pardoned through the cross? Is one sin (of eating the fruit) that bad? What is the true nature of sin so that even one little sin deserves such a harsh treatment (and eventual death)?

Sister D:
I still don't have the answer. When I see the true identity of sin (and its darkest ugliness), I will have the answer. Until then, I will keep asking the Lord.

PS: Please post more questions. I am learning by reflecting on your questions.

 

[snoochface]

In the Garden Adam and Even ate the forbidden fruit. Immediately, God took them out of the Garden. The only sin they committed was to eat the forbidden fruit. Couldn't he just forgive them of that one sin?

Keep in mind that the fruit they ate was the fruit of knowledge - the knowledge of good and evil. Prior to that fruit being consumed, that knowledge did not exist in Adam and Eve, and there was no sin. Once they ate it, they became aware of what was good and evil, introducing evil into humanity that did not exist before. It was an act that could not be undone, evil now existed in men. It wasn't just one little sin, the act of eating from the wrong tree. There were much greater implications and consequences that came from that act.

They also committed the sin of pride by eating from the tree, trying to become like God by doing so.

[bible]genesis 3:5-6[/bible]

I violated countless commandments of God. I deserve death. The only way a man like me can be pardoned is through the cross. I can understand it.

But Adam and Eve? Did they also have to be pardoned through the cross? Is one sin (of eating the fruit) that bad? What is the true nature of sin so that even one little sin deserves such a harsh treatment (and eventual death)?

See, that's the thing though, their sin wasn't just eating a piece of fruit. Their sin was bringing sin itself into the world. There wouldn't be sin in the world at all if not for that one act. Looking at it in those terms makes it easier for me, at least, to understand why it wasn't something they could just be forgiven for, because millions of people who came later are also sinning because of their original sin.

I don't know if that helps explain it at all - I'm sure you knew everything I said anyway. It's just a perspective I try to keep when I'm having these questioning thoughts, and it helps me understand it a little better.

 

[domi]

Keep in mind that the fruit they ate was the fruit of knowledge - the knowledge of good and evil. Prior to that fruit being consumed, that knowledge did not exist in Adam and Eve, and there was no sin. Once they ate it, they became aware of what was good and evil, introducing evil into humanity that did not exist before. It was an act that could not be undone, evil now existed in men. It wasn't just one little sin, the act of eating from the wrong tree. There were much greater implications and consequences that came from that act.

They also committed the sin of pride by eating from the tree, trying to become like God by doing so.

Genesis 3:5-65 For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil. 6 And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat.



See, that's the thing though, their sin wasn't just eating a piece of fruit. Their sin was bringing sin itself into the world. There wouldn't be sin in the world at all if not for that one act. Looking at it in those terms makes it easier for me, at least, to understand why it wasn't something they could just be forgiven for, because millions of people who came later are also sinning because of their original sin.

I don't know if that helps explain it at all - I'm sure you knew everything I said anyway. It's just a perspective I try to keep when I'm having these questioning thoughts, and it helps me understand it a little better.

Their sin was eating the apple. Their sin wasn't brining about sin. It might have been a outcome but it's not their falt. the only thing they did was disregard god's orders. Like lets say someone steals someone's car and the person later kills them self because they r so sad they didn't have their car n e more. The only sin that person commited would be stealing the car...the sadness of the other person wasn't their falt. U see where i'm comming from? I agree with Sister ikcta

 

[bostonlass]

Their sin was eating the apple. Their sin wasn't brining about sin. It might have been a outcome but it's not their falt. the only thing they did was disregard god's orders. Like lets say someone steals someone's car and the person later kills them self because they r so sad they didn't have their car n e more. The only sin that person commited would be stealing the car...the sadness of the other person wasn't their falt. U see where i'm comming from? I agree with Sister ikcta

I disagree. They knew it was much more than a piece of fruit. They knew that it was the tree of knowledge. I"m sure someone else will explain it with a verse or two.

 

[domi]

The only thing they knew was that it would bring them kowlage and make them like god. That's what satin told them. they in no way knew it would bring about sin. The only thing they knew and that they thought would be that they would die...

 

[Sketcher]

They did know it was disobedience to God, and that is what counted.

 

[domi]

YAY! I'm with u .. at least i think ur supporting my arugement lol

 

[mrs.wilde]

dear domi, your question is to honest one and i askes same one when i wa non believer 6 years ago. and thet are very difficult one to answer. but i didnt wait for the answer because i was in deep trouble and i couldnt afford to wait nay longer. But you know what? i am so grateful for God to came into my life. after i started follow Jesus teaching meaning read the New Testament daily and change my life according to His teaching, my life strated change for the better. so i dont dwell on difficult ones and just trust what He says and believe. it is working for me my family. We are in love with Jesus wholeheartedly. He teaches us how to deal with any situation in our lives. i urge you to read New testament daily and obey then you will know how wonderful His teachings are. this is the greatest secret He has for us. love mrs wilde

 

[domi]

ur right. If u allow jesus/god to enter ur heart ur life will surley imporove.

It's not that i disbelive that I ask these questions it's that i hope to become closer to god and love him more. The more u know about god the more closer u can become..take pope shandowa for example. He knows everything about god and therefore he is realy close to god and he is able to help nonbelivers fiend their way to god. That's amzing. I want to grow up to be just like him...without the man parts n stuff lol