• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

Why did God say He created evil?

Brian Mcnamee

Well-Known Member
Feb 2, 2017
2,308
1,294
66
usa
✟229,165.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Hi the LORD did create everything and yes it was good. The fall of man records the creation of sin and death. Then the LORD God took the man and put him in the garden of Eden to tend and keep it. 16 And the LORD God commanded the man, saying, “Of every tree of the garden you may freely eat; 17 but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die.” The temptation 4 Then the serpent said to the woman, “You will not surely die. 5 For God knows that in the day you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil.”
3 And the LORD God said to the woman, “What is this you have done?”
The woman said, “The serpent deceived me, and I ate.”
14 So the LORD God said to the serpent:
“Because you have done this,
You are cursed more than all cattle,
And more than every beast of the field;
On your belly you shall go,
And you shall eat dust
All the days of your life.
15 And I will put enmity
Between you and the woman,
And between your seed and her Seed;
He shall bruise your head,
And you shall bruise His heel.”
16 To the woman He said:
“I will greatly multiply your sorrow and your conception;
In pain you shall bring forth children;
Your desire shall be for your husband,
And he shall rule over you.”
17 Then to Adam He said, “Because you have heeded the voice of your wife, and have eaten from the tree of which I commanded you, saying, ‘You shall not eat of it’:
“Cursed is the ground for your sake;
In toil you shall eat of it
All the days of your life.
18 Both thorns and thistles it shall bring forth for you,
And you shall eat the herb of the field.
19 In the sweat of your face you shall eat bread
Till you return to the ground,
For out of it you were taken;
For dust you are,
And to dust you shall return.”

So we see in the fall the introduction of evil by the free will choice of Adam innocence was lost and sin and death were introduced. God created all things knowing of the cross and the mystery of free will and Gods foreknowledge is deep. You see the passage you quote from Isaiah was in context of God naming a guy named Cyrus before he was even born as an instrument of judgment in Gods hand. Cyrus was head of the Meado Persian empire and led the Persians over the Babylonians. Evil has many definitions. here is what the concordance shows the common usage.
The KJV translates Strong's H7451 in the following manner: evil (442x), wickedness (59x), wicked (25x), mischief (21x), hurt (20x), bad (13x), trouble (10x), sore (9x), affliction (6x), ill (5x), adversity (4x), favoured (3x), harm (3x), naught (3x), noisome (2x), grievous (2x), sad (2x), miscellaneous (34x).

So the day of evil can be trouble, or affliction such as when God can punish a wicked nation with say a drought or earthquake. You see punishing sin is righteous and bringing the laws of sowing what you reap is throughout the Bible. In reality many bad choices bring about the correction of natural consequences which is known as evil.

You see what Adam brought in sin and death was overcome at the cross where redemption, salvation, atonement and adoption takes place. People who are born of the Spirit of God are sealed with the Holy Spirit. This universe, our world and our very lives are but a speck of time compared to eternity. The end of all things on earth God separates the seed of the serpent and those who are Christs. Rev 21
Now I saw a new heaven and a new earth, for the first heaven and the first earth had passed away. Also there was no more sea. 2 Then I, John,[fn] saw the holy city, New Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. 3 And I heard a loud voice from heaven saying, “Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and He will dwell with them, and they shall be His people. God Himself will be with them and be their God. 4 And God will wipe away every tear from their eyes; there shall be no more death, nor sorrow, nor crying. There shall be no more pain, for the former things have passed away.”
5 Then He who sat on the throne said, “Behold, I make all things new.” And He said to me,[fn] “Write, for these words are true and faithful.”
6 And He said to me, “It is done![fn] I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End. I will give of the fountain of the water of life freely to him who thirsts. 7 He who overcomes shall inherit all things,[fn] and I will be his God and he shall be My son. 8 But the cowardly, unbelieving,[fn] abominable, murderers, sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars shall have their part in the lake which burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”

So the presence of sin provide man with two masters and our destiny is based on which master we serve. The Lord Jesus risen is the power of salvation. The fall of man has imprinted all of us and we all need to be saved.
 
Upvote 0

Brian Sellers

Active Member
Feb 23, 2016
29
10
61
Demopolis, AL
✟24,172.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
It was important for the Israelites to understand that there was only one God, creator of all things, visible and invisible and He has dominion over everything. God did not desire evil but it was His absolute will that man have free will. Accordingly, God permits evil into the world as a consequence of His will that man have free will. He gave us free will so that we could choose to love Him. Without the ability to choose we are just biological robots and our love is mirage.
 
Upvote 0

Heber Book List

Theologian [Applied Theology]
Jul 1, 2015
2,609
851
Whippingham, Isle of Wight, England
✟139,916.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Private

Job 42:11 translates ...for all the misfortunes that HaShem had brought upon him... (JPS1917).
 
Upvote 0

Heber Book List

Theologian [Applied Theology]
Jul 1, 2015
2,609
851
Whippingham, Isle of Wight, England
✟139,916.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Private
I note that several posts blame G_d for bringing evil into the world - that is a very thin excuse for our behaviour. Does not the Christian Testament say that Messiah (Jesus) came into the world as one of us, but did not sin? If he, as a human being like us in every way, managed to live without sinning, as is claimed in the Christian Testament, why do we need to blame G_d for 'creating' sin. For if G_d created sin then G_d must have killed Messiah (along with being solely responsible for all the horrors of this world) This being so, why does he punish us for something he created and from which we have no escape?

Paul argues against this idea in the letters to the Galatians and Romans!
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

gabbi0408

Active Member
Jan 6, 2006
43
31
Sykesville, Maryland
✟25,594.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
"Origen, quite early on, gave this explanation: 'Evil, in the absolute sense of the word, was not created by God [...]. If we speak of evil in a loose sense, meaning physical and natural evils, then we can say that God created it in order to convert men by their suffering. What is strange about this teaching? We refer to the punishments meted out by parents and teachers, and even the prescriptions and operations carried out by doctors and surgeons, as evils and sufferings, without blaming or condemning them. And that is how we should read the verse: I form light and create darkness, I make weal and woe (Is 45:7)' (Contra Celsum, 6, 55-56)." The Navarre Bible
 
Upvote 0

geiroffenberg

Well-Known Member
Sep 4, 2014
528
238
✟46,073.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
interesting post. There definitly is scriptual evidence that the translated word "evil" is also used about happenings that is perceived as not pleasant for the people, just like a child would not like a punishment even though it is good for him in the long run.
 
Upvote 0

lewiley

Newbie
Oct 17, 2011
20
5
✟23,081.00
Faith
Presbyterian
Marital Status
Married
Actually the full equation is:
E2 = (pc)2 + (mc2)2
It includes the momentum term. Light has no mass but it has momentum and is affected by gravity.

Reference How do you derive E2= (pc)2 + (mc2)2
 
Upvote 0

rockytopva

Love to pray! :)
Site Supporter
Mar 6, 2011
20,696
8,049
.
Visit site
✟1,250,064.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Single
Actually the full equation is:
E2 = (pc)2 + (mc2)2
It includes the momentum term. Light has no mass but it has momentum and is affected by gravity.

Reference How do you derive E2= (pc)2 + (mc2)2

"To the illuminated mind the whole world burns and sparkles with light." - Ralph Waldo Emerson

If E = mc2 then we can divide and conclude that...

Mass (m) = Energy (E/c2)

And there are three varieties...

Natural E/c2 - All mass is basically cooled plasma
Mental E/c2 - Mentally, A mathematical formula, but this has chemical and spiritual properties as well.
Spiritual E/c2 - E (motivation, warmth, love) / c2 (faith, hope, charity, joy)

We can look a the formula and conclude that all mass is basically light and energy. When the sun gives her output of energy and light it does not spit out mathematical formulas but actual energy and light. When a soul is on fire it does not spit out mathematical formulas but actual warmth, motivation, zeal, love, joy, enthusiasm, etc. Only when a mind is on fire does it spit out mathematical calculations.
 
Upvote 0

CrystalDragon

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2016
3,119
1,664
US
✟56,261.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single


Lucifer did not become Satan, that view is just a whisper-down-the-lane tidbit that has been perpetuated by misinformation and people just believing what they were led to believe. If you actually read the context of the entire chapter, "Lucifer" was just a term meaning Morning Star, used in a proverb against an arrogant Babylonian king. Nothing more.
 
Upvote 0

rockytopva

Love to pray! :)
Site Supporter
Mar 6, 2011
20,696
8,049
.
Visit site
✟1,250,064.00
Faith
Pentecostal
Marital Status
Single

Lucifer is a Hebrew word not a Babylonian, the name Lucifer means light bearer in the Hebrew. It is indeed the name of the fallen arch angel.
 
Reactions: LinaBellus
Upvote 0

CrystalDragon

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2016
3,119
1,664
US
✟56,261.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
Lucifer is a Hebrew word not a Babylonian, the name Lucifer means light bearer in the Hebrew. It is indeed the name of the fallen arch angel.

"Lucifer" may be a Hebew name, but that was just one translation, and likely a later Hebrew translation. Another translation is "Morning Star", which does mean light-bearer and was used for those in a high position, including Pharaoh and Jesus. If you actually read the surrounding verses, it relates to no fallen angel. Not Satan, not an arch angel, not anything supernatural. Just a flawed arrogant human who saw himself as being greater than the humans he ruled over.
 
Upvote 0

shadowhunter

+collaboratively study, ~ debate, -fight.
Site Supporter
Apr 19, 2008
256
63
✟84,340.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Isaiah 45:7 says:...45:7?
The word used can also mean 'calamity'.

God created and it was all good.
He created a system where you reap what you sow. The system is good.
He says he gives you what you want and lets you wallow in the consequences. Rom 1:18ff

Adam and Eve wanted to be like God, determining good and evil for themselves. So God let them. He even calls men gods, but warns them they will die like men.

As we act like gods, choosing what is good for ourselves, we reap what we sow; pain suffering and death.

The purpose of the pain, suffering and death is to be the schoolmaster to the flesh; to drive us to our knees and call out for God. When we say that things should not be this way, we are acknowledging that there is a way that it should be and a God who made THAT way.

He created the good system. We make choices where we reap what we sow. It is good.

But God created the calamity by creating the system where we reap what we sow.
 
Upvote 0

CrystalDragon

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2016
3,119
1,664
US
✟56,261.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
A Babylonian king would not give himself a Hebrew name.

It never said the Babylonian king gave himself that name. It was jus used in the proverb, and in one translation. The proverb as it was told to the king may have just used "Morning Star" which is another translation that just means the same thing. In fact "Morning Star" is probably what the king was called when the proverb was given to him.

And if you're going to be so picky about names, then we shouldn't call Jesus "Jesus", we should call him "Yeshua". since "Jesus" is a Romanization of that.
 
Upvote 0

Heber Book List

Theologian [Applied Theology]
Jul 1, 2015
2,609
851
Whippingham, Isle of Wight, England
✟139,916.00
Country
United Kingdom
Gender
Male
Faith
Messianic
Marital Status
Private
If you read it in context, from Chapter 10:12 to the end of Chapter 14 you will see that Assyria was intent on taking everything that belongs to G_d. The use of the term Bright Morning Star belongs to Messiah (Jesus) and is quoted in Isaiah so that we may see the folly of the King who wanted to be G_d, taking over the Temple Mount (Mountain of Meeting), the people, their riches etc. His ambitions are ridiculed by G_d who quotes what the King actually wanted: the title: The Morning Star, and so to take Messiah's place as well - the King of Assyria is reminded of what happens to Kings who threaten G_d. This was a no, no as far as G_d was concerned.

Always read the wider context to understand the full account.
 
Last edited:
Reactions: CrystalDragon
Upvote 0

CrystalDragon

Well-Known Member
Apr 28, 2016
3,119
1,664
US
✟56,261.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single


Which only further accentuates my point, thanks.
 
Upvote 0

Theo Book

Active Member
Site Supporter
Apr 25, 2016
216
76
91
Central Florida
✟104,258.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Republican

It helps if you understand God is a God of opposites; i.e., Love and hate; justice, and Mercy; all the things that make for free will; and choices.

Man is made in God's image, and is given free will, which explains how good men can commit evil deeds, and evil men can do good deeds, all as a matter of expression of choices.

Everything is relative, such as "If any Man come to me, and hate not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be my disciple." (Luke 14:26 KJV)

There are some who think God is wrong for allowing evil in a world where Humans struggle for a lifetime, to avoid temptations, and evil activities. But Man is not the judge of God, because only God has perfect knowledge, and no man is qualified to examine the activities of God with anything approaching balance or honest assessment.

God hates every evil way; God loves righteousness. Both are elements of God's basis for judgment.

But God does not judge Men secretly. He tells all men of His standards, His expectations; His allowances for ignorance; His patience; His love; and His provision for Man's forgiveness and salvation.

Then, He allows Man to decide for himself, and choose. Any one who does not think Heaven and its rewards are worth struggling for, needs to study the issues with more attention to results.
 
Upvote 0

Episaw

Always learning
Nov 12, 2010
2,547
603
Drouin, Victoria, Australia
✟38,829.00
Country
Australia
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Conservatives
God created satan and satan created evil so I guess God was owning up to what happened.
 
Upvote 0

zoidar

loves Jesus the Christ! ✝️
Site Supporter
Sep 18, 2010
7,502
2,678
✟1,043,443.00
Country
Sweden
Gender
Male
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private

"The One forming light and creating darkness, Causing well-being and creating calamity; I am the LORD who does all these." /Isaiah 45:7

This text should NEVER EVER be understood as God creating evil. The opposite of peace/well-being is not evil, it's calamity. From the beginning there was only good, God created everything very good. It's against his nature to create anything evil. What he can do though, is create calamity among people who turn against him.

Edit: God can also let calamity happen for a bigger purpose. Like allowing the crucifixion of his Son, to save mankind.

Evil comes from revolting against God. Lucifer was the first being revolting, bringing one third of the angels with him (Rev 13:4). Then he tricked men into sinning, and now the world is like it is. The bible says Lucifer was an holy angel, but he got proud and wanted to take God's place (Isa 14:14). Through free will he turned against God, and by doing so he became evil (the being Satan), the first evil that ever existed.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Kutte

Regular Member
Dec 30, 2007
1,197
66
USA
✟39,166.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Widowed
Politics
US-Green

Hi LinaBellus, good question.

The answer is simply this: Conditions without darkness are as blinding as conditions without light. We need both to find our ways.
Similar: Goodness can only be appreciated when having the ability to compare goodness with badness.
God bless
 
Reactions: LinaBellus
Upvote 0