Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.
Why did God create? From the nature of the thread so far, I gather "Well, nothing was there" is not the answer you seek.
You are correct - or at least in lots of good company - about the Christian God not 'needing' to create. God is Infinite and Complete. So He cannot be lonely or bored. Which brings us to 'why this mess?'
The only answer I have ever found is probably not very satisfying to anyone not intimate with God. It is quite simple and almost anti-climatic.
It is God's nature to create.
Much like 'why' God loves (humanity and individuals), and 'why' God is just, honest, Omnipotent, Omniscient, Omnipresent and so on. That is simply His nature.
Told you it's anti-climactic.
A corollary to this is "Since God is Eternal, what did He do in the eternal period of time prior to creating this Universe? Did He make a prior Universe?"
I have no idea. So far, He hasn't seen fit to inform me. Since I regularly forget trash day, I can't really complain too much.
God is love.
God created you, and all of creation...To love.
Your purpose here is for God to love you, to bless you, to be your Father.
But He gives you free will, if you do not want to love Him back, then you have made the choice not to spend eternity with Him.
I believe it's true that God had no need to create. After all, He has been in existence forever and the universe has not. If He didn't need the universe in eternity past why all of a sudden would He need it 13.4 billion years ago?
As for getting a reason why, I suggest you become content with not knowing all the answers. I'm a computer programmer. Do you think my programs ever ask why they were created? Of course that's a silly notion, but I think it's on par with a creature questioning its Creator about why.
And there was me thinking that God was supposed to be the one who created the laws of nature.
So it´s another way of saying "God can´t help it, it´s not within God´s control; God has no choice in that matter, there is a law above God that determines his actions. God can´t act intentionally. (Hence there is no point in asking for his intentions)."?
So we have two conflicting notions here:I believe it's true that God had no need to create.
Oh, rest assured I am very content with that. What, however, makes me suspicious is when certain answers don´t explain what they are promised to explain.As for getting a reason why, I suggest you become content with not knowing all the answers.
Quite obviously it´s not only not on par, it´s actually illustrating the fundamental difference: Your programs don´t and can´t ask this question, while humans can and do.I'm a computer programmer. Do you think my programs ever ask why they were created? Of course that's a silly notion, but I think it's on par with a creature questioning its Creator about why.
Ok, so then "It´s God´s nature to create" is but an evasive and irrelevant answer to the question "What was God´s intention in creating?".Not really. We can choose whether to give in to our nature/inclination or to go against it, but God thinks that creating is the right way to go, so He went in with it. Like my previous analogy of the introverted person, he/she can decide to continue being or to change it.
So we have two conflicting notions here:
1. God creates because its his nature (it´s his most basic need to create).
2. God has no need to create.
Oh, rest assured I am very content with that. What, however, makes me suspicious is when certain answers don´t explain what they are promised to explain.
Quite obviously it´s not only not on par, it´s actually illustrating the fundamental difference: Your programs don´t and can´t ask this question, while humans can and do.
Well I think it is on par, and I didn't come up with the analogy without help from the Bible:Quite obviously it´s not only not on par, it´s actually illustrating the fundamental difference: Your programs don´t and can´t ask this question, while humans can and do.
Ok, so then "It´s God´s nature to create" is but an evasive and irrelevant answer to the question "What was God´s intention in creating?".
That was my point.
I got it all figured out. I'm an omnist (I believe in all religions partially), and I believe that every existing religion has got a portion of the truth correct, but not the whole truth yet. When the word is being passed from person-to-person, there is prone to be misunderstanding and misinterpretation during translation, causing us to be divided among ourselves. We're all actually One humanity.
I've come up with this explanation after figuring it out.
I believe that we are all a portion of God (God is within us), and we are assigned a body for our lifetime. Our souls are not capable of sin and evil, but our bodies are because we have needs, wants and feelings, as the result of sustaining biological vehicle. Similarly, Satan and his fallen angel followers (as well as all demons and spirits) have an eternally-living spiritual body, but similarly, when their souls are not capable of evil because they're also a part of God, but their spiritual bodies are, because with a body comes needs, feelings and desires. Once our souls leave our body, we're born again, we become as pure as we have been when we were new-born babies, and hence, God-like. There is no way souls can turn against each other, because we're all One and we know it. It's our minds that come up with perceived boundaries and 'us vs. them' mentality.
It is in the nature of everything, including God, to evolve and change. Therefore, He lets us have an earthly body to go through suffering and face evil, in order to spiritually enhance and to evolve. That was why He created everything and everyone.
We go through reincarnation to learn our lessons in life, and when we've learned our lessons well, all of us return to God in heaven eventually.
As for hell, because God is too pure to see evil, our bodies and corpses need to be thrown into hell to be destroyed, or our souls cannot ascend to Heaven. Also, energy cannot be destroyed, it can only be transformed. As our lives are finite and fragile, we'll be dead and our souls free before our bodies enter the purgatory. As for angels in Heaven, God will probably release them from their bodies easily because they have not sinned despite being capable of doing so. However, for the fallen angels, because of their immortality, they have to be burned in hell to release their souls from their spiritual bodies. They will eventually ascend to Heaven, but their corpses will burn forever in hell. It is not a punishment, take it that God is doing spring-cleaning. An analogy would be when we throw our trash away and burn it in the incinerator, but we're not punishing our trash, just getting rid of them.
When we're all back in Heaven, there will be no more instincts, hierarchy or any human-created status. There will be no more enmity or hate, only love for each other will be left. The lion will lay beside the lamb and even be friends, because the lion has no more needs to hunt and eat the lamb.
This is not an excuse to harm anyone or anything, though, as we and our descendants will still face the consequences of our actions during our lifetime(s) on Earth.
Addition:
Jesus may have died for our sins to pardon us from having to pay the price of our sins: Our lives. Even though God already forgiven all of us for our sins, it does not shield us from facing the consequence of our actions. The law of cause and effect still applies. I take it that God is like a good parent, who will forgive their child quickly, but at the same time, does not shield them from the consequences so that the lesson will be learned.
Well I think it is on par, and I didn't come up with the analogy without help from the Bible:
Isa. 29:16 - Surely you have things turned around! Shall the potter be esteemed as the clay; For shall the thing made say of him who made it, "He did not make me"? Or shall the thing formed say of him who formed it, "He has no understanding"?
Isa. 64:8 - But now, O LORD, You are our Father; We are the clay, and You our potter; And all we are the work of Your hand.
Jer. 18:6 - "O house of Israel, can I not do with you as this potter?" says the LORD. "Look, as the clay is in the potter's hand, so are you in My hand, O house of Israel!
Yes, sure this is what you had in mind. Doesn´t change the fact, though, that if you create something that can´t speak, think, ask (clay, computer programs) it won´t speak, think, ask.Well I think it is on par, and I didn't come up with the analogy without help from the Bible:Isa. 29:16 - Surely you have things turned around! Shall the potter be esteemed as the clay; For shall the thing made say of him who made it, "He did not make me"? Or shall the thing formed say of him who formed it, "He has no understanding"?
Isa. 64:8 - But now, O LORD, You are our Father; We are the clay, and You our potter; And all we are the work of Your hand.
Jer. 18:6 - "O house of Israel, can I not do with you as this potter?" says the LORD. "Look, as the clay is in the potter's hand, so are you in My hand, O house of Israel!
Higher than whose? His own?Ah, I see. My hypothesis is that God wants us to reach a higher level of spirituality.
Maybe analogy is not supposed to be taken literally, and I'm not 100% convinced of the Bible's word because it's written by humans, and thus, be subjected to contextual errors and translation mistakes?
The point I'm obviously not good at making is that even though computer programs and clay can't speak, think, or ask, it's an indication of how far above us God is. His ways and thoughts are so different from ours that we can't even comprehend them. And yet we still demand answers from Him as if it's our "right" to know (if indeed it were even possible to know).Yes, sure this is what you had in mind. Doesn´t change the fact, though, that if you create something that can´t speak, think, ask (clay, computer programs) it won´t speak, think, ask.
So if God wanted us to be like clay he would have created us that way. Quite obviously he didn´t.
The point I'm obviously not good at making is that even though computer programs and clay can't speak, think, or ask, it's an indication of how far above us God is. His ways and thoughts are so different from ours that we can't even comprehend them. And yet we still demand answers from Him as if it's our "right" to know (if indeed it were even possible to know).
So, minus the irrelevant analogy and strawman about "rights", your answer is "I don´t know". That´s ok.The point I'm obviously not good at making is that even though computer programs and clay can't speak, think, or ask, it's an indication of how far above us God is. His ways and thoughts are so different from ours that we can't even comprehend them. And yet we still demand answers from Him as if it's our "right" to know (if indeed it were even possible to know).
Archie said:It is God's nature to create.
Did you consult a dictionary? I meant exactly what I wrote.quatona said:What´s that even supposed to mean?
No, that is not what he meant.Enginehead said:I think he meant to say that it's the law of nature.
Creating everything at the end would have been rather pointless.Why did God create everything in the beginning?
I sort of thought of that kind of answer but decided to try to be serious.durangodawood said:Creating everything at the end would have been rather pointless.
No, to be honest, I didn´t consult a dictionary, due to several reasons:Did you consult a dictionary? I meant exactly what I wrote.
Like, err, "nature", for instance?Now, Quatona; since God is a such a unique (in more than one sense of the world) being, there are any numbers of 'characteristics' familiar to humans that simply do not apply to God.
But "nature" did, and you were the one introducing it.For instance, "Age". Since God has existed forever, there is no meaning to His 'age'.
"Pride". Humans recognize two meanings of 'pride'; one is the positive sense of attempting to keep up a proper appearance, do a proper to excellent job of work and so on. The other meaning is the self aggrandizing pride, which goes along with the phrase 'neener-neener-neener'. Since God is the Ultimate of anything good or positive, 'pride' simply doesn't enter into the discussion.
Yeah, that´s beautifully tautological - but doesn´t answer anything.However, in His nature does suggest that God acts like God.
Yeah, I think that was the accepted premise of the question "Why did God create?". It´s not an answer, though.One of the most commonly cited characteristic of God is 'love' (Greek word 'agape'.) Humans are capable of 'love' in various forms, but is an act of will, and limited by human ability. God loves as part of His nature, loves continually and does not let His love over-ride all other concerns.
So it is with 'creating'. God creates.
Yes, I agree: A completely irrelevant side issue. Nobody said that God was "forced".A side issue here, attempting to clarify. "Force (to do)" is another verb that cannot really be applied to God. No one nor no thing 'forces' God to do anything which is not in His intent. That is, no 'outside' or 'other' entity causes God - against His will - to act in a specific manner.
One can speak of a human 'forcing himself to...' do something. As in, "Archie is forcing himself to not eat chocolate; he has weight to lose". So I am 'forcing' myself to do something other than my will. Additionally, it is due to my 'enhanced' weight dimension.
When God does something in accord with His will, there is nothing outside His will forcing Him to act. God lacks nothing, He is 'Perfect' in that sense of being complete and total. (Also in the sense of having no flaws, but that's another discussion.)
So, while God does create in accordance with who He is, He is not forced to create.
"Getting started" is also a nonsense-statement about a supposedly eternal being. It seems to me that you yourself are - in your use of language - permanently switching between the human perspective and the supposed perspective of your eternal God.That's like saying, "Because God has been around forever, He is old!" Nonsense! He's eternal; He is just getting started.
Right. It just gets weird when people start pretending to speak from a perspective that they can´t have. It even gets weirder when - in doing that - they point to human definitions of human words in human dictionaries, just to - in the next step - fall back into pointing out how irrelevant human constructs are in these questions.The limiting factor and the distortion for humans is we (all) view things through the lens of a limited lifespan and life in general. Which, when considered isn't so strange; we don't really have an adequate view of the Universe from a trout's perspective, either.
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?
We use cookies and similar technologies for the following purposes:
Do you accept cookies and these technologies?