Why did former VP Biden want the prosecutor in Ukraine fired

hislegacy

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NOTE: while it has been brought up recently by the President, the question has ZERO to do with Trump, I would ask mods to remove any reply detailing the thread to Trump to please remove them.

Here is the topic of the thread:

A number of years ago, then Bice President Biden said he would not release 1,000,000,000 to the Ukraine unless they fire a specific prosecutor.

My question is why did the Bice President want a prosecutor in a foreign country fired so badly, he would with hold monies.

I cannot link the very clear video of him saying he did it because of his vulgar language.
 
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RocksInMyHead

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Because it was the official position of the US government (and several other Western governments as well). Furthermore, Ukraine says that Shokin, the prosecutor in question, had been actively hampering the Burisma investigation. So if he was trying to protect Burisma (and his son) from prosecution, why would he want the guy fired?
 
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Blade

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Its very hard to find the real story about this. But the short is "It remained unclear if this was directly tied to the prosecutor's probe into the company linked to Hunter Biden, as other countries reportedly wanted the prosecutor out as well."
 
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sdowney717

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Yes, the Bidens are ethically compromised

Both Bidens are unfit. They are both ethically compromised. With the elder unfit for president, influence peddling! Of course you can see how damaging this is for Biden, which is why they are trying to screw Trump with this.

Biden accepted a lucrative board position with an energy company focusing on Ukrainian business, even though, based on every account I’ve seen, he had no background or expertise in energy or in Ukraine. He did so after the energy company was known to be under Ukrainian investigation for alleged corruption and after his father was publicly overseeing much of the Obama administration’s policy toward Ukraine. It also all happened after Hunter Biden’s business partner met with Joe Biden in the White House — the same business partner who also joined the energy company’s board on, yes, the very day after the vice president’s visit in Kiev began.

In the vernacular sense (not necessarily in criminal-legal terminology), this is a textbook case of influence-peddling. And it harmed U.S. interests: What otherwise would have been seen as entirely legitimate and even wise insistence by Joe Biden that Ukraine fire a corrupt prosecutor now starts looking like a tawdry deal to protect Biden’s son. Even if the elder Biden’s motives were innocent, the son’s profiteering hurts the credibility of the U.S. government, making it less likely for American motives to be seen in the future as clean and just.

The business in China, although less famous at this point, was even worse. On what possible policy grounds would Joe Biden bring his adult son to China on Air Force Two, immediately after which the younger Biden emerged with an almost unprecedented $1.5 billion Chinese deal for his small investment fund?

Both of these situations smell awful. Both of them call into question at least the ethics of Biden the son, and the judgment of Biden pere. Legal or not, both situations are shameful. Both deserve more scrutiny, and both suggest that Joe Biden should not be president of the United States.
 
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Tiberius Lee

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NOTE: while it has been brought up recently by the President, the question has ZERO to do with Trump, I would ask mods to remove any reply detailing the thread to Trump to please remove them.

Here is the topic of the thread:

A number of years ago, then Bice President Biden said he would not release 1,000,000,000 to the Ukraine unless they fire a specific prosecutor.

My question is why did the Bice President want a prosecutor in a foreign country fired so badly, he would with hold monies.

I cannot link the very clear video of him saying he did it because of his vulgar language.

What did I write in my previous thread –

The Whistleblower

President Trump supporter will forget that a US sitting president use US military and economic power to gain personal favor from foreign government and they want to focus on what VP Biden did.

The OP even say “ remove post which talks about Trump” and we only want to focus on what VP Biden did.

This is how President Trump’s supporter justify everything.
 
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hislegacy

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Because it was the official position of the US government (and several other Western governments as well). Furthermore, Ukraine says that Shokin, the prosecutor in question, had been actively hampering the Burisma investigation. So if he was trying to protect Burisma (and his son) from prosecution, why would he want the guy fired?

Can you provide a link?

Please
 
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Tanj

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essentialsaltes

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why did the Bice President want a prosecutor in a foreign country fired so badly, he would with hold monies.

Because that prosecutor was widely considered corrupt by people inside and outside Ukraine, and the US wanted someone more honest in charge of prosecuting crimes in the country.
 
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tulc

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When you can't? (snip)
Well...to be fair, I don't think it's possible to provide a link that explains what the facts in the case are that doesn't have the very thing the OP doesn't want brought up in the thread. :wave:
tulc(still wondering what brought up hislegacy's sudden interest in something from over 4 years ago?) :scratch:
 
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hislegacy

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When you can't? That doesn't sound very fair.

Having said that, googling "shokin" . comes up with several dozen links. Here's one:
The facts behind Trump’s bogus accusations about Biden and Ukraine

The title alone shows it is biased

It’s a simple question really.

Why did the VicePresident of the US coerce the government of Ukraine (by refusing to release funds), until they fired a Ukrainian federal prosecutor?

There had to be a pretty powerful reason for it

What was the reason
 
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essentialsaltes

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Why did the VicePresident of the US coerce the government of Ukraine (by refusing to release funds), until they fired a Ukrainian federal prosecutor?

Radio Free Europe

Why Was Ukraine's Top Prosecutor Fired? The Issue At The Heart Of The Dispute Gripping Washington

When Viktor Shokin was fired as Ukraine’s prosecutor-general in March 2016, after less than 14 months in the post, it was seen as a crucial development in a country under pressure to curb corruption and get serious about reforms.

“Ironically, Joe Biden asked Shokin to leave because the prosecutor failed [to pursue] the Burisma investigation, not because Shokin was tough and active with this case,” Kaleniuk said.

Ukrainian prosecutors have described no evidence indicating that Biden sought to help his son by getting Shokin dismissed -- and have suggested that they have not discovered any such evidence.

But there is a long list of Western organizations, governments, and diplomats, as well as Ukrainian anti-corruption groups, that wanted to see Shokin fired.

They include the International Monetary Fund, the European Union, the U.S. government, foreign investors, and Ukrainian advocates of reform.
 
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hislegacy

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tulc

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The title alone shows it is biased

It’s a simple question really.

Why did the VicePresident of the US coerce the government of Ukraine (by refusing to release funds), until they fired a Ukrainian federal prosecutor?

There had to be a pretty powerful reason for it

What was the reason
Joe Biden played a role in pushing out Ukraine’s prosecutor general
The part of the story that involves Joe Biden directly centers on the ouster of Ukraine’s prosecutor general, Viktor Shokin.

In February 2015, Shokin became Ukraine’s prosecutor general, and promised critics of his country’s anti-corruption efforts at home, in the US, and at the International Monetary Fund (IMF) that a clean-up was on the way. And he claimed Burisma was in his sights.

But Shokin’s deputy, Vitaly Kasko, told Bloomberg that the promise was empty rhetoric. According to Kasko, their office did nothing to pursue its investigation into Zlochevsky throughout 2015, and the office was ineffective at reining in corruption generally, leading him to resign in frustration.

Shokin has disputed Kasko’s narrative, but the manner in which he was running his office also concerned the US ambassador to Ukraine, who said publicly in September 2015 that the office was “subverting” the UK’s investigation.

Concern at the embassy mounted, and by 2016, officials there began suggesting the Obama administration push for the prosecutor general’s ouster. In particular, the embassy suggested that $1 billion in loan guarantees the country hoped to receive from the US in order to stay solvent should be tied to a tougher anti-corruption strategy that involved removing officials seen as blocking progress, namely Shokin.

It wasn’t just the US that wanted Shokin gone, either — many other Western European officials, including the IMF’s then-managing director Christine Lagarde, also insisted Ukraine was doing far too little about corruption.

So in March 2016, Biden says he told the Ukrainian government that their loan guarantees would be cut off unless they removed Shokin. He told the story at a session at the Council on Foreign Relations in 2018.

“I said, ‘You’re not getting the billion.’ I’m going to be leaving here in, I think it was about six hours,” Biden told his audience. “I looked at them and said: ‘I’m leaving in six hours. If the prosecutor is not fired, you’re not getting the money.’”

The former vice president said after the threat, “Well, (sniped for profanity) he got fired. And they put in place someone who was solid at the time.”

But though Biden may have taken credit for it, this was hardly his unique idea. “Everyone in the Western community wanted Shokin sacked,” Anders Aslund, a senior fellow at the Atlantic Council, told the Wall Street Journal. “The whole G-7, the IMF, the EBRD, everybody was united that Shokin must go, and the spokesman for this was Joe Biden.”

The people of Ukraine wanted Shokin gone as well, and demonstrated for his removal around the time of Biden’s threat. Shortly after that demonstration, Shokin was dismissed.
those are the facts, if you have something different please post a link to them...also remembering nothing you post should mention President Trump or what his supporters seem to want to believe. That would go against what the OP wanted. :wave:
tulc(hopes that helps) :oldthumbsup:
 
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RocksInMyHead

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RocksInMyHead

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Opinion: Joe Biden Forced Ukraine to Fire Prosecutor for Aid Money

Here is his own words.

He forced a foreign government to fire their own Federal Prosecutor.

You don’t fire him, you don’t get the money.

Plain and simple. You will note the video is from 2018.
No one disputes that. We can discuss whether or not it was the right thing to do if you like, but that's another topic.

The reasoning behind it is the important part - and the facts that I've found on the matter suggest that he had no ulterior motives for wanting Shokin dismissed. The man was corrupt, just as Biden said. Furthermore, the ulterior motives that Trump and others have ascribed to Biden don't line up with the facts. Shokin was already impeding the investigation that Biden supposedly wanted stopped, and the investigation itself had effectively stalled by that point. So by getting him dismissed, he achieved nothing towards his supposed goals.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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There are multiple theories on it, some more benign, some more damning.

...but I suspect you're already aware of both theories on it, and this is a thread to shine a light on Biden's alleged misdeeds, while insulating your guy from criticism (thus the disclaimer/stipulation you put in the OP)

However, despite your wishes, the Biden story, and the recent Whistle-blower speculation pertaining to Trump are connected now.

Of course, both the theory about Biden "making a deal" to get rid of the Ukrainian prosecutor that was going after dirt on Hunter Biden, as well as the theory that Trump was somehow making a deal with them to re-open their inquiry into the matter (in order to knock out the dem who's polling the best against him right now) in exchange for certain favors are both highly speculative.

However, in reality, it doesn't look good for either one of them if you ask me.

The Hunter Biden scenario always seemed a bit fishy to me, even though the prosecutor he got fired was undoubtedly corrupt (and many other countries agreed)...but the flip side, it's also extremely fishy when the Inspector General is trying to play defense with regards to not letting the info come before congress, and people in the Trump administration are already hinting at trying to invoke executive privilege to avoid having to disclose what took place in the meeting.
 
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Tanj

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However, in reality, it doesn't look good for either one of them if you ask me.

Let's raise a glass and toast to less old white men in the political system. Fingers crossed this thing ends both careers.
 
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ThatRobGuy

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Let's raise a glass and toast to less old white men in the political system. Fingers crossed this thing ends both careers.

LOL

...in all honesty, I don't care about age or color.

I'd be THRILLED if a guy like Bill Weld could be our president. (and he's old and white lol)

...but he has a history of being able to be fiscally conservative (when he was governor, he implemented several tax cuts that didn't hurt safety nets, and still left his state with a large surplus), socially inclusive/progressive (he was even popular as a republican in a blue state), and has common-sense balanced positions on a lot of key issues, and would be the first truly anti-war president this nation has seen in a long time.

...which probably means he'd never have a chance of winning :(

Oh well, one can dream...
 
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Speedwell

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LOL

...in all honesty, I don't care about age or color.

I'd be THRILLED if a guy like Bill Weld could be our president. (and he's old and white lol)

...but he has a history of being able to be fiscally conservative (when he was governor, he implemented several tax cuts that didn't hurt safety nets, and still left his state with a large surplus), socially inclusive/progressive (he was even popular as a republican in a blue state), and has common-sense balanced positions on a lot of key issues, and would be the first truly anti-war president this nation has seen in a long time.

...which probably means he'd never have a chance of winning :(

Oh well, one can dream...

Bill Weld would have done really well in the Republican Party I used to belong to.
 
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