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Why Believe in Perpetual Virginity?

brightlights

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Roman Christians believe in the perpetual virginity of Mary. This is the doctrine that not only was Mary a virgin at the time she conceived Jesus, but that she remained a virgin throughout her life.

Why believe this?

I understand that the Roman Church teaches this doctrine, and that this reason alone is enough for assenting Catholics to accept it. But there doesn't seem to be any basis for this belief in Scripture and I don't understand what is gained by believing it.

To me it seems rooted in a medieval error that virginity or even celibacy is somehow holier than sex and marriage.
 

LivingWordUnity

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It's suggested in Old Testament typology that the Virgin Mary was to remain perpetually a virgin.

"Then he brought me back to the outer gate of the sanctuary, which faces east; and it was shut. And he said to me, 'This gate shall remain shut; it shall not be opened, and no one shall enter by it; for the Lord, the God of Israel, has entered by it; therefore it shall remain shut.'" - Ezekiel 44:1-2

Also, see the following:

Source:
Scripture Catholic - THE BLESSED VIRGIN MARY
 
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brightlights

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What justifies connecting this to Mary? Seems a very tenuous connection.
 
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thecolorsblend

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Oddly enough, Sacred Scripture gives no direct indication that she ever lost her virginity.

Separately, Our Lady's womb was the dwelling place of Our Lord. Cyril of Alexandria described her as a temple of God.

I should also say that Origen, Hilary of Poitiers and St. Athanasius all thought Our Lady was ever-virgin. Where did they get that idea?

1 Cor. 7 points to celibacy as the ideal so it's not like the Catholic Church is inventing something out of whole cloth. There's nothing "medieval" about that.

The reality is that God clearly took the Incarnation very seriously. One quibble I have with Protestantism is that many of them don't have a complete appreciation for how miraculous the Incarnation really is. The steps required to effectuate Our Lord's birth free of the stain of sin are rather extensive and I think Protestants deny (perhaps unwittingly) the beauty, scope and grandeur of God's plan in allowing Our Lord to be born without a sin nature. These required special circumstances for Our Lady and thus the Catholic Church recognizes and celebrates her and the special circumstances which allowed her to give birth to Our Lord.
 
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hooverbranch

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I dont believe by not Celebrating Mary we (Protestants) do not appreciate the amazing circumstances in how God the Father brought about Jesus. We fully realize the implications of Mary being a Virgin for Jesus. We fully realize hiw important it was for Jesus to be unblemished and without Sin. What we can not recognize is that anyone other than God can be perfect. Mary was not God in Flesh. Mary was a faithful servant who was chosen as the vessel to bring forth the Savior.

We know through scripture and Church history that Jesus had brothers. James the brother of Jesus is widely recognized as writing the book of James. This clearly implies that Mary had children after Jesus. And going back to 1st Corinthians 7 there is nothing wrong with that because Mary and Joseph were married and if Mary were to with hold herself from Joseph (her husband) that would be a sin according to Paul.

Now I have reread this before I posted and want to apologize if this comes off as an attack on the Catholic church. That is not my intention. I am just stating why Protestants do not see eye to eye on the doctrine of celebrating Mary. Because since reformers like Luther, Calvin and Zwingley we want to make sure we are putting the focus on God, because All Glory Belongs to Him!

1 Corinthians 10:31

So, whether you eat or drink, or whatever you do, do all to the glory of God.
 
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KWCrazy

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Mary and Joseph were married after the birth of Christ.
Mark records the names of Jesus brothers and indicates more than one sister. Mark 6:3 Is not this the carpenter, the son of Mary, the brother of James, and Joses, and of Juda, and Simon? and are not his sisters here with us? And they were offended at him.
Mark and Matthew both record His mother and brothers wanting to meet with Him.
Mark 3: 31-35
Matthew 12: 26-50

The same church which insists Mary remained a virgin doesn't sanction a marriage in name only where there is no intention of ever having children. Many see this as the word of God having been added to by the teaching of man. For example, purgatory is never mentioned, though Hell is mentioned many times, and Christ taught us to pray to God rather than praying to intercessors. Still, Catholicism is a Christian religion and they are saved by the blood of Christ just as we are. So if they are wrong or we are wrong we can find out together in Heaven.
 
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LivingWordUnity

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Doesn't it say that Jesus had several brothers and sisters (and I mean that in the biological sense)?
Cousins and other close relatives were called brothers back then. It's also used in a spiritual sense as in Christians are the brothers and sisters of our Lord Jesus Christ.
 
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Sammy-San

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What is your view on what these theologians said? Heretical?

Church Fathers & Doctors

 
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Tallguy88

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Another tradition, popular in Eastern Orthodoxy and stated at least as early as the Protoevangelium of James, written in the 100s most likely, is that the siblings of Jesus are Joseph's children from a previous marriage, him being a widower when he betrothed Mary. Since ordinary folks believed Jesus was Joseph's biological son, they would have assumed they were his siblings. Even though Joseph is not Jesus' biological father, he was his legal father and so his children would have been Jesus' legal siblings.
 
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Hank77

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From the already present notion that there was a Queen of Heaven, which they mistakenly gave that place to Mary?
I think you fail to realize how Jesus could be born without sin and yet be born from an imperfect woman.
Mary knew she was imperfect and needed a Savior.

Luk 1:46 And Mary said, `My soul doth magnify the Lord,
Luk 1:47 And my spirit was glad on God my Saviour,
Luk 1:48 Because He looked on the lowliness of His maid-servant, For, lo, henceforth call me happy shall all the generations,
Luk 1:49 For He who is mighty did to me great things, And holy is His name,
 
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LivingWordUnity

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What justifies connecting this to Mary? Seems a very tenuous connection.
Jesus isn't named directly in the Old Testament. But he is mentioned a lot of times in it indirectly through prototypes and other subtle references. The same is true for the Virgin Mary.
 
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Hank77

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Sammy-San

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Wow, I knew some of the them degraded the very act that God created to accomplish the amazing creation of new life, but I didn't realize there were so many.

Wasn't there some truth to what they said? In the improper context their comments would be truthful.
 
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FireDragon76

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It's not just Roman Catholics, but most Christians historically. Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox, and a great many Anglicans and Lutherans. Calvin himself argued in favor of Mary's perpetual virginity, as well, in his Institutes.
 
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Hank77

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Cousins and other close relatives were called brothers back then.
This is still true in the East today. My half Asian grandchildren call their cousins gege and mei mei, meaning brother and sister.
 
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KWCrazy

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What is your view on what these theologians said? Heretical?

Church Fathers & Doctors
What does God say?
Ephesians 5:
Wives, be subject to your own husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, as Christ also is the head of the church, He Himself being the Savior of the body. But as the church is subject to Christ, so also the wives ought to be to their husbands in everything.

Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself up for her, so that He might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, that He might present to Himself the church in all her glory, having no spot or wrinkle or any such thing; but that she would be holy and blameless. So husbands ought also to love their own wives as their own bodies. He who loves his own wife loves himself; for no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ also does the church, because we are members of His body. FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND SHALL BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH.

There is no sin in a husband and wife loving each other and engaging in acts of love which were given to man and woman from the beginning. I disagree with the condemnation of marital sex as something dirty or sinful. The Bible makes no such claim.
 
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Mountainmike

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Sounds like you don't understand the word translated as brother, it actually means kinsman, related.

You are certainly demeaning Mary!

She was Kaire kecharetomene, often but undertranslated as " full of grace" where it means more like " perfected in grace" . And as a part of speech it is not an adjective, but a title akin to " grace personified" " God was with her"
Elizabeth honours Mary as " mother of lord" , notice it is Mary she honours, not just the child in her womb,

Clearly the highest of saints.

She was as mother of a davidic king ,that gives her title " queen", a throne, and powers of intercession visible in the Old Testament, and used at Cana , where Jesus says in effect " not yet, wait till my time has come..."

We see from the word used infrequently for " woman" that she is the new eve, a model of obedience, not disobedience, and she is there in various prophecies, she is also there at Cana, also at the cross " behold your mother" but also as the " woman" of revelations whose ( spiritual) offspring are those who obey the commandments of God. Giving her a role ongoing in salvation history


She is a great deal more than the " used wineskin" many Protestants treat her as! She was god's most perfect creation amongst mankind and lauded by the angel as such.

As for reformers - Even Luther revered her!

And perhaps it is worth reading what those at the councils that wrote the creed and compiled the New Testament Canon ( so clearly inspired) said of her!.. they were gushing! And such as Ephraim urged to ask her for her intercession! Some of them spoke of her perpetual virginity!

 
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Hank77

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What is your view on what these theologians said? Heretical?

Church Fathers & Doctors
And what did Paul say?

1Co 7:4 the wife over her own body hath not authority, but the husband; and, in like manner also, the husband over his own body hath not authority, but the wife.
1Co 7:5 Defraud not one another, except by consent for a time, that ye may be free for fasting and prayer, and again may come together, that the Adversary may not tempt you because of your incontinence;
 
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