Why are they gay?

[ReformedChapin]

Amen. remember at one time Blacks could not marry whites. Many "Christians in certain areas of the Country used scripture to back that up. They also used scripture when they practiced genocide against the native americans. They also used scripture when the forbade Woman the right to Vote. And if you disagree with them you are of Satan and a persecutor of Christians. Even though you may be a Christian.

talk about strawman argument, we could easily compare that to your defense to homosexuality now; as errors could come from you as you are a christian too.

And yes Chritianity has been used through history for horrible attrocities, that still doesn't relate to this issue as it's been clear cut since the founding of the faith.

 

[ReformedChapin]

Why are we using old covenant teachings when we are clearly in the new covenant? Yes concepts of the law still apply but not the consequences since we are all forgiven.

 

[DivineRAiN]

genez: First, let's get the gays acceptable. That's too much for now.

you truly believe the acceptance of homosexuals is a stepping stone to accepting child molesters?

Like in the derogatory term gays use towards straights? I wonder why you chose that term. I believe I see a strong bias showing.

to be honest, I don't see how heterosexuals (in general) can place themselves above gay ppl as if we are perfect in comparison. As if we are better than them. There's upteen threads where the focus is on homosexuality being a sin,
while we have a lot of problems without our own group.
Breeding is a word that came to mind and I stuck with it.
The way that heterosexuals are sleeping around.. a woman I used to know has 4 kids by 4 different men and none of them have a father in their life. My ex has 3 by 3 different women, he's only involved with 1 of his kids. A childhood friend.. I dunno what he thinks he's doing but he's got upteen kids (more than 13 kids) by several women. Married women having kids and the husbands aren't the fathers..creating another issue on whether he should be financially responsible (child support) for a child that isn't really his. Women using abortion as birth control.
Being promiscuous is glorified. Dunno.. it just seems weird to see 1 group of ppl being so negative n judgmental against another group of ppl when they don't have their own act together... and the judged group isn't really doing anything to deserve it.

 

[babygurl2006]

i think it would be other, i think steming from they way they were raised, events that happen in their life, growing up, and also, society saying its ok. i dont think your born that way. who remember when theyre born haha i sure dont, so my final answer being other

 

[DivineRAiN]

this is way off topic, but since I'm already in this thread and I'm in this mode of thinking. What is really screwed up is that a serial killer got married while on death row.
He has that right because he's a heterosexual?

 

[babygurl2006]

this is way off topic, but since I'm already in this thread and I'm in this mode of thinking. What is really screwed up is that a serial killer got married while on death row.
He has that right because he's a heterosexual?

well i think everyone has that right dont they?- im not real sure about that one though.

 

[ReformedChapin]

genez: First, let's get the gays acceptable. That's too much for now.

you truly believe the acceptance of homosexuals is a stepping stone to accepting child molesters?

Like in the derogatory term gays use towards straights? I wonder why you chose that term. I believe I see a strong bias showing.

to be honest, I don't see how heterosexuals (in general) can place themselves above gay ppl as if we are perfect in comparison. As if we are better than them. There's upteen threads where the focus is on homosexuality being a sin,
while we have a lot of problems without our own group.
Breeding is a word that came to mind and I stuck with it.
The way that heterosexuals are sleeping around.. a woman I used to know has 4 kids by 4 different men and none of them have a father in their life. My ex has 3 by 3 different women, he's only involved with 1 of his kids. A childhood friend.. I dunno what he thinks he's doing but he's got upteen kids (more than 13 kids) by several women. Married women having kids and the husbands aren't the fathers..creating another issue on whether he should be financially responsible (child support) for a child that isn't really his. Women using abortion as birth control.
Being promiscuous is glorified. Dunno.. it just seems weird to see 1 group of ppl being so negative n judgmental against another group of ppl when they don't have their own act together... and the judged group isn't really doing anything to deserve it.

Comperisons are made to show their sinful nature as how one act is already accepted and another is not because of the postmodern philosophy crawling into the church. Both act's however, biblically are sinful.

 

[GenemZ]

Keep in mind that the Leviticus sword cuts both ways. It also states that if a community refuses to stone the offenders of a stoning-worthy offense, all who refused will be cut off from God as well. Raise your hand if you really have ever stoned a homosexual.

Anybody?

Anybody?

That's a silly argument.

That was the Law for the people of ancient Israel. Not for us today.

Yet, it reveals to us today God's thoughts towards certain acts.

Since Israel was at that time a Theocracy, God could pass such a law. Today, laws are set up by nations according to their own sense of law and justice.

Paul makes a comment that reveals God's attitude had not changed.

Romans 1:32 nasb
"... and although they know the ordinance of God, that those who practice such things are worthy of death, they not only do the same, but also give hearty approval to those who practice them."

​

Only the use of the Law had changed. God's view towards such acts had not changed as revealed in the civil codex of the Law. God does not love murderers today because they are nice to other people they do not murder. Nor does God love adultery, even though the adulterer may treat the children of the one he is committing adultery with in a very kind and generous way. That would be salvation by works, if that could make God approve of what he disapproves of.

God destroyed Sodom as a precedent. To make known his attitude towards such behavior. Does God strike dead every sodomite today? No.....

But, what he thinks about it has been established and made known. Now, its up to men to decide for themselves if its acceptable to them or not. There have been some who were tempted to do such things, and having known the wrongness of it, stayed clear of it.

And, there are those who reject God as revealed in Romans 1:18-21. These end up being handed over to having no control over their sex drive. They are handed over to become transformed into what they desire to worship. But, that's another story.


In Christ, GeneZ

 

[GenemZ]

.

you truly believe the acceptance of homosexuals is a stepping stone to accepting child molesters?

No. Its a stepping stone to the acceptance of adult/child relations.

There is no mention of molestation involved. Like I said, all molestation is wrong. So? Attaching molestation to the desires between an adult and a child are not the same things. NAMBLA would not agree with you on the molestation issue. They want legitimized acceptance of what they desire, without having molestation involved. Gay molestation is wrong, too. Homosexual rape is wrong. Molestation is another issue. You keep bringing it in as to deny there are adults that see nothing wrong with having a loving sexual relationship with a child.

to be honest, I don't see how heterosexuals (in general) can place themselves above gay ppl as if we are perfect in comparison. As if we are better than them. There's upteen threads where the focus is on homosexuality being a sin,
while we have a lot of problems without our own group.
Breeding is a word that came to mind and I stuck with it.

Our own group? I take it, you are gay. I knew gay Christians at Bible college. One I knew was a pastor. They had a series of problems to overcome that was between them and the LORD. Its when they run to people for acceptance that they get their wires crossed.

2 Corinthians 12:8-10 (New International Version)
"Three times I pleaded with the Lord to take it away from me. But he said to me, "My grace is sufficient for you, for my power is made perfect in weakness."

Therefore I will boast all the more gladly about my weaknesses, so that Christ's power may rest on me. That is why, for Christ's sake, I delight in weaknesses, in insults, in hardships, in persecutions, in difficulties. For when I am weak, then I am strong."
​

The same principle applies to any area of weakness a believer may have. God uses our weaknesses to open up a place in our hearts for Christ to take over with his power and life. That is how we become stronger than we were in our natural strengths.

Pride refuses to accept this. Lust and depravity wants to not let go of its pleasures and its moments of pleasure.

Yet, if they do surrender? But, if its on their own terms? Impatience and feelings of self importance guarantees failure to overcome.

The way that heterosexuals are sleeping around.. a woman I used to know has 4 kids by 4 different men and none of them have a father in their life. My ex has 3 by 3 different women, he's only involved with 1 of his kids. A childhood friend.. I dunno what he thinks he's doing but he's got upteen kids (more than 13 kids) by several women. Married women having kids and the husbands aren't the fathers..creating another issue on whether he should be financially responsible (child support) for a child that isn't really his. Women using abortion as birth control.

That is living in primitive paganism under the security blanket of a prosperous nation. God's Spirit is being grieved in all those mentioned, if they are believers.

Being promiscuous is glorified. Dunno.. it just seems weird to see 1 group of ppl being so negative n judgmental against another group of ppl when they don't have their own act together... and the judged group isn't really doing anything to deserve it.

You think? The majority of people today live like the one's you described?! I have seen that way of life in certain select groups. Where I saw it manifested, it was a class issue, not a cultural issue. But? In society in general?

In Christ, GeneZ

 

[relspace]

this is way off topic, but since I'm already in this thread and I'm in this mode of thinking. What is really screwed up is that a serial killer got married while on death row.
He has that right because he's a heterosexual?

Everyone has the right to get married if they have a suitable partner of the opposite sex because that is what marriage is. What people don't have the right to do is change the definition of marriage to whatever is convenient to them.

 

[ReformedChapin]

Everyone has the right to get married if they have a suitable partner of the opposite sex because that is what marriage is. What people don't have the right to do is change the definition of marriage to whatever is convenient to them.

Seems God doesn't have a say in marrige now a days, not even for "christians."

 

[*Starlight*]

Seems God doesn't have a say in marrige now a days, not even for "christians."

Do you expect to change your mind only when you hear a great booming voice from the sky which says that homosexuality is ok? I don't think God works that way... In my opinion, God works through people... such as people who realize that love is more important than following some ancient rules without even thinking about them, and who try to change the world for better. For example, homosexual Christians who are brave enough to stand for love, despite being persecuted by others, including their fellow Christians.

 

[relspace]

Do you expect to change your mind only when you hear a great booming voice from the sky which says that homosexuality is ok? I don't think God works that way... In my opinion, God works through people... such as people who realize that love is more important than following some ancient rules without even thinking about them, and who try to change the world for better. For example, homosexual Christians who are brave enough to stand for love, despite being persecuted by others, including their fellow Christians.

But the problem is that people are always thinking that it is time to change the rules. So we had Nietche, the Nazis and the communists overthrowing silly moralistic inhibitions to take proactive measures to change the world. And so the spectrum of conservative to liberal exists for a very good reason. You will have to forgive some of us our caution before we jump at the opportunity to join your brave new world.

There are other Christians standing up for what they believe in too - standing up for the Bible despite the screams of "homophobe" directed at them. Some are being refused advancement in their careers just because they don't agree with all the sacred beliefs of the gay rights community. So your poor persecuted people are pretty good at persecuting others themselves.

You want to rip our life out by the roots by redefining our most sacred traditions like marriage to suit your own purposes. I think you are pushing for rights of homosexuals to supercede that of religious freedom so you can make it illegal for people to follow the Bible. Keep pursuing this course and you will find that a lot of Christians will not tolerate your mockery of Christianity very peacefully at all.

Compromise is the only path of peace. Both groups will have to accept the fact that the other group is here to stay and will have to figure out a way that both can live at peace in the same community.

 

[Be11e]

OP

I don't think that God made people homosexual, as that contradicts his word directly, but i don't think that being homosexual is usually a conscious choice. We don't choose to have lust for married men or women, it just happens, and it shouldn't. It's not on purpose, it's just part of our sinful inclination.

 

[ReformedChapin]

Do you expect to change your mind only when you hear a great booming voice from the sky which says that homosexuality is ok? I don't think God works that way... In my opinion, God works through people... such as people who realize that love is more important than following some ancient rules without even thinking about them, and who try to change the world for better. For example, homosexual Christians who are brave enough to stand for love, despite being persecuted by others, including their fellow Christians.

Gee I guess men don't have a fallen nature...and it isn't ancient rules, it's the trancending law.

A brave christain would stand up for the Gospel not for their desires of the flesh. I love how people label things to justify sin, this is like the feminist labeling abortion "reproductive freedom." And that voice is never going to come unless it's satan himself. Do you need to hear the voice of God to understand his law? Or would even that way would you keep supporting sin?

 

[GenemZ]

Do you expect to change your mind only when you hear a great booming voice from the sky which says that homosexuality is ok?

Would you? That's all it would take? A great booming voice from the sky that says murder is OK? That's all it would take?

I don't think God works that way... In my opinion, God works through people... such as people who realize that love is more important than following some ancient rules without even thinking about them,

How do you know we do not think about them? The ancient rules given to the Jews (civil law) were given in a world where these regulations seemed foreign to man's thinking.

Satan rules the world where ever God's law does not prevail. In the ancient lands around Israel? Homosexual expression was seen as a norm. So was adultery and pediastry. Even sex with an animal was seen as nothing to get upset about. Would it take a big booming voice from the sky to tell you that sex with your dog is not OK?

and who try to change the world for better. For example, homosexual Christians who are brave enough to stand for love, despite being persecuted by others, including their fellow Christians.

Are they just as brave as Muslims who blow themselves up on buses? According to your logic? Now, that's bravery for what one believes!

In other words? Bravery motivated by error? Is stupid. Very stupid.

The odds that are set against you does not make one brave. Evil produces a form of bravery which is stupid.

Bravery in itself is not a virtue. Nor is loyalty. Many were loyal to Hitler. Were they virtuous?

Patience in itself is not virtue. The Islamic extremists are very patient in waiting for their next strike. Are they virtuous?

The only true virtue is living by God's truth in the power of the Spirit. It does not matter how many Christians live reactionary legalistic lives that counter the very same words the virtuous live by.

The Bible when seen through the eyes of evil is stupidity. Yet, the same Bible when seen through eyes of the heart, which are enabled by the Spirit? Is wisdom.

Ephesians 1:18 niv​

"I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints."​

Grace and peace, GeneZ

By the way...... who is the artist on "Don't download this song?"

 

[cynthiamarie]

Seems God doesn't have a say in marrige now a days, not even for "christians."

so rude.

just because people are gay, doesn't mean they don't love god, some of them really do...

 

[*Starlight*]

Gee I guess men don't have a fallen nature...and it isn't ancient rules, it's the trancending law.

A brave christain would stand up for the Gospel not for their desires of the flesh. I love how people label things to justify sin, this is like the feminist labeling abortion "reproductive freedom." And that voice is never going to come unless it's satan himself. Do you need to hear the voice of God to understand his law? Or would even that way would you keep supporting sin?

I'm not supporting sin. I'm supporting love, and I don't see a loving romantic relationship between two people if the same sex as an exception.

Would you? That's all it would take? A great booming voice from the sky that says murder is OK? That's all it would take?





How do you know we do not think about them? The ancient rules given to the Jews (civil law) were given in a world where these regulations seemed foreign to man's thinking.

Satan rules the world where ever God's law does not prevail. In the ancient lands around Israel? Homosexual expression was seen as a norm. So was adultery and pediastry. Even sex with an animal was seen as nothing to get upset about. Would it take a big booming voice from the sky to tell you that sex with your dog is not OK?



Are they just as brave as Muslims who blow themselves up on buses? According to your logic? Now, that's bravery for what one believes!

In other words? Bravery motivated by error? Is stupid. Very stupid.

The odds that are set against you does not make one brave. Evil produces a form of bravery which is stupid.

Bravery in itself is not a virtue. Nor is loyalty. Many were loyal to Hitler. Were they virtuous?

Patience in itself is not virtue. The Islamic extremists are very patient in waiting for their next strike. Are they virtuous?

The only true virtue is living by God's truth in the power of the Spirit. It does not matter how many Christians live reactionary legalistic lives that counter the very same words the virtuous live by.

The Bible when seen through the eyes of evil is stupidity. Yet, the same Bible when seen through eyes of the heart, which are enabled by the Spirit? Is wisdom.

Ephesians 1:18 niv​

"I pray also that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in the saints."​

Grace and peace, GeneZ

By the way...... who is the artist on "Don't download this song?"

Well, it seems that we don't agree, because I don't believe that homosexuality is a sin... so I can't really argue, because it's all just one opinion against another opinion anyway.

As for the song, it's a song by Weird Al Yankovic

 

[imind]

You want to rip our life out by the roots by redefining our most sacred traditions like marriage to suit your own purposes. I think you are pushing for rights of homosexuals to supercede that of religious freedom so you can make it illegal for people to follow the Bible. Keep pursuing this course and you will find that a lot of Christians will not tolerate your mockery of Christianity very peacefully at all.

marriage was around long before christianity, and the church does not own the practice. one could argue, in fact, that the church did the very thing you are accusing others of doing.

making it illegal to follow the bible? strawman.

 

[belladonic-haze]

so rude.

just because people are gay, doesn't mean they don't love god, some of them really do...

Don't get upset. Some people think they can cast stones. Remember what Jesus said about them?

Matthew 7: 1"Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you.

3"Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye. 6"Do not give dogs what is sacred; do not throw your pearls to pigs. If you do, they may trample them under their feet, and then turn and tear you to pieces.

and....if people believe homosexuality is a sin (which I disagree with)....

John 8:6-8

6This they said, tempting him, that they might have to accuse him. But Jesus stooped down, and with his finger wrote on the ground, as though he heard them not.
7So when they continued asking him, he lifted up himself, and said unto them, He that is without sin among you, let him first cast a stone at her. 8And again he stooped down, and wrote on the ground.

I found out that there are indeed false prophets out here in this world. Just realize that God is a compassionate God and that he loves us whether we are gay straight or bi....Why would God oppose of something so beautiful as love between two people that,
well, love each other to the moon and back?