Why are there so many atheists on a Christian site?

jackcv · May 15, 2015

wogspeaker said:
Had you truly known Christ as your savior, you would still be such.

As a Christian, I have to take issue with this statement on scriptural grounds. Satan truly knows the Jesus is the Savior, and potentially his Savior, if he was capable of repentance and being one with God and Christ. But for Lucifer, unity is Me, Myself and I. Everyone else is food. He has no desire to do anything in the name of Jesus Christ. He hates the plan of happiness. Some people just do.

Don’t try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time, and it irritates the pig.

Fromgenesis · May 15, 2015

Floyd20 said:
W
May it surely not be mentioned that the atheists and agnostics be getting into the Kingdom of heaven more surely than the "Christian saints." If tax collectors and prostitutes can do it, why not atheists and agnostics. Perhaps Christians would have good reason to watch such people and not just for purposes of social control.

Indeed, all are not Christians that proclaim the gospel.(See
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."
It is often the tax collectors and prostitutes that were in Jesus' presence - not because He condoned their activities but they found value in his words. Consider the woman that was caught in adultery. Jesus did not say " It's OK, go ahead". Instead He said "Go and sin no more" - the same He says to every one of us (and I can echo Paul's words " 1Ti 1:15 This is a faithful saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief"
I am sorry to have to admit that the church has lost its way and witness. "Word of faith" and the "Prosperity gospel" is now in vogue - "Your best life now". Our sermons have become entertainment oriented instead of proclaiming the gospel of forgiveness but also God's wrath to "ye that work iniquity". Few heed the comment by James
Jas 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?
Jas 2:15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,
Jas 2:16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?
Jas 2:17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

Jesus has indeed come not to judge but to save.

But as to the question why one would visit forums where the "opposition" is, my reason for visiting for instance atheist or SDA (Seventh Day Adventist) forums, is that it seems good to me to have my views challenged as it brings new light and have always confirmed my faith in Christ, and understanding the Bible better. I would call myself a "fundamentalist", not believing in theistic evolution, believe in a literal 6 day creation etc.

quatona · May 15, 2015

Joshua260 said:
Again you refuse to answer a simple question.

Again, you appear to not even have read my response.
I did answer your question, even though it was totally off-topic.

jackcv · May 15, 2015

jackcv said:
I’m an occasional visitor to this site, and got an email about this thread. Hope that, after reading 9 or 10 pages, I’ve got the general drift and will not be an irritant.

The atheists seem to be pretty consistent in their demand for a Demonstrable God. I promise that He wants to and will demonstrate Himself to the honest seeker who has a sincere heart and real intent. The promise is sure, to those who ask - in the name of Jesus Christ. Like “abracadabra”, you know, magic words.

Uh, no.

“In the name of Jesus Christ” means, among other things, in the service of Jesus Christ. Are you seeking God in order to serve the Savior of the world – in order to join Him in his great work of love? Or are you just curious? Just talking? No points for just talking. No points for just knowing, or for just having faith to move mountains, no points for bestowing all one’s goods to feed the poor, no points for giving one’s body to be burned. (1 Cor 13:1-3).

Add to the above, no points for "just hanging out."

The Father gives points only for those who serve in (not give) charity, the pure love of Christ that leads one to consecrate one’s self to a purpose higher than self, as God does (Lev 11:44 – see the Hebrew qadash, used 3 times in this short verse). Is that why you are seeking to know Him?...to be qadash, as He is qadash?

You don’t need to answer these questions to me, but you can answer them to yourself by reviewing what you are doing with the blessings you already enjoy? How much do you regularly sacrifice for others in your life?

What if Jesus really is the Creator of the world (though not the creator of the eternal soul), and left His throne to come to earth, born in a barn, life threatened, a refugee, rejected by his own, making an infinite, unimaginable Atonement, giving His life, His flesh and blood, and then rising from the tomb in glory? What will you do then? Do you really intend to do all He asks of you? Are you asking, like Paul, “Lord, what wilt thou have me to do?”

-------
And BTW, the problem many of you have with evil disappears like putrid smoke in a breeze when you reject the apostate notion of “ex nihilo” creation – that God created everything and everyone out of nothing.

peanutaxis · May 15, 2015

Why are there so many atheists on a Christian site?

Because there are so many theists in a godless universe.

oi_antz · May 15, 2015

GrimKingGrim said:
Ahaha. No. Very flimsy.

Are you able to substantiate this claim?

GrimKingGrim · May 15, 2015

oi_antz said:
Are you able to substantiate this claim?

Yea. The argument was based off of a false premise. Makes for a paper thin argument

wogspeaker · May 15, 2015

True Scotsman said:
I'll tell you one thing. I spend time over at thethinkingatheist.com and the theists who come there are usually very rude and condescending and also very, very ignorant. They bring the same old tired arguments and generally make a bad job of it.

Hey, just a thought, but maybe the rude or condescending theists are not true believers in Christ, but are servants of deception designed to bolster your pride and keep you in unbelief. Or maybe some, who you perceive as rude, are telling you the painful truths you need to hear that you might escape the judgement of God?

Floyd20 · May 15, 2015

I post rarely too. Got an e-mail of this thread and decided to respond. Recently read "Memoirs of a Madman" by Gustave Flaubert in French and English as an e-book. It seems a bit like Solomon's writings such as Song of Songs and Ecclesiastes only perhaps a bit more secular and maybe even irreverent. But I did enjoy it as literature. I also recently read "Grief and Pain in the Plan of God: Christian Assurance and the Message of Lamentations" by Walter C. Kaiser, Jr. and actually enjoyed reading about grief and pain as Hope was not hidden there -- at least not hidden to the Christian who seeks assiduously to give reason for His Hope. Serious, sober Hope that is. By giving a reason for our Hope -- amidst the protestations of the world (and atheists) -- we can sometimes see our faith grow. But true, if we are all to be evangelists, then we must not do so in vain. We must be ever more obedient and ever more loving -- which amount to the same thing. But, yes, thanks for the admonition (nouthetic counselling still lives). How does one become meek without being disorderly?

Eudaimonist · May 15, 2015

Colter said:
With like a hard core atheist it all happens at one time.

Are you admitting that faith as a means of knowledge is epistemologically circular?

eudaimonia,

Mark

oi_antz · May 15, 2015

GrimKingGrim said:
Yea. The argument was based off of a false premise. Makes for a paper thin argument

But it is thick with truth. The truth can only be ignored or buried, it cannot be changed. Would you like to have a go at proving that it is paper thin? I don't think it is, and if you do then one of us must be wrong.

RSLancastr · May 15, 2015

Songsmith said:
I mean, not that I want them gone, but it just seems strange to me that so many atheists would choose to spend their time and eergy on a site that is antithetical to their worldview. The interesting thing to me is that they don't seem to be here to proselytize, which would make sense to me. I assume that they, or many of them anyway, feela sense of community here if they've been here for a while. So, if not to show the poor theist the freedom of atheism, what is the draw?

Songsmith, I am an Agnostic, and have yet to spend much time here. But, from my experience over the years on forums of many kinds, I think it is safe to say that there may be as many reasons (or combinations of reasons) as there are Atheists here.

Some possible reasons which come to mind:

Trolling. No matter the topic of a given forum, there always seem to be people there who delight in causing a ruckus, often by posting things they hope will rile up the "natives", whether or not the troll even believes what they are posting. Endless debates which go nowhere are another popular trolling tactic.
Sharpening their debating skills.
Honestly wanting to understand the other side's point of view. I have participated on many forums for this very reason.
"Converting" Hopes of showing/convincing the "natives" to change their opinion on the forum's topic.
Cultural Exchange. An honest desire to exchange ideas with the "natives" about the topic of the forum.
un-demonizing their point of view. By expressing their view respectfully but firmly, Hoping to show the "natives" that not everyone on the "other side of the fence" is a jerk.

...and a host of other reasons, I am sure, such as genuinely liking the community, Enjoying the feeling of being the "Outsider" and many others.

I hope this helps,

-RSL

wogspeaker · May 15, 2015

jackcv said:
As a Christian, I have to take issue with this statement on scriptural grounds. Satan truly knows the Jesus is the Savior, and potentially his Savior, if he was capable of repentance and being one with God and Christ. But for Lucifer, unity is Me, Myself and I. Everyone else is food. He has no desire to do anything in the name of Jesus Christ. He hates the plan of happiness. Some people just do.

Don’t try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time, and it irritates the pig.

Not sure how your rebuttal was at all scripturally based. Please explain where scripture says that Jesus is potentially Lucifer's savior, or how people are food for Lucifer.

GrimKingGrim · May 15, 2015

oi_antz said:
But it is thick with truth. The truth can only be ignored or buried, it cannot be changed. Would you like to have a go at proving that it is paper thin? I don't think it is, and if you do then one of us must be wrong.

If it's an argument based entirely on a false premise how can it have truth? Truth about the straw man atheist? My goodness...

GrimKingGrim · May 15, 2015

wogspeaker said:
Hey, just a thought, but maybe the rude or condescending theists are not true believers in Christ, but are servants of deception designed to bolster your pride and keep you in unbelief. Or maybe some, who you perceive as rude, are telling you the painful truths you need to hear that you might escape the judgement of God?

No, no, and no. It's just over on TTA or AF they don't tolerate the circle logic that is routine here. It's pretty annoying and when you're in the lion's den you're not supposed to dance around covered in meat.

Alot of fanatic Theists on AF get banned FAST. I mean they don't even reach 30-50 posts. It's not because they're theists, it's because they come in waving that "you're all sinners, Christ is gonna judge, etc" flag and in that community, it's not received very well.

wogspeaker · May 15, 2015

GrimKingGrim said:
No, no, and no. It's just over on TTA or AF they don't tolerate the circle logic that is routine here. It's pretty annoying and when you're in the lion's den you're not supposed to dance around covered in meat.

Alot of fanatic Theists on AF get banned FAST. I mean they don't even reach 30-50 posts. It's not because they're theists, it's because they come in waving that "you're all sinners, Christ is gonna judge, etc" flag and in that community, it's not received very well.

Actually the two options I offered you are plausible, though you refuse them outright.

GrimKingGrim said:
No, no, and no. It's just over on TTA or AF they don't tolerate the circle logic that is routine here. It's pretty annoying and when you're in the lion's den you're not supposed to dance around covered in meat.

Alot of fanatic Theists on AF get banned FAST. I mean they don't even reach 30-50 posts. It's not because they're theists, it's because they come in waving that "you're all sinners, Christ is gonna judge, etc" flag and in that community, it's not received very well.

Of course it's not received well. The truth that atheists seek to deny is incredibly painful, and won't be tolerated. I can understand the Atheist desire to refute God, there is a lot at stake in denying your own creator.

oi_antz · May 15, 2015

GrimKingGrim said:
If it's an argument based entirely on a false premise how can it have truth? Truth about the straw man atheist? My goodness...

According to definition above, I am trolling you. Sorry about that, it will not be useful. BTW, you do appear to be a blowfish.

wogspeaker · May 15, 2015

wogspeaker said:
Actually the two options I offered you are plausible, though you refuse them outright.

Of course it's not received well. The truth that atheists seek to deny is incredibly painful, and won't be tolerated. I can understand the Atheist desire to refute God, there is a lot at stake in denying your own creator.

Besides that, it isn't guilt that leads us to true repentance anyway. Guilt forces us into meaningless religious exercise. Gratitude drives us to love and to give of ourselves the way Christ did.

Bex. · May 15, 2015

Personally, I'm genuinely curious as to why people continue to believe what is from an objective standing, unbelievable.

I'm not just referring to Christianity either; subjects like Climate Change, Evolution, basically any belief that goes against current and well established scientific understanding of the world around us. I'm curious about those things because I believe that denying them is ultimately damaging to the human race to the extent of threatening our survival altogether. Coming here, understanding the people that hold those beliefs, helps me to compel the more reasonable people I meet from day to day to rethink their positions as quite often they're held on very flimsy grounds.

Now that I've opened that powder keg, I suppose I should step away before the spark ignites it.

GrimKingGrim · May 15, 2015

wogspeaker said:
Actually the two options I offered you are plausible, though you refuse them outright.

Those were?

Of course it's not received well.

Let me cut you off here, it's because it's annoying, that's why it's not received well... continue

The truth that atheists seek to deny is incredibly painful, and won't be tolerated.

No they tolerate it, but they ask them to prove their claims. And when they start getting super defensive and using insults or start using circle logic they stamp it out. Best not let a fire get too big.

I can understand the Atheist desire to refute God, there is a lot at stake in denying your own creator.

You don't get this atheism thing do you?

oi_antz said:
According to definition above, I am trolling you. Sorry about that, it will not be useful. BTW, you do appear to be a blowfish.

Drat, you've discovered me.

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