Why are Christians treating me this way?

[Jay NotApplicable]

Hi, you might already know about my situation from previous posts, but some people might be new here, so forgive me for repeating myself about anything.

I've spent my entire adult life helping people. I had a dozen foster children in all, I've provided homes for the homeless, I pick up hitchhikers whenever I see them, I'm poor but I donate to other poorer people when they cross my path, and I help anybody who asks for my help.

So now when I'm in a time of need, I expect that others would treat me the way I've spent my life treating others. But I find it incredibly difficult to get any help at all from Christians. Nobody except my friends and family are willing to help me, with the exception of one very generous person here on the forums who donated $10 to me.

In addition to asking Christians for money, I also asked literally dozens of churches in my area for help. And not one was willing to give me a dime, except for the church that I actually attend. The pastor there gave me $2 cash.

I am on social security disability, and I've been trying to find a job that I can do for a year now, but nobody will hire me. So I've given up wasting my time trying to find a job that's not there, and I've started my own business. It's a video editing business. I convert people's old VHS home movies to DVD and YouTube videos. I also can convert other formats that were invented in the 1980's and 1990's, such as 9mm. But getting my business started required a few hundred dollars. And nobody was willing to help me until my stepmother got her tax return and lent me some money.

Now I've only just a day ago launched my business, and I haven't received any money from the business just yet. So lately I've been in need of a few dollars. But Christians are unwilling to help me. So I turned to the atheists. And you know what? They helped me. They know that I'm a Christian, and they respect me. And they are willing to help me. I think it's sad when the church won't help a Christian out, but atheists will.

 

[Senator Cheese]

I think it's sad when humans don't help each other out, regardless of faith, creed or color. As to why you are receiving little support from your environment is something we (or at least I) can't answer from 5000 miles away. When it comes to the wallet, most people will be very careful in terms of donations. This can have many reasons, not limited to:

- having own expenditures/debts and being unable to afford donating money
- doubting the sincerity or need of the individual asking
- doubting that the money will be used for good

These are legitimate concerns. Obviously, many more reasons will be illegitimate and self-centered.

I sincerely hope that you will get through tough times and that your business turns out to be a success. I also hope you will find people who support you and your cause, and I hope you can bring up forgiveness and/or understanding for those who have refused to help you.

 

[Strathos]

I may be risking a political flame war here, but I think this is more of a conservative vs. liberal issue, rather than a Christian vs. atheist issue.

 

[Jay NotApplicable]

I may be risking a political flame war here, but I think this is more of a conservative vs. liberal issue, rather than a Christian vs. atheist issue.

Maybe, I don't know. But I think many people from both camps are stingy with money and don't take Jesus seriously when He talked about giving alms.

 

[wanderingone]

I may be risking a political flame war here, but I think this is more of a conservative vs. liberal issue, rather than a Christian vs. atheist issue.

I don't know if it's either of those things. It may be that people with limited resources available themselves choose to help those who need something like food or shelter, and don't consider it an obligation to help someone start a business.

In terms of needing a few dollars, I suspect again people reserve resources for those who have no income at all and are likely to direct you to places that provide material goods rather than giving cash.

 

[Jay NotApplicable]

I don't know if it's either of those things. It may be that people with limited resources available themselves choose to help those who need something like food or shelter, and don't consider it an obligation to help someone start a business.

In terms of needing a few dollars, I suspect again people reserve resources for those who have no income at all and are likely to direct you to places that provide material goods rather than giving cash.

The problem is that I'm on the verge of being homeless myself. I don't have any money, and the income I have from social security isn't enough to pay the bills. My business idea is my only hope at not becoming homeless. But that doesn't matter anyway, because I didn't tell the churches about my business. I just told them that I'm disabled and that I have children that I need to take care of, and don't have the resources to do that.

It's not because the churches or the people don't have enough money. I asked churches in very affluent neighborhoods for help as well as all the other churches. The churches where many of the millionaires in my part of the state live wouldn't help me.

It's all about the money. Not all churches are bad, but many are. And the churches with the most influence are the ones that have the richest people donating to them.

When I was protesting at Occupy Wall Street, the cops raided our camp at midnight and drove us through the streets for hours, pepper spraying anyone who was too tired to keep walking. We were forced to walk for miles through New York. We eventually sought refuge at a piece of property owned by a Christian church. The church elders had an emergency meeting to decide what to do about all of us. They made their decision and told the cops to arrest us for trespassing. Now of course this is because a lot of the money that was going into the church was coming from affluent Wall Street businessmen.

If you would like to read more about my trip to Occupy Wall Street, please go to my website: www.JLakoda.com.

 

[Nithavela]

Hi, you might already know about my situation from previous posts, but some people might be new here, so forgive me for repeating myself about anything.

I've spent my entire adult life helping people. I had a dozen foster children in all, I've provided homes for the homeless, I pick up hitchhikers whenever I see them, I'm poor but I donate to other poorer people when they cross my path, and I help anybody who asks for my help.

So now when I'm in a time of need, I expect that others would treat me the way I've spent my life treating others. But I find it incredibly difficult to get any help at all from Christians. Nobody except my friends and family are willing to help me, with the exception of one very generous person here on the forums who donated $10 to me.

In addition to asking Christians for money, I also asked literally dozens of churches in my area for help. And not one was willing to give me a dime, except for the church that I actually attend. The pastor there gave me $2 cash.

I am on social security disability, and I've been trying to find a job that I can do for a year now, but nobody will hire me. So I've given up wasting my time trying to find a job that's not there, and I've started my own business. It's a video editing business. I convert people's old VHS home movies to DVD and YouTube videos. I also can convert other formats that were invented in the 1980's and 1990's, such as 9mm. But getting my business started required a few hundred dollars. And nobody was willing to help me until my stepmother got her tax return and lent me some money.

Now I've only just a day ago launched my business, and I haven't received any money from the business just yet. So lately I've been in need of a few dollars. But Christians are unwilling to help me. So I turned to the atheists. And you know what? They helped me. They know that I'm a Christian, and they respect me. And they are willing to help me. I think it's sad when the church won't help a Christian out, but atheists will.

Christians will not help you because of your good deeds, because in their (and your, judging from your faith icon) religion, all good deeds are ultimately meaningless, you remain a filthy sinner in the eyes of your god and no good deed can change that. Only by being reborn, you are transformed into a true, born again christian and after that not only officially saved, but also officially better than everybody else.

Meanwhile, atheists look at your deeds and think "hey, this guy is actually okay, let's help him."

 

[Jay NotApplicable]

I have been reborn. I've turned everything over to God. I have financial problems, but I am a very happy person.

 

[Nickybobby]

Christians will not help you because of your good deeds, because in their (and your, judging from your faith icon) religion, all good deeds are ultimately meaningless, you remain a filthy sinner in the eyes of your god and no good deed can change that. Only by being reborn, you are transformed into a true, born again christian and after that not only officially saved, but also officially better than everybody else.

Meanwhile, atheists look at your deeds and think "hey, this guy is actually okay, let's help him."

I don't know if I've read a post on these forums that's filled with more outright incorrect information than this one.

1. Good deeds are not meaningless to Christians, in fact we are called to perform good deeds. The distinction is that works do not equal salvation. Where you are correct is that, regardless of our deeds, we all remain filthy sinners - but those of us who find Christ can be spiritually restored.

2. No where in the scriptures will you find any suggestion that those who are "born again" are "officially better than everybody else." Going back to point #1, we recognize that we are still filthy sinners and that we deserve death(the wages of sin) but have been blessed with the Gift of God (eternal life). We hope that everyone else can become blessed in the same way.

3. You've grouped all atheists into some altruistic philanthropic club, which doesn't actually exist. Nice stereotyping!

 

[Nickybobby]

My question to the OP: When you discuss being turned down by multiple churches/Christians for donations, what were you specifically asking them for? Many of these organizations do not hand out cash...that's not really their job. Many will: help you pay an actual bill that you bring to them, provide you with food, get you counseling.

Do you have a business plan? Have you laid out how the money will be spent? Have you done any market research? If the answer to these questions is no, I don't blame anyone for not handing you piles of cash. I'm sorry if that's offensive, but driving down the street I see an awful lot of hands out. I can't help each person who THINKS they need my money, partly because the government is already taking an unfair share of it for those who DON'T need it but more so because there are too many hands looking for alms.

Often the key is how you approach things. The church was not designed to be "Bank of 1st United Methodist." Further, Christians are called to be good stewards of their money. Ask for money, you'll likely be denied. Approach someone and ask for assistance with starting a new business: "Hey preacher, is there anyone in the congregation who's got experience starting a new business that you could put me in contact with?" - you might get better results.

 

[High Fidelity]

I think in short, there are just as many 'bad' theists as there are atheists.

One Christian might help, another might not.

One Atheist might help, another might not.

It really depends on the person, regardless of what they label themselves as.

 

[High Fidelity]

The problem is that I'm on the verge of being homeless myself. I don't have any money, and the income I have from social security isn't enough to pay the bills. My business idea is my only hope at not becoming homeless. But that doesn't matter anyway, because I didn't tell the churches about my business. I just told them that I'm disabled and that I have children that I need to take care of, and don't have the resources to do that.

It's not because the churches or the people don't have enough money. I asked churches in very affluent neighborhoods for help as well as all the other churches. The churches where many of the millionaires in my part of the state live wouldn't help me.

It's all about the money. Not all churches are bad, but many are. And the churches with the most influence are the ones that have the richest people donating to them.

When I was protesting at Occupy Wall Street, the cops raided our camp at midnight and drove us through the streets for hours, pepper spraying anyone who was too tired to keep walking. We were forced to walk for miles through New York. We eventually sought refuge at a piece of property owned by a Christian church. The church elders had an emergency meeting to decide what to do about all of us. They made their decision and told the cops to arrest us for trespassing. Now of course this is because a lot of the money that was going into the church was coming from affluent Wall Street businessmen.

If you would like to read more about my trip to Occupy Wall Street, please go to my website: www.JLakoda.com.

I really don't mean this is a bad way, but I watched a few live streams of services over in the US when I'd been too ill to go to church myself and US churches seem to stream services a lot more commonly than over here, but nearly every single one I watched, the pastor had his hand out.

So, I really don't know where all that money goes, but they were quite bold in their approach and their expectations.

I'd be extremely put off if that was my church.

 

[Jay NotApplicable]

My question to the OP: When you discuss being turned down by multiple churches/Christians for donations, what were you specifically asking them for?

First off I need to say that I’m going to leave a few details out of what I’m going to say to protect the privacy of a mother.

Anyway, I didn’t discuss my business idea at all. I didn’t tell them about my business idea. I just basically told them that I was on Social Security Disability for schizophrenia. I said I didn’t have enough money to pay for the the place I was living at and the electric, and gas bills. And that I didn’t have enough money to buy diapers for a baby who I saved from a planned abortion. I convinced the babies mother not to have the abortion by telling her I would help her take care of the baby. And that’s what I’m doing now. But none of the dozens of churches I contacted were willing to give me a dime, except for the church that I actually attend. The pastor gave me $2 cash for me to put gas in my car to get to church.

 

[Nithavela]

You convinces a woman to give birth by telling her you would support her, and this while not being even sure how to feed yourself? This is grossly irresponsible.

 

[Jay NotApplicable]

You convinces a woman to give birth by telling her you would support her, and this while not being even sure how to feed yourself? This is grossly irresponsible.

<staff edit> She is very thankful for me having helped her out in a time of emotional distress, and for me helping her to change diapers and pay for them with my own social security money. I saved this child's life, and I'm continuing to trust God that He will somehow provide for me, which He has been doing for most of my adult life. So many times I trusted God to pay the bills. And when it came time to pay the rent, and I didn't know where the money was going to come from, every time God had money find me. Sometimes the day before rent was due. I trust God, and He has provided for me.

 

[paul becke]

You convinces a woman to give birth by telling her you would support her, and this while not being even sure how to feed yourself? This is grossly irresponsible.

So was the widow who gave her last mite.

Is what you consider excessive, financial liberality more iniquitous than killing an unborn child? Weigh the two in the balance, and wake up.

I should have said, 'objectively iniquitous', since it sometimes happens in our wretched world that the mother concerned is as much a victim.

 

[PsychoSarah]

<staff edit> She is very thankful for me having helped her out in a time of emotional distress, and for me helping her to change diapers and pay for them with my own social security money. I saved this child's life, and I'm continuing to trust God that He will somehow provide for me, which He has been doing for most of my adult life. So many times I trusted God to pay the bills. And when it came time to pay the rent, and I didn't know where the money was going to come from, every time God had money find me. Sometimes the day before rent was due. I trust God, and He has provided for me.

I will say it is sad that so many pregnancies are terminated because of financial reasons, who knows how many babies would be saved were there to be institutions which help single parents find work and have child care covered by insurance for the first year. I am pro choice, but overall I feel that it would be better to eliminate the occurrence of unwanted, ill planned pregnancies than terminating them. You know, preventing the problem at its source.

However, while I know your heart was in a good place, it might not have been well thought out. But I do think that if you brought the abortion thing up rather than your own needs more people would be generous towards you.

 

[Sojourner1]

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[freedomissacred]

Hi, you might already know about my situation from previous posts, but some people might be new here, so forgive me for repeating myself about anything.

I've spent my entire adult life helping people. I had a dozen foster children in all, I've provided homes for the homeless, I pick up hitchhikers whenever I see them, I'm poor but I donate to other poorer people when they cross my path, and I help anybody who asks for my help.

So now when I'm in a time of need, I expect that others would treat me the way I've spent my life treating others. But I find it incredibly difficult to get any help at all from Christians. Nobody except my friends and family are willing to help me, with the exception of one very generous person here on the forums who donated $10 to me.

In addition to asking Christians for money, I also asked literally dozens of churches in my area for help. And not one was willing to give me a dime, except for the church that I actually attend. The pastor there gave me $2 cash.

I am on social security disability, and I've been trying to find a job that I can do for a year now, but nobody will hire me. So I've given up wasting my time trying to find a job that's not there, and I've started my own business. It's a video editing business. I convert people's old VHS home movies to DVD and YouTube videos. I also can convert other formats that were invented in the 1980's and 1990's, such as 9mm. But getting my business started required a few hundred dollars. And nobody was willing to help me until my stepmother got her tax return and lent me some money.

Now I've only just a day ago launched my business, and I haven't received any money from the business just yet. So lately I've been in need of a few dollars. But Christians are unwilling to help me. So I turned to the atheists. And you know what? They helped me. They know that I'm a Christian, and they respect me. And they are willing to help me. I think it's sad when the church won't help a Christian out, but atheists will.

I understand your predicament. You believe you are entitled to the kind of help you have offered others, but maybe you have some blind spots?

#1. The fact that you list all the things you've done means you're missing the part of Holy Scripture that instructs us to give of ourselves completely, that is, to not expect a return. You are listing these things because now you expect a return. It is not the fault of the people who turn away from you, they probably often wish they could help, but clearly the Lord is not putting it in their heart or their resources to help you.

#2. If this feeling of entitlement goes back to when you had the resources to help others, perhaps it was setting you up for just exactly this kind of frustration, because you were actually "investing", not "giving".

#3. You might be breaking the 10th Commandment, "Do not covet...", and unwittingly placing yourself in a state of serious sin. The Christians who are rejecting your pleas for help might be unconsciously sensing this and spiritually praying for you.

This 10th commandment is a very subtle commandment. It is at the root of the previous 9.

Jay Notapplicable, I hope you will take my post in the love it is offered and deeply understand that if I had a million dollars right now, I would not send you any money, because you really don't need it.

What you need is an epiphany. Only the Holy Spirit can give you one.

 

[Strathos]

I think in short, there are just as many 'bad' theists as there are atheists.

One Christian might help, another might not.

One Atheist might help, another might not.

It really depends on the person, regardless of what they label themselves as.

This is quite true.