Why are Christians so incredibly deceived about scripture?

[Goatee]

Sin............I am circled by it!

 

[ToBeLoved]

Actually, no. There are 1,050 + Commands in the New Testament and not just the greatest two.

In fact, believing on Jesus is a Commandment (See 1 John 3:23).


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That no one that does not believe in Him will follow because they do not think God is real?

That is really grasping as we can see it repeats the second most important commandment right after it.

It is sharing the gospel. Belief in Jesus Christ and His finished work on the cross.

 

[W2L]

Pray for me brothers.

 

[W2L]

1000 commands in the NT? Somehow I doubt that. Many of the same commands are reiterated throughout the NT. Someone must be counting them wrong.

 

[Paul Yohannan]

Does the Holy Spirit then leave the person if they boast or become inflated by pride? Because the Holy Spirit is the seal of the New Covenant and the Holy Spirit testifies with our spirit that we are Christ's Own.

So the Holy Spirit would have to leave the believer then for what you say to be true?

Eventually, in the most severe cases of spiritual delusion, or prelest as it is called in Orthodox monastic texts, yes; the person by unrepentantly clinging to the passion of pride commits apostasy by substituting worship of themselves for worship of God, which is the devil's objective, and they can fall into demonic posession or alternately enter into a state of synergy with the devil, where the Holy Spirit has left them and been replaced by what one might call the spirit of anti-Christ.

As Metropolitan Kallistos Ware has pointed out, the one thing God cannot do is force us to love him, since true love is consensual. Thus a person having acquired the Holy Spirit may lose Him through apostasy. If someone leaves the Orthodox Church and re-enters it is normal for the seal of the Holy Spirit to be reconferred by repeating the sacrament of chrismation. Chrismation is also in the toolkit of priests and bishops called on to perform exorcism.

In the most extreme cases we tragically see no shred of repentence. Consider the case of Arius; his heresy was preceded by ascetic labours, but he became inflated with pride and went on to deny the very deity of Christ, and he never repented. The Orthodox monastic literature is full of examples of monks who fell into this delusion and were persuaded by devils to throw themselves off mountains, because thinking they had purified themselves of sin, fallen angels posing as regular angels persuaded them they would be carried aloft in their holiness. In another famous case, a father and son had entered a monastery together; the father became deluded thinking himself like Abraham and planned to offer his son as a sacrifice. The son noticed his father acting suspiciously with a knife, and thus with the help of the other monks was able to restrain him preventing him from murdering his son.

A few Orthodox saints in monasteries fell into prelest, often by attempting to live as solitaries without adequete spiritual preparation, but they were saved by the brethren, and went on to bear the Holy Spirit to such an extreme extent as to be glorified.

 

[Paul Yohannan]

Pray for me brothers.

I will do so, God bless you.

 

[ToBeLoved]

1000 commands in the NT? Somehow I doubt that. Many of the same commands are reiterated throughout the NT. Someone must be counting them wrong.

Ask Jason to list them for us.

Jason please list all the commands.

Does the New Testament even have 1,000 words in it? Hmm... I'll have to check.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Eventually, in the most severe cases of spiritual delusion, or prelest as it is called in Orthodox monastic texts, yes; the person by unrepentantly clinging to the passion of pride commits apostasy by substituting worship of themselves for worship of God, which is the devil's objective, and they can fall into demonic posession or alternately enter into a state of synergy with the devil, where the Holy Spirit has left them and been replaced by what one might call the spirit of anti-Christ.

As Metropolitan Kallistos Ware has pointed out, the one thing God cannot do is force us to love him, since true love is consensual. Thus a person having acquired the Holy Spirit may lose Him through apostasy. If someone leaves the Orthodox Church and re-enters it is normal for the seal of the Holy Spirit to be reconferred by repeating the sacrament of chrismation. Chrismation is also in the toolkit of priests and bishops called on to perform exorcism.

In the most extreme cases we tragically see no shred of repentence. Consider the case of Arius; his heresy was preceded by ascetic labours, but he became inflated with pride and went on to deny the very deity of Christ, and he never repented. The Orthodox monastic literature is full of examples of monks who fell into this delusion and were persuaded by devils to throw themselves off mountains, because thinking they had purified themselves of sin, fallen angels posing as regular angels persuaded them they would be carried aloft in their holiness. In another famous case, a father and son had entered a monastery together; the father became deluded thinking himself like Abraham and planned to offer his son as a sacrifice. The son noticed his father acting suspiciously with a knife, and thus with the help of the other monks was able to restrain him preventing him from murdering his son.

A few Orthodox saints in monasteries fell into prelest, often by attempting to live as solitaries without adequete spiritual preparation, but they were saved by the brethren, and went on to bear the Holy Spirit to such an extreme extent as to be glorified.

But does not God's Word say that God's covenants with us are irrevocable?

How can we then do anything to make God do what God said He would never do? That would mean that God is not righteous, holy and just. That is a slippery slope there.

 

[Paul Yohannan]

It's not that Jesus is more interested in these. These represent the bar He sets for us to achieve. The thing is, even these two simple commandments are impossible for us to maintain or not break.

The ten commandments, and these two, are the stipulations set for humans to be judged against. All, every single one of us will fail to keep them or reach the mark of perfection, as Jesus did.

So, this "new" commandment that Jesus gave us is impossible to maintain without keeping the original ten. Breaking one of the ten will break both of these.

John 3:16 is God showing that He loves us so much that He has provided a way to eternity despite the fact we cannot keep even these two simple commandments.



This Hindu man still needs Christ's gift of salvation. He has still sinned and cannot do enough to save his soul.

This is true; if he does not convert it would still be worthwhile to pray for God to have mercy on Him, for Christ to grant him salvation anyway, but it would be to his extreme benefit if he converted.

Hinduism is such a powerful delusion coupled with so many false ideas like karma, reincarnation, pantheism, and union with God, and self deceptive forms of meditation, which in tje case of Hindu Saddhus or wandering holy men are accompanied by the smoking of much hashish, and it is surrounded by related delusional religions based on the same concept but with some marginal reform or improvement, namely Jainism, Buddhism and Sikhism, that it is really only by the grace of God someone can escape it.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

1000 commands in the NT? Somehow I doubt that. Many of the same commands are reiterated throughout the NT. Someone must be counting them wrong.

Here ya go:

https://www.cai.org/bible-studies/1050-new-testament-commands

The only commands that I did not see on their list is the following:

• Believe & confess that Jesus is God Almighty in the flesh (John 8:24 cf. John 8:57, 58, 59) (1 John 4:3).

• Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. (Mark 16:15)

• Visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction (James 1:27).

• Feed and clothe the poor, welcome the stranger, visit the sick, and those in prison (Matthew 25:35, 36).

• "If you would be perfect, go, sell what you possess and give to the poor" (Matthew 19:21)

• Thank God without ceasing. (1 Thessalonians 2:13)

• Receive the word of God not as the words of men, but as the very words of God (1 Thessalonians 2:13).

• Give to the poor needy brother; Especially if you wish them well (James 2:15)

• Pray the Lord's prayer (As an outline) (Matthew 6:9-13)

• Pray without ceasing (1 Thessalonians 5:17)

• Bear with them that preach another Jesus (2 Corinthians 11:4)

• Reprove the unfruitful works of darkness (Ephesians 5:11)

• Correct and train others in the Word of God (2 Timothy 3:16).

• Walk in the Spirit: This will result in the 9 fruits of the Spirit (Galatians 5)

• How to love according to 1 Corinthians 13.

• Keep the words of the prophecy of Revelation (Revelation 1:3).

• Live by speaking the Word of God (Which is our daily bread) (Matthew 4:4)

• Study to show yourself approved unto God (2 Timothy 2:15)

• Put on the whole armor of God (Ephesians 6:11-17)

• Be ye Holy as God is Holy (1 Peter 1:16)

• Do not add or take away from God's Word (Revelation 22:18, 19)

• If we as believers sin, we are to confess our sins (1 John 2:1) (1 John 1:9)

• Do all things thru Christ (Philippians 4:13)

Granted, I am sure there are more.

Side Note:

Oh, and Paul said that what he had written should be regarded as the Lord's Commandments (1 Corinthians 14:37).

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[Paul Yohannan]

But does not God's Word say that God's covenants with us are irrevocable?

How can we then do anything to make God do what God said He would never do? That would mean that God is not righteous, holy and just. That is a slippery slope there.

Here you confuse the covenants of God with sin and apostasy. Once saved, always saved, is demonstrably false, because even St. Paul feared he would fall away, and many people baptized into Christianity leave. Blasphemy against the Holy Spirit is even characterized as unforgivable.

Gods covenants are irrevocable, by God, because God is a being of perfect love, and also does not change, but is immutable. But we humans have evil in us and can change so as to abandon these covenants, which, for example, the Northern Tribes of Israel did.

But as long as we do not blaspheme the holy spirit, the door is open for us to repent and be forgiven. Indeed the Christian life is one of repentance; this life was given to us for repentance.

 

[Paul Yohannan]

Look, if folks here want to sin, leave God out of it. Go back to your old life if you want to sin or make excuses for it. For Jesus said He would rather you would be hot or cold. For he said if you are lukewarm, He will spew thee out of His mouth. For Jesus and His apostles never encouraged people to hang out in their sins and to think on the blood of Jesus for their salvation and sing Kumbaya. Jesus and his apostles taught for us to live righteously as a part of being forgiven by Jesus (i.e. Meaning we are to follow Jesus as our example). Just do a study on holiness within the New Testament and this will become evident to you. But if you do not care to do so, then you will see whatever you want to see (so as to defend that is okay for believers to "sin").
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It is certainly not "okay" for members of the church to sin, which is why we must avail ourselves of the sacrament of reconciliation before partaking of the Eucharist, lest we partake unworthily and become sick or die (1 Corinthians 11:27-34, which the Revised Common Lectionary scandalously deletes from the Maundy Thursday liturgy).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

I Don't own anything other than tools. Even the apostles had tools. Peter was a fisherman, Paul a tentmaker I think. I fight against the sin in myself daily. I fight the fight of faith.

Obviously Christ was not talking about the clothes on their back and basic things they would need to have while they spread the gospel (like tools), etc. Selling all that they had was in reference to their unnecessary possessions in regards to their ministry.


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[Bible Highlighter]

That no one that does not believe in Him will follow because they do not think God is real?

That is really grasping as we can see it repeats the second most important commandment right after it.

It is sharing the gospel. Belief in Jesus Christ and His finished work on the cross.

Your missing the point. There is more than just two commandments.


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[yeshuaslavejeff]

TITLE: Why are people so incredibly deceived about Scripture ?
Mainly, they don't even bother to read it,
so they have no idea what it says,
and they don't trust God.
Multitudes trust men instead.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

It is certainly not "okay" for members of the church to sin, which is why we must avail ourselves of the sacrament of reconciliation before partaking of the Eucharist, lest we partake unworthily and become sick or die (1 Corinthians 11:27-34, which the Revised Common Lectionary scandalously deletes from the Maundy Thursday liturgy).

I agree. Sin is never okay for a Christian. God cannot condone a believer's thinking that they can sin and still be saved.

As for the Eucharist: Well, I am not in agreement with the Catholic or Eastern Orthodox practices involving the Lord's supper. It was simply a meal during fellowship done in remembrance of our Lord of what He has done for us.


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[yeshuaslavejeff]

Obviously Christ was not talking about the clothes on their back and basic things they would need to have while they spread the gospel (like tools), etc. Selling all that they had was in reference to their unnecessary possessions in regards to their ministry.


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It's been repeated often, and still a good testimony reminder.

Corrie ten Boom was a perfect example of giving up everything.
Her life all of her life was a good testimony of Y'SHUA's SALVATION, living HIS WAY.
She was SAVED (completely, utterly, eternally SAVED) when she was just 5 years old,
and the whole of her life's testimony in Y'SHUA is truth.

Sure, she could have denied CHRIST , especially like other did when tortured to death by the nazis in front of her....
but she didn't.
She endured to the end.

 

[Paul Yohannan]

I agree. Sin is never okay for a Christian. God cannot condone a believer's thinking that they can sin and still be saved.

As for the Eucharist: Well, I am not in agreement with the Catholic or Eastern Orthodox practices involving the Lord's supper. It was simply a meal during fellowship done in remembrance of our Lord of what He has done for us.


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That's not what 1 Corinthians or John 6 say.

 

[Hank77]

Did the disciples sell all that they had? They sure did.

No, Peter left his fishing boat with his father and hired help. Peter also owned a house where his mother-in-law lived.
We don't know what the others owned or didn't own.

 

[JacksBratt]

I am doomed to hell as i am far from capable to be able to help save myself!

Yes, we are all doomed to hell "because we are not able to save ourselves".
That is why Christ came. He paid for our sin and we just have to believe on Him.