Who were the Watchers?

[tonychanyt]

Nebuchadnezzar used the term 'watcher' to describe his dream in Da 4:

13 “I saw in the visions of my head as I lay in bed, and behold, a watcher, a holy one, came down from heaven.

Strong's Hebrew: 5894. עִיר (ir) — 3 Occurrences

a watcher,
עִ֣יר (‘îr)
Noun - masculine singular
Strong's 5894: Waking or wakeful one

The watcher was an angelic being from Heaven, a good and holy angel who delivered a message to Nebuchadnezzar.

14 He proclaimed aloud and said thus: ‘Chop down the tree and lop off its branches, strip off its leaves and scatter its fruit. Let the beasts flee from under it and the birds from its branches. 15But leave the stump of its roots in the earth, bound with a band of iron and bronze, amid the tender grass of the field. Let him be wet with the dew of heaven. Let his portion be with the beasts in the grass of the earth. 16Let his mind be changed from a man’s, and let a beast’s mind be given to him; and let seven periods of time pass over him. 17 The sentence is by the decree of the watchers, the decision by the word of the holy ones,

A group of watchers observed Nebuchadnezzar's behavior and found him lacking. Together, they passed a sentence on him. The sentence was motivated by their goal to glorify God's soverignty:

to the end that the living may know that the Most High rules the kingdom of men and gives it to whom he will and sets over it the lowliest of men.’ 18 This dream I, King Nebuchadnezzar, saw. And you, O Belteshazzar, tell me the interpretation, because all the wise men of my kingdom are not able to make known to me the interpretation, but you are able, for the spirit of the holy gods is in you.”

Nebuchadnezzar wasn't a monotheist.

Who, in fact, passed the sentence on him?

The divine council.

Daniel interpreted the dream for the king using his terminology:

23 "And because the king saw a watcher, a holy one, coming down from heaven and saying, ‘Chop down the tree and destroy it, but leave the stump of its roots in the earth, bound with a band of iron and bronze, in the tender grass of the field, and let him be wet with the dew of heaven, and let his portion be with the beasts of the field, till seven periods of time pass over him,’ 24this is the interpretation, O king: It is a decree of the Most High, which has come upon my lord the king,

The LORD summoned a divine council with Nebuchadnezzar's watchers. They presented the sentence to the LORD, and He approved it.

25 that you shall be driven from among men, and your dwelling shall be with the beasts of the field. You shall be made to eat grass like an ox, and you shall be wet with the dew of heaven, and seven periods of time shall pass over you, till you know that the Most High rules the kingdom of men and gives it to whom he will. 26 And as it was commanded to leave the stump of the roots of the tree, your kingdom shall be confirmed for you from the time that you know that Heaven rules. 27 Therefore, O king, let my counsel be acceptable to you: break off your sins by practicing righteousness, and your iniquities by showing mercy to the oppressed, that there may perhaps be a lengthening of your prosperity.”

Daniel advised the king to repent of his sins and to learn the lesson of the sentence.

The Hebrew term for "watcher" was `îr (עִיר), which literally meant "one who is awake" or "a vigilant one." It referred to a type of heavenly being who observes, reports, and enforces divine decrees. Da 4 depicted the good and holy watchers.

There was another kind of watcher depicted in the Book of Enoch. They were the bad fallen angels who had sex with human females to produce a race of Nephilim. 1 Enoch 15:

3 "The Watchers ... defiled themselves with women, and as the children of earth do, so they did, and took wives for themselves. And they wrought great desolation on the earth."

Who were the watchers?

Nebuchadnezzar was a polytheist. He used the term 'watcher' positively for a good angel who observed humans to try to correct them. In contrast, Enoch used the term negatively for a bad angel who observed humans to corrupt them. The latter group operated outside of God's divine council.

 

[Godsunworthyservant]

The LORD summoned a divine council with Nebuchadnezzar's watchers. They presented the sentence to the LORD, and He approved it.

I never believed that God ever summoned others opinions on any matter. I'm always curious about these things. Where do you get this conclusion? I reread the Chapter to be sure if Daniel didn't say something of that nature and the only thing I can find that sounds similar is in Daniel 4:17 (KJV) where it says; "17This matter is by the decree of the watchers, and the demand by the word of the holy ones: to the intent that the living may know that the most High ruleth in the kingdom of men, and giveth it to whomsoever he will, and setteth up over it the basest of men." I can't reconcile this passage with the idea that God summoned a divine council with the watchers. This verse is part of Nebuchadnezzar's telling of his dream to Daniel. Since Nebuchadnezzar did not believe in the Almighty but worship multiple gods, as you note, he would not have referred to Him in his dream. This is made clear by the fact that Nebuchadnezzar didn't see Daniel as a prophet of a single God but refers to him in the following manner in verses 8-9. Here we read;
8But at the last Daniel came in before me, whose name was Belteshazzar, according to the name of my god, and in whom is the spirit of the holy gods: and before him I told the dream, saying, 9O Belteshazzar, master of the magicians, because I know that the spirit of the holy gods is in thee, and no secret troubleth thee, tell me the visions of my dream that I have seen, and the interpretation thereof.

Notice he refers to Daniel, calling him "Belteshazzar, master of the magicians" and then says "because I know that the spirit of the holy gods is in thee, and no secret troubleth thee". This indicates to me that Nebuchadnezzar saw Daniel as someone who was a prophet of all gods, including his own after which he gave him the name Belteshazzar. So, his reference of "by decree of the watchers" his own description of the dream and nothing more. At any rate he never says that the watchers and God had any divine council over the matter much less that the watchers made or presented any sentence on anyone to God.
If that verse isn't the source of your statement, please advise.

As for the watchers, the apocryphal Books of Enoch tell the story of two hundred Watchers, or angels, sent to watch over humanity. They were initially faithful to God. Then some of them were tempted by earthly women. As you describe, these watchers conspired to commit sins by taking human women as wives and having children with them. They also taught humans many forbidden skills relating to the different arts and sciences. Many in the time of Christ considered that these teachings were the source of sorcery as it existed at the time. Irenaeus, for instance, considered the enchantments and root cutting in these teachings as “the discovery of rare substances, love-potions, aversions, amours, concupiscence, constraints of love, spells of bewitchment, and all sorcery and idolatry hateful to God.” At any rate, God condemned these fallen angels for their actions and assigned archangels to confine them to Tartarus until their final judgment.

That said, I still don't understand from what source you draw the conclusion that the watchers submitted any sentence to God and he simply approved it. Otherwise, you provide some very knowledgeable insight into a matter that I've not heard discussed in quite a while.

 

[tonychanyt]

I never believed that God ever summoned others opinions on any matter. I'm always curious about these things. Where do you get this conclusion?

See Who were members of the divine council? and follow up there.

 

[beedoux]

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