Who is Allah? the poll version

[Lotuspetal_uk]

But are the differences any greater than that of the Christians and the Jews? We all attest to the fact that we worship the God of the Jews. But they also do not believe as we do in Christ.

Yes, definately the differences are greater when cross-referenced. When we say we worship the God of the Jews, to say that means that we must also have access to their book (i.e. the OT) without altering the Jewish accounts on say Solomon, Isaac and Abraham, Adam/Eve & the garden of Eden, Moses etc. Granted not all Christian sects adopt the customs outlined in the OT, but we do not dismiss the OT as being 'corrupted' or tampered with - it's part and parcel of our Book because of the overall message God intended for all mankind which are constant throughout both the Old and New Testaments.

The Muslims believe that both the Jews and Christians corrupted their scriptures and that only some parts of the Old and New Testament contain God's 'original' word. They believe that the true sections are confirmed & verified in the Quran and are thus discouraged from reading the current Jewish and Christian Bibles.

BTW : I could not vote on the poll. I have not been lead to Allah. I am a Christian and only know the truth of my own faith. I can not be the judge of the faith of others. I have no inner knowledge of Allah. But I place no limits on God in his power to draw together all of mankind into his arms.

I understand where you're coming from and I hasten to add I am in no way judging anyone from my post. I am just offering some insight based on what I've read. When I was an atheist I looked into both religions with a preference to Islam. Without going into my testimony I was called to Christ. As I said earlier, I hold a high respect for practicing Muslims as I have learnt a lot from the reverence they hold in their belief of Allah. And when I witness the overtly worldly goings on in our congregations I feel we as Christians need to learn from some Muslims before Christ's return. It's just that for me there are a lot of questions as to whether the personality of Allah shown in the Quran is the same as the God expressed in the Jewish and Christian Bibles.

It is actually written that a time will come when all nations will worship the God - I pray that those who in their heart believe that they are worshiping our Lord will be shown the truth.

 

[sojeru]

there are many el-illah. which one allah is the TRUE ALLAH should be the question.
[there are many gods(dieties). Which one gd is the TRUE GD should be the question.]

there are many elohim(devine beings). Which one el is the TRUE EL should be the question.

shalom

shalom

 

[sojeru]

Hi zico,
you said:
What's in the cross to miss ?
-------------------------------------
please do me this favor.
Pick up a bible and go to Numbers chapter 2.
in it you will see the tribal camps being set around the tabernacle where the Torah of Gd is regulated, with the levites in the center of the congregation of Israel around the temple, and the congregation of Israel is set up around the levites. get a sheet of paper and pencil/pen-
then as you read draw a rectangle for the tabernacle, and draw a compass. do it set up like this north and south is drawn left to right on the paper. north being on the left hand side, and east and west should alrady be set up.

Then right down on the paper where each tribe goes according to their direction on your map.
you will need several sheet sof paper to see the diagram
Pay attention to the amount of people on each side. There will be the smallest amount in the west, the greatest amount in the east, and justabout the same amount heading north and south. also put the people in "boxes" in the direction where they pelong around the temple.
then trace around them. what diagram or symbol do you see?

if you need further directions , just ask

masalaama

 

[Zico]

357magnum,

no.
no.
no.
no.

Brain Damage, Yes,, He is.

salam sojeru,

Pick up a translation of the Qur'an and do the following :

1- Read 30:3 and see for your self which part of earth is the lowest part.
2- Read 4:56 and see for your self how God tells us that our skin is our heat sensor.
3- Read 6:125 then ask an astronaut what does he feel when he ascends in his space ship.

More here http://www.it-is-truth.org/

 

[nChrist]

Today at 04:22 AM Zico said this in Post #104

357magnum,

no.
no.
no.
no.

Is Jesus Christ the Son of God, very God?

Did Jesus Christ die on the cross for the sins of man?

Did Jesus Christ arise from the dead on the third day and ascend back to heaven?

Is belief in Jesus Christ, The Living Saviour, the only way for man to be saved?

Your answer of "NO" to all four of these questions clears up any misunderstanding I might have had about what you believe. Answering "YES" on these questions is the basis for Salvation and the core belief of Christianity. As a result, I don't have a clue what you believe.

 

[Zico]

Well Magnum,

no.4 was somewhat confusing, in my faith believing in Jesus Christ is a corner stone, no muslim is a muslim if he doesn't believe in Christ and his Virgin mother ( pbut ) , but to view him as a saviour,, this is something else in which we don't believe. Allah "God" is the one true saviour and in Him alone we trust for our salvation, even Muhammad (pbuh) is viewed the same way Christ is viewed, he is not different.


2.285 The messenger believeth in that which hath been revealed unto him from his Lord and (so do) believers. Each one believeth in Allah and His angels and His scriptures and His messengers - We make no distinction between any of His messengers - and they say: We hear, and we obey. (Grant us) Thy forgiveness, our Lord. Unto Thee is the journeying.

2.286 Allah tasketh not a soul beyond its scope. For it (is only) that which it hath earned, and against it (only) that which it hath deserved. Our Lord! Condemn us not if we forget, or miss the mark! Our Lord! Lay not on us such a burden as thou didst lay on those before us! Our Lord! Impose not on us that which we have not the strength to bear! Pardon us, absolve us and have mercy on us, Thou, our Protector, and give us victory over the disbelieving folk.

 

[nChrist]

Zico,

I really appreciate you telling me about your faith. I understand that some portions of Scripture in the Qur'an are very close to those in the Holy Bible I study. I've also been told that the Qur'an is a beautiful work of literature, again, much like the Holy Bible. Thanks again for explaining your beliefs.

 

[Zico]

357magnum,

my pleasure, you are welcomed.

 

[Karpousi]

Muslims do not believe that Jesus died on the cross. In fact, he has not died(according to Muslims that I have spoken to.) Could someone verify.

 

[Lotuspetal_uk]

Muslims do not believe that Jesus died on the cross. In fact, he has not died(according to Muslims that I have spoken to.) Could someone verify.

When I asked about this, they said that He was taken up by God similar to Enoch (Gen 5:24).

God bless

 

[berean_315]

Muslims do not believe that Jesus died on the cross. In fact, he has not died(according to Muslims that I have spoken to.) Could someone verify.

This is true. From what I have read they say someone was made to look like Jesus and take his place on the cross, but there is a difference of opinion on who it was. I've read that some Muslims think it was Judas Iscariot. See below for a passage from the Qur'an. This is a MAJOR difference between Christianity and Islam on the very nature and person of Jesus Christ, His atonement for man's sins, etc.  

 

"That they uttered against Mary a grave false charge. That they said (in boast) 'We killed Christ Jesus son of Mary The messenger of God'.. But they killed him not, nor crucified him.. only a likeness of that was shown to them and those who differ therein are full of doubts with no (certain) knowledge but only conjecture to follow. For a surety they killed him not: Nay, God raised him up unto Himself, and God (Allah) is Most Exalted, Wise." (4:156-158).

 

[Job_38]

Yes and they deny Christ's deity but hey, many Christians do as well.

 

[nChrist]

Yesterday at 08:15 PM Job_38 said this in Post #112

Yes and they deny Christ's deity but hey, many Christians do as well.

UM?, I'm not aware of anyone who calls themselves a Christian and denies the deity of Christ. The meaning of the word Christian, of Christ, would be a contradiction for anyone denying the deity of Christ. Just curious, what faith or denomination denies the deity of Christ and calls themselves Christian?

 

[sojeru]

hi 357,
you said:
I'm not aware of anyone who calls themselves a Christian and denies the deity of Christ.
---------------------
here are some that i know of that do: some who call themselves nazarenes, netzarim- some hebrew israelites, some messianics.
and yet some of these would still call themselves christian and hold a BIBLE with no other books in their hands.

so what proof can you give to these people that say they are with Holy Spirit and truth and they have scripture to back themsleves up with awesome arguements you never heard before??
I know what can bring them down- and im sure you know a nice amount of that aswell.
However, since you dont give the Torah the proper respect it should have being the word of GD/Messiah - you cant utterly defeat these messianics and etc.

another thing is that both claim to have the spirit- so who is right??
the one who convinces the other that they are with out DELIBERATE(pre-meditated) SIN AGAINST GD and people, the one who can PROVE their love to Gd and people and the one that can show that His DOCTRINE can not be stood against by any part of the word (the entire BIBLE old and new) has it.
I only have one of these- I need the other 2.
-
in other words, this would make islam a christianity. what a big confusion christianity is huh?
even islam itself has its divisions and doctrinally too.
one believes that Gd is not light because light was created, others believe that he is and supply their arguements. some say that the word translated as throne in the arabic is wrong because Gd cannot siton a throne. others believe it is correct but the understanding is what needs to be applied.
there are two great rivaling groups, the wahabi( i think located in lebanon) and habishi'a (abbyssinians) doctrine
the habishi'a says that they are one, while the wahabi points out they are not.
etc, i can go on forever with the yemeni arab and all.

but this is the confusion that has taken over the earth, ALL beginning with the group is 227-330 ce
the catholics.
ALL have sprung from her. Islam, protestants and even a great amount of whats written and held in todays "judaism" responding to the one that hated its people- cotholocism which rose strong between these times.
and also, was laying in a "silence" in ROME under the supervision of the council in Jerusalem.
it wasnt until Hadrian that these gentile "converts" to TRUE JUDAISM /Messiah's revelation- knocked off eerything their mesiah was.

And ZICO,
did you do what i asked you to do?
even if you dnt believe it, its in scripture written a thousand yrs before messiah was put there.
Put where?? you may ask
well do what i asked you to do please, and you will see

masalaama

 

[Zico]

Hello sojeru,

Actually a muslim is not a muslim if he doesn't believe that the Torah and the Bible still contain Allah's words and miracles. so what ever experiment you are trying to get me into, believe me,,, i wouldn't be surprised of the outcome.

salam

 

[Zico]

You want something scary sojeru???? http://wings.buffalo.edu/sa/muslim/library/jesus-say/ch6.10.html

 

[nChrist]

Hello Sojeru,

I really don't know what people of various faiths and denominations believe. Maybe I am in error in believing that the term "Christian" means of Christ, the Son of God, the Lord and Saviour who died on the cross for our sins.

All of the people I know who claim to be "Christians" believe that Almighty God is a Holy Trinity, One God: God the Father, God the Son, and God the Holy Spirit. Jesus Christ is the WAY, THE TRUTH, AND THE LIFE, no man comes to the Father but through Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ was crucified and died on a cross in payment for the sins of man for those who would believe and accept him as their personal Lord and Saviour. Jesus Christ arose from the dead and ascended back to Heaven and is A LIVING SAVIOUR. Jesus Christ was and is VERY GOD. I have accepted Jesus Christ as my personal Lord and Saviour, and the Holy Spirit lives in my heart as a comforter, guide, and ernest of the promise of my salvation. If this isn't the definition of "Christian", I wouldn't wish to be known as a Christian.

 

[Dale]

There are grave differences between Christianity and Islam so I must regard Allah as a fictional character.
Allah is not a god of love. There is nothing in the Koran that says that Allah loves his people. This point was raised when I heard a sermon on Islam in a Baptist church.
Islam teaches that everyone has two angels following them around. One of them writes down the person’s good deeds and the other writes down the person’s bad deeds. When that person is judged by Allah the writing of the two angels are weighed on a scale. This is certainly very different from the Christian doctrine of salvation by grace.

 

[Job_38]

Yesterday at 05:53 PM Zico said this in Post #115

Hello sojeru,

Actually a muslim is not a muslim if he doesn't believe that the Torah and the Bible still contain Allah's words and miracles. so what ever experiment you are trying to get me into, believe me,,, i wouldn't be surprised of the outcome.

salam

Agreed, but isn't it also taught that Paul distorted the Gospel? Isn't this why we were given the Koran, because of Allah's love for us?

 

[Job_38]

Allah
Allah is the supreme being of all. He is uncreated, the creator of all, without beginning or end. He is completely sufficient to himself and needs no other. He does not have offspring nor a spouse. He knows all things, is everywhere, and is all powerful. He hears all prayers. Everything that occurs, does so by his permission.
His Angels
Angels reside in the unseen world and carry out the commands of Allah. They cannot sin. Muhammad stated that it was the angel Gabriel that brought the message of the Koran to him.
His Messengers
People who have been sent from Allah to a particular group of people for the purpose of giving to them the message revealed by Allah. Some of them are Noah, Abraham, Moses, David, Jesus, and, of course, Muhammad. Islam teaches that all messengers previous to Muhammad were sent to limited people groups where Muhammad was sent to all people.
His Books
Islam recognizes many sacred scriptures that have been given by Allah throughout history. However, Muslims claim that only the Quran is trustworthy and that the other scriptures have been compromised because we do not posses their original manuscripts. They assert that the accounts of the Bible were written down hundreds of years later and cannot be considered inerrant, and they were written in ancient languages which have been lost. Therefore, exact translations are not possible. Nevertheless, the scriptures recognized in Islam are:
The Koran - The Koran (Qur'an) is the inspired word of Allah given to people through the Prophet Muhammad and it supercedes all other scriptures before it including. It alone is inerrant and trustworthy as a revelation for today. It is unchanged from the beginning.
The Torah -the first five books of Moses.
The Injil - the gospel message of Jesus in the New Testament
The Psalms - the sacred writings given to David.
The Last Day
There is a future day in which this world and its governments and systems will come to end and all people will face judgment based upon their deeds. Muslims go to paradise and non-Muslims go to hell.
Divine Preordainments good or bad
In Islam, Allah is completely control of all things and ordains all things that occur.