When?

[EastCoastRemnant]

Good point RND... I never thought of the mixed multitude.

 

[RND]

I know the Absolute Truth. His name is Jesus Christ not Ellen White.

She pointed to Him all the time too! Tell me something do you have any references where she pointed to herself like Joseph Smith did?

 

[Byfaithalone1]

The problem wasn't with the covenant but how it was kept.

There are 2 parties to a covenant. If one party doesn't keep it, there's a problem with the covenant. However, that problem may lie solely with one party and not with the other. Covenants that are broken can be deemd to be null and void. When this occurs, there may be need for a new covenant. Hopefully, the new covenant will take into consideration the failure of the first covenant (rather than simply restating the same terms that did not previously work).

BFA

 

[RND]

There are 2 parties to a covenant. If one party doesn't keep it, there's a problem with the covenant.

OK, let's examine that thought. Let's say we make an agreement (covenant) that says I'll loan you $500 and you have to pay me $500 in 10 months. I give you the $500. You don't pay me back. Is the problem with me, you or the agreement?

However, that problem may lie solely with one party and not with the other. Covenants that are broken can be deemd to be null and void.

Yes, that's right. In certain cases then it can be. If in our agreement above required you to knock over a liquor store to repay the $500 for instance.

When this occurs, there may be need for a new covenant. Hopefully, the new covenant will take into consideration the failure of the first covenant (rather than simply restating the same terms that did not previously work).

The Lord didn't get rid of His law. In fact He magnified it! Made it better! Put it in the heart, not on stone.

 

[zeker33:9]

She pointed to Him all the time too! Tell me something do you have any references where she pointed to herself like Joseph Smith did?

When you filter the Word of God through her teachings or anyone else's, you are diluting the Word of God the same way the Mormons do with Joseph Smith. Thus putting your faith in her.

 

[RND]

When you filter the Word of God through her teachings or anyone else's, you are diluting the Word of God the same way the Mormons do with Joseph Smith. Thus putting your faith in her.

Well that's certainly your opinion.

Can't help but noticed you didn't answer my question: Tell me something do you have any references where she pointed to herself like Joseph Smith did?

Did EGW point to herself like Joseph Smith did? Do you have any references?

I wonder one thing though. How did you gain such knowledge into the thoughts and intentions of other peoples hearts?

Jeremiah tells us that the heart is desperately wicked, who can know it. How do you do it? Do you know yours?

I use EGW like like I would when listen to any good pastor frankly. I check out my pastor's all the time.

 

[zeker33:9]

Can't help but noticed you didn't answer my question: Tell me something do you have any references where she pointed to herself like Joseph Smith did?
Did EGW point to herself like Joseph Smith did? Do you have any references?

She didn't have to, you do in your signature.

I wonder one thing though. How did you gain such knowledge into the thoughts and intentions of other peoples hearts?

Jeremiah tells us that the heart is desperately wicked, who can know it. How do you do it? Do you know yours?

There would be only one way wouldn't there? Like I said, the question is designed to get you to examine yourself. I have, and I know I'm just as wicked as you are. Read Romans 1:28-32 and Galatians 5:19-21 and see how many fit you.

I use EGW like like I would when listen to any good pastor frankly. I check out my pastor's all the time.

Good for you!

 

[RND]

Still can't answer the question can you? Why is that? Do you realize that by NOT answering the question you've already answered it?!

Do you have any references where she pointed to herself like Joseph Smith did?

Did EGW point to herself like Joseph Smith did? Do you have any references?

Answers: No, no and no.

She didn't have to, you do in your signature.

So then using your logic I'm also a follower of atheist Arthur Schoenhauer since I quote him as well.

Tell me something do you find the quotes from EGW in my siggy incorrect or pointing to herself in anyway?

There would be only one way wouldn't there? Like I said, the question is designed to get you to examine yourself. I have, and I know I'm just as wicked as you are. Read Romans 1:28-32 and Galatians 5:19-21 and see how many fit you.

So then you are saying you have the ability to judge other people and know their motives? Wow, you're special then!

Good for you!

Yep, good for me!

 

[zeker33:9]

For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. Matthew 12:34

 

[RND]

For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. Matthew 12:34

No doubt.

I guess in reference to the question I asked you're taking the approach that it's better to remain silent and appear a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt!

Oh, and what was that question again? Oh, that's right:

Do you have any references where she pointed to herself like Joseph Smith did?

You made the statement. Just can't back it up!

Now that we've derailed the thread that you started let's get back on the tract it aimed to go: "When were the Gentiles in bondage in Egypt? And when did God deliver them from said bondage?"

Bondage is typically a metaphor/allegory/euphemism for being in sin as we know. Before the gentiles were taken out of Egypt with the Israelites (the "mixed multitude") God gave instruction to the Israelites and gentiles on how the gentile were to become an Israelite (Ex 12:43-49). This mirrors 100% how stranger's (gentiles) to God Kingdom in this present age (since the time of Christ) are to become Israelites.

1. Accept the passover lamb. (Jesus)
2. Get circumcised. (Heart, not flesh)

God gave these instructions before coming out of Egypt (sin). Same holds true today. All are in sin (Romans 3:23) and all need a Saviour. Yet God gave us these instructions before coming out of sin!

Is He not a wonderful God?!

He made a way to escape even before we were willing to escape!

 

[Cribstyl]

Originally Posted by zeker33:9

Why would God establish a new and better covenant that looks exactly like the old one? That is what you're saying right?
​

The problem wasn't with the covenant but how it was kept.

Is RND saying "same covenant but new way to keep it?"

Scriptures explains; The New Covenant is not like the Old

Hbr 8:7¶For if that first [covenant] had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
(The Old Covenant had an issue that required a New Covenant...not new way to keep the same covenant.)

Hbr 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
(The issue was the people could not keep the laws") But God still declared to make a New Covenant.)

Hbr 8:9Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

Why would God explain that the New Covenant will not be like the first one made at Sinai, if we're suppose to be under the first covenant?

 

[Byfaithalone1]

OK, let's examine that thought. Let's say we make an agreement (covenant) that says I'll loan you $500 and you have to pay me $500 in 10 months. I give you the $500. You don't pay me back. Is the problem with me, you or the agreement?

We'd need more facts to decide. For example, in cases of usury, the problem is both with the lender and with the agreement.

Yes, that's right. In certain cases then it can be. If in our agreement above required you to knock over a liquor store to repay the $500 for instance.

Exactly. Good point.

The Lord didn't get rid of His law. In fact He magnified it! Made it better! Put it in the heart, not on stone.

In fact, He indicated that the letters engraved on stones are the letters that bring death. For that reason, we are no longer under a tutor.

BFA

 

[zeker33:9]

No doubt.

I guess in reference to the question I asked you're taking the approach that it's better to remain silent and appear a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt!

Oh, and what was that question again? Oh, that's right:

Do you have any references where she pointed to herself like Joseph Smith did?

You made the statement. Just can't back it up!

What is really going to blow your mind RND, is look at which one you chose to defend. It wasn't Jesus Christ.

Now that we've derailed the thread that you started let's get back on the tract it aimed to go: "When were the Gentiles in bondage in Egypt? And when did God deliver them from said bondage?"

Bondage is typically a metaphor/allegory/euphemism for being in sin as we know. Before the gentiles were taken out of Egypt with the Israelites (the "mixed multitude") God gave instruction to the Israelites and gentiles on how the gentile were to become an Israelite (Ex 12:43-49). This mirrors 100% how stranger's (gentiles) to God Kingdom in this present age (since the time of Christ) are to become Israelites.

1. Accept the passover lamb. (Jesus)
2. Get circumcised. (Heart, not flesh)

God gave these instructions before coming out of Egypt (sin). Same holds true today. All are in sin (Romans 3:23) and all need a Saviour. Yet God gave us these instructions before coming out of sin!

Is He not a wonderful God?!

He made a way to escape even before we were willing to escape!

Show Scripture where there were Gentiles in the crowd at the Red Sea crossing, and 40 years in the wilderness.

 

[RND]

What is really going to blow your mind RND, is look at which one you chose to defend. It wasn't Jesus Christ.

Did I not say, "She pointed to Him all the time too!" Was I not pointing out how EGW constantly pointed to Jesus? Ah, I see. You're just upset because I called you to answer a question you cannot.

Show Scripture where there were Gentiles in the crowd at the Red Sea crossing, and 40 years in the wilderness.

Are you serious?

Do a word study on "mixed multitude."

Exd 12:38And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, [even] very much cattle.

 

[RND]

We'd need more facts to decide. For example, in cases of usury, the problem is both with the lender and with the agreement.

I didn't mention usury in my example. I tried to make the examle as simple as possible.

Exactly. Good point.

Thanks.

In fact, He indicated that the letters engraved on stones are the letters that bring death.

Still do.

For that reason, we are no longer under a tutor.

That's right. We're under the Master - the one that kept the law. We're supposed to follow Him.

 

[RND]

Originally Posted by zeker33:9

Why would God establish a new and better covenant that looks exactly like the old one? That is what you're saying right?
​

Is RND saying "same covenant but new way to keep it?"

Scriptures explains; The New Covenant is not like the Old

Hbr 8:7¶For if that first [covenant] had been faultless, then should no place have been sought for the second.
(The Old Covenant had an issue that required a New Covenant...not new way to keep the same covenant.)

Hbr 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
(The issue was the people could not keep the laws") But God still declared to make a New Covenant.)

Hbr 8:9Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day when I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt; because they continued not in my covenant, and I regarded them not, saith the Lord.

Why would God explain that the New Covenant will not be like the first one made at Sinai, if we're suppose to be under the first covenant?

Crib, read verse 8 again...you highlighted the issue. God didn't find fault in His covenant He found fault with "them" - the ones that agreed to keep it. The issue was the people not the law. The New Covenant was Jesus, He kept the law. He's the example of how to keep it.

If there was a fault with the covenant then there would have been a fault with God. God's law is Holy, just, perfect and good. We're not. We're unholy, unjust, imperfect and bad.

 

[zeker33:9]

Did I not say, "She pointed to Him all the time too!" Was I not pointing out how EGW constantly pointed to Jesus? Ah, I see. You're just upset because I called you to answer a question you cannot.[\quote]Why would I be upset? You'd just tell me I've misinterpreted what she said wouldn't you?

Did she say this?

"Early in my youth I was asked several times, Are you a prophet? I have ever responded, I am the Lord's messenger. I know that many have called me a prophet, but I have made no claim to this title. My Saviour declared me to be his messenger. 'Your work,' he instructed me, 'is to bear my word. ... It is not you that speaketh: it is the Lord that giveth the messages of warning and reproof. Never deviate from the truth under any circumstances . Give the light I shall give you. The messages for these last days shall be written in books, and shall stand immortalized, to testify against those who have once rejoiced in the light, but who have been led to give it up because of the seductive influences of evil.' Why have I not claimed to be a prophet?--Because in these days many who boldly claim that they are prophets are a reproach to the cause of Christ; and because my work includes much more than the word 'prophet' signifies.

"My commission embraces the work of a prophet, but it does not end there."


source:[SIZE=-1]Ellen White, Review and Herald, July 26, 1907; Selected Messages, vol. 1, p. 36, 1906. [/SIZE]


If that ain't pointing at one's self I don't know what is.

Are you serious?

Do a word study on "mixed multitude."

Exd 12:38And a mixed multitude went up also with them; and flocks, and herds, [even] very much cattle.

Thank you.

 

[RND]

Why would I be upset? You'd just tell me I've misinterpreted what she said wouldn't you?

How do you know what I'd say before I would say something? Oh, that's right, you're just like God - you know the thoughts and intentions of others.

Did she say this?

"Early in my youth I was asked several times, Are you a prophet? I have ever responded, I am the Lord's messenger. I know that many have called me a prophet, but I have made no claim to this title. My Saviour declared me to be his messenger. 'Your work,' he instructed me, 'is to bear my word. ... It is not you that speaketh: it is the Lord that giveth the messages of warning and reproof. Never deviate from the truth under any circumstances . Give the light I shall give you. The messages for these last days shall be written in books, and shall stand immortalized, to testify against those who have once rejoiced in the light, but who have been led to give it up because of the seductive influences of evil.' Why have I not claimed to be a prophet?--Because in these days many who boldly claim that they are prophets are a reproach to the cause of Christ; and because my work includes much more than the word 'prophet' signifies.

"My commission embraces the work of a prophet, but it does not end there."


source:[SIZE=-1]Ellen White, Review and Herald, July 26, 1907; Selected Messages, vol. 1, p. 36, 1906. [/SIZE]


If that ain't pointing at one's self I don't know what is.

Yes she indeed made this statement and I have no problem with it.

Did she say she was a Savior like Joeseph Smith did? Nope. She used the word's My Savior. And that was the question I asked. Did she not point to Jesus in the above referenced work? Yep. She never stopped pointing to Jesus Christ and never pointed to herself as another man's savior.

Thank you.

YW.

 

[zeker33:9]

How do you know what I'd say before I would say something? Oh, that's right, you're just like God - you know the thoughts and intentions of others.

Your words not mine.

Yes she indeed made this statement and I have no problem with it.

Did she say she was a Savior like Joeseph Smith did? Nope. She used the word's My Savior. And that was the question I asked. Did she not point to Jesus in the above referenced work? Yep. She never stopped pointing to Jesus Christ and never pointed to herself as another man's savior.

Here was my earlier comment "I know the Absolute Truth. His name is Jesus Christ not Ellen White." Why are you, RND, elevating her up to that?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

When you filter the Word of God through her teachings or anyone else's, you are diluting the Word of God the same way the Mormons do with Joseph Smith. Thus putting your faith in her.

Thats funny, I thought the Word of God was put through the teachings/writings of 40 some men in ancient times.... I gues I'm putting my faith in Daniel, Matthew, John et al...