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When does the Antichrist power show itself?

reddogs

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Lets take a look at 2 Thessalonians 2:7

2 Thessalonians 2:7 King James Version (KJV)
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New International Version)
7
For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New Living Translation)
7
For this lawlessness is already at work secretly, and it will remain secret until the one who is holding it back steps out of the way

So what is this mystery of iniquity, this lawlessness already at work secretly, and what is holding it back. Well lets start with the power holding it back:

For more than 500 years, half a millennium, Rome was invincible. Its laws and legions stretched out from Rome and crushed those who would challenge it, but it too finally faded and it stopped holding back what prophecy had foretold.

Geneva Study Bible

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (7) He foretells that when the empire of Rome is taken away, the seat that falls away from God will succeed and hold its place, as the old writers, Tertullian, Chrysostom, and Jerome explain and interpret it... He who is now in authority and rules all, that is, the Roman Empire

2 Thessalonians 2:7 He will surely be revealed; for the mystery - The deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, already worketh. It began with the love of honour, and the desire of power; and is completed in the entire subversion of the gospel of Christ. This mystery of iniquity is not wholly confined to the Romish church, but extends itself to others also. It seems to consist of,
  1. Human inventions added to the written word.
  2. Mere outside performances put in the room of faith and love.
  3. Other mediators besides the man Christ Jesus.
The two last branches, together with idolatry and bloodshed, are the direct consequences of the former; namely, the adding to the word of God. Already worketh - In the church. Only he that restraineth - That is, the potentate who successively has Rome in his power. The emperors, heathen or Christian; the kings, Goths or Lombards; the Carolingian or German emperors.

Wesley's Explanatory Notes

2 Thessalonians 2:7 7 He will surely be revealed; for the mystery - The deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, already worketh. It began with the love of honour, and the desire of power; and is completed in the entire subversion of the gospel of Christ. This mystery of iniquity is not wholly confined to the Romish church, but extends itself to others also. It seems to consist of, Human inventions added to the written word. Mere outside performances put in the room of faith and love. Other mediators besides the man Christ Jesus. The two last branches, together with idolatry and bloodshed, are the direct consequences of the former; namely, the adding to the word of God. Already worketh - In the church. Only he that restraineth - That is, the potentate who successively has Rome in his power. The emperors, heathen or Christian; the kings, Goths or Lombards; the Carolingian or German emperors.


Jerome (347–420): "Says the apostle [Paul in the second epistle to the Thessalonians], 'Unless the Roman Empire should first be desolated, and antichrist proceed, Christ will not come.'"

So what is this mystery:

Revelation 17:5,9
5
And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
9And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

In the day of the Apostle John, the city of Rome was famed for its situation of encompassing seven hills, i.e., Capitolinus, Palatinus, Aventinus, Esquilinus, Coelius, Viminalis, and Quirinalis, as noticed by Virgil, Horace, Ovid, Claudian, Starius, Martial, and others.

The mystery of Babylon had been a power which brought corruption of man and lawlessness. It had been known more by what it did to deceive and substitute itself above God, but Paul now begins to point it out and tells others.

2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

So the man of sin, the son of perdition is being held back, but what is this exactly. In John 17:12 we see the name:
John 17:12
While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.

But Paul is not talking about Judas as he is already gone from the scene, so it must be the evil which comes into men. That which seeks to be like God and fights against Christ, a antichrist power. The word Antichrist occurs only five times and only in the books of 1st and 2nd John.
  • 1 John 2:18-22 He is antichrist that denies Jesus is Christ. In John's time there were many antichrists and he says they went out from them (the Church) but were not of them or they would have continued with them. This tells us the Antichrist came from God's true Church but they went out on their own.
  • 1 John 4:1-3 Test the Spirits. Every spirit that denies Jesus came in the flesh is the spirit of antichrist.
  • 2 John 1:7 Those that deny Jesus came in the flesh are a deceiver and antichrist.
  • Antichrist = "against or in place of Christ", attacking Christ's character (Gnosticism), specifically with regard to love expressed in obedience to God's Ten Commandments.
Satan seduced Eve with the bait of becoming "like the most High" (Isaiah 14:14) in "knowing good and evil" (Genesis 3:5). "For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil" (3:5). What Satan failed to tell Eve, was the result of eating of the fruit that God had forbidden. "But of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die" (Genesis 2:17)

Satan keeps putting into mans minds that they shall be like gods if they follow what he says, and he tries everything to get them to see themselves as worthy to be worshipped and with power to change what God has given mankind. Thus the Antichrist becomes what gets power from evil to go against Christ and take worship that does not belong to it.

The power that gives rise to the the Antichrist has always been at enmity with those that follow God.
"Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God" (James 4:4).


Why does the Antichrist power have such animosity to God?

"Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the Law of God, neither indeed can be" (Romans 8:7).

For the carnal mind, Gods Law will be odious; and, the Antichrist will continue to persuade the masses of the indispensability of self-love, without the slightest hint of the necessity of seeking, trusting, loving, and obeying the Living God.

"Thou art worthy, O LORD, to receive glory and honour and power: for Thou hast created all things, and for Thy pleasure they are and were created" (Revelation 4:11).

The bible identifies and shows us what it is and what will happen, you just have to have a ear that hears..

Revelation 13 (King James Version)
1
And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. 8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.
 
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k4c

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Lets take a look at 2 Thessalonians 2:7

2 Thessalonians 2:7 King James Version (KJV)
For the mystery of iniquity doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New International Version)
7For the secret power of lawlessness is already at work; but the one who now holds it back will continue to do so till he is taken out of the way.

2 Thessalonians 2:7 (New Living Translation)
7 For this lawlessness is already at work secretly, and it will remain secret until the one who is holding it back steps out of the way

So what is this mystery of iniquity, this lawlessness already at work secretly, and what is holding it back. Well lets start with the power holding it back:


For more than 500 years, half a millennium, Rome was invincible. Its laws and legions stretched out from Rome and crushed those who would challenge it, but it too finally faded and it stopped holding back what prophecy had foretold.

Geneva Study Bible


(7) He foretells that when the empire of Rome is taken away, the seat that falls away from God will succeed and hold its place, as the old writers, Tertullian, Chrysostom, and Jerome explain and interpret it... He who is now in authority and rules all, that is, the Roman Empire

2:7He will surely be revealed; for the mystery - The deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, already worketh. It began with the love of honour, and the desire of power; and is completed in the entire subversion of the gospel of Christ. This mystery of iniquity is not wholly confined to the Romish church, but extends itself to others also. It seems to consist of,
  1. Human inventions added to the written word.
  2. Mere outside performances put in the room of faith and love.
  3. Other mediators besides the man Christ Jesus.
The two last branches, together with idolatry and bloodshed, are the direct consequences of the former; namely, the adding to the word of God. Already worketh - In the church. Only he that restraineth - That is, the potentate who successively has Rome in his power. The emperors, heathen or Christian; the kings, Goths or Lombards; the Carolingian or German emperors.


Wesley's Explanatory Notes

2:7 He will surely be revealed; for the mystery - The deep, secret power of iniquity, just opposite to the power of godliness, already worketh. It began with the love of honour, and the desire of power; and is completed in the entire subversion of the gospel of Christ. This mystery of iniquity is not wholly confined to the Romish church, but extends itself to others also. It seems to consist of, Human inventions added to the written word. Mere outside performances put in the room of faith and love. Other mediators besides the man Christ Jesus. The two last branches, together with idolatry and bloodshed, are the direct consequences of the former; namely, the adding to the word of God. Already worketh - In the church. Only he that restraineth - That is, the potentate who successively has Rome in his power. The emperors, heathen or Christian; the kings, Goths or Lombards; the Carolingian or German emperors.

Jerome (347–420): "Says the apostle [Paul in the second epistle to the Thessalonians], ‘Unless the Roman Empire should first be desolated, and antichrist proceed, Christ will not come.’"

So what is this mystery:

Revelation 17:5,9
5And upon her forehead was a name written, MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH.
9And here is the mind which hath wisdom. The seven heads are seven mountains, on which the woman sitteth.

In the day of the Apostle John, the city of Rome was famed for its situation of encompassing seven hills, i.e., Capitolinus, Palatinus, Aventinus, Esquilinus, Coelius, Viminalis, and Quirinalis, as noticed by Virgil, Horace, Ovid, Claudian, Starius, Martial, and others.

The mystery of Babylon had been a power which brought corruption of man and lawlessness. It had been known more by what it did to deceive and substitute itself above God, but Paul now begins to point it out and tells others.

2 Thessalonians 2:3
Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;


So the man of sin, the son of perdition is being held back, but what is this exactly. In John 17:12 we see the name:
John 17:12
While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.



But Paul is not talking about Judas as he is already gone from the scene, so it must be the evil which comes into men. That which seeks to be like God and fights against Christ, a antichrist power. The word Antichrist occurs only five times and only in the books of 1st and 2nd John.
  • 1 John 2:18-22 – He is antichrist that denies Jesus is Christ. In John’s time there were many antichrists and he says they went out from them (the Church) but were not of them or they would have continued with them. This tells us the Antichrist came from God’s true Church but they went out on their own.
  • 1 John 4:1-3 – Test the Spirits. Every spirit that denies Jesus came in the flesh is the spirit of antichrist.
  • 2 John 1-11 – Those that deny Jesus came in the flesh are a deceiver and antichrist.
  • Antichrist = “against or in place of Christ”, attacking Christ’s character (Gnosticism), specifically with regard to love expressed in obedience to God’s Ten Commandments.
Satan seduced Eve with the bait of becoming "like the most High" (Isaiah 14:14) in "knowing good and evil" (Genesis 3:5). "For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil" (3:5). What Satan failed to tell Eve, was the result of eating of the fruit that God had forbidden. "But of the Tree of the Knowledge of Good and Evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die" (Genesis 2:17)

Satan keeps putting into mans minds that they shall be like gods if they follow what he says, and he tries everything to get them to see themselves as worthy to be worshipped and with power to change what God has given mankind. Thus the Antichrist becomes what gets power from evil to go against Christ and take worship that does not belong to it.

The power that gives rise to the the Antichrist has always been at enmity with those that follow God.
"Ye adulterers and adulteresses, know ye not that the friendship of the world is enmity with God? whosoever therefore will be a friend of the world is the enemy of God" (James 4:4).

Why does the Antichrist power have such animosity to God?

"Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the Law of God, neither indeed can be" (Romans 8:7).

For the carnal mind, Gods Law will be odious; and, the Antichrist will continue to persuade the masses of the indispensability of self-love, without the slightest hint of the necessity of seeking, trusting, loving, and obeying the Living God.

"Thou art worthy, O LORD, to receive glory and honour and power: for Thou hast created all things, and for Thy pleasure they are and were created" (Revelation 4:11).

The bible identifies and shows us what it is and what will happen, you just have to have a ear that hears..
Revelation 13 (King James Version)


1And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
2And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
3And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
4And they worshipped the dragon which gave power unto the beast: and they worshipped the beast, saying, Who is like unto the beast? who is able to make war with him?
5And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.
6And he opened his mouth in blasphemy against God, to blaspheme his name, and his tabernacle, and them that dwell in heaven.
7And it was given unto him to make war with the saints, and to overcome them: and power was given him over all kindreds, and tongues, and nations. 8And all that dwell upon the earth shall worship him, whose names are not written in the book of life of the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world.

It's like a breath of fresh air when I read the words of a true Bible scholar.

Keep up the good work.
 
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reddogs

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It's like a breath of fresh air when I read the words of a true Bible scholar.

Keep up the good work.

This is the work we need to do, is open up the scriptures and unveil the prophecies for others, so they may see and hear what the Holy Spirit clearly shows if you let it.
 
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k4c

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This is the work we need to do, is open up the scriptures and unveil the prophecies for others, so they may see and hear what the Holy Spirit clearly shows if you let it.

Amen...

Prophecies are one of the most important aspects of the Bible because they authenticate the Bible as being of God and they point us to the Messiah. To teach against the prophecies is sure way to stray into uncharted waters and shipwreck the faith.
 
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k4c

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DELUSION...

The word, delusion means: A false belief strongly held in spite of invalidating evidence.

Delusion is when there is evidence that proves what someone believes is wrong yet they still believe it.

For example, many people have been deceived into believing that first Jesus comes for His people and then Antichrist is revealed. They believe this inspite of the clear word of God that says the Antichrist is revealed first and then Jesus comes for His people.

2 Thessalonians 2:1-4 Now, brethren, concerning the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ and our gathering together to Him, we ask you, not to be soon shaken in mind or troubled, either by spirit or by word or by letter, as if from us, as though the day of Christ had come. Let no one deceive you by any means; for that Day will not come unless the falling away comes first, and the man of sin is revealed, the son of perdition, who opposes and exalts himself above all that is called God or that is worshiped, so that he sits as God in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God.

They have also been taught to believe that after Jesus comes for His people there will be seven years of tribulation. This too is a delusion because the Bible clearly teaches that there is a thousand years between the first and second resurrection, not seven years. And besides, the Bible clearly teaches that when Jesus comes for His people evenything will be destroyed.

1 Thessalonians 5:2-3 For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, "Peace and safety!'' then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape.

2 Peter 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up.
 
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Joe67

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The mystery of iniquity does already work, the Lord testified through Paul at that time.

This warning was to safeguard them against those who claimed that the Lord would come in peace and prosperity. The teachers of peace and prosperity for the body of Christ are those who act and teach against working with your hands to not be chargeable to those you serve in the gospel. The lovers of peace and prosperity finally end up being busybodies, running here and there, compassing land and sea to make a proselyte. When they make a proselyte, the proselyte is two fold more a child of laziness (hell) than their teachers.

The thousands at Jerusalem, who rose up against Paul, as recorded in Acts 21:17..... were of this spirit. Paul had even brought an offering from the Gentiles for these people. The thousands at Jerusalem were a quarrelsome mob. Their Jehu type zeal had consumed the spirit of Jesus in them and they finally desired to kill Paul. Paul had been warned through the spirit that he would suffer at Jerusalem, but he was not told specifically the process. James and the elders did not sense the danger. They desired Paul to take the vow to appease the multitudes. The Lord Jesus put it into Paul's heart to submit to this humiliation.

Joe
 
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k4c

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The mystery of iniquity does already work, the Lord testified through Paul at that time.

This warning was to safeguard them against those who claimed that the Lord would come in peace and prosperity. The teachers of peace and prosperity for the body of Christ are those who act and teach against working with your hands to not be chargeable to those you serve in the gospel. The lovers of peace and prosperity finally end up being busybodies, running here and there, compassing land and sea to make a proselyte. When they make a proselyte, the proselyte is two fold more a child of laziness (hell) than their teachers.

The thousands at Jerusalem, who rose up against Paul, as recorded in Acts 21:17..... were of this spirit. Paul had even brought an offering from the Gentiles for these people. The thousands at Jerusalem were a quarrelsome mob. Their Jehu type zeal had consumed the spirit of Jesus in them and they finally desired to kill Paul. Paul had been warned through the spirit that he would suffer at Jerusalem, but he was not told specifically the process. James and the elders did not sense the danger. They desired Paul to take the vow to appease the multitudes. The Lord Jesus put it into Paul's heart to submit to this humiliation.

Joe

I'm not sure what you're trying to say here but it sounds like delusion 101.
 
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Joe67

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I'm not sure what you're trying to say here but it sounds like delusion 101.
k4c,

Look at the content of the remainder of the 2nd letter to the Thessalonians. It is a warning concerning those who are busybodies, yet who are not laboring to support themselves.

There is one message in this letter. Those who have pleasure in unrighteousness are those who have not learned to suffer in well-doing.

Before we can understand the forest, we identify the individual trees and their qualities. As we see the unity of the different parts, then we understand the forest.

It is a good beginning to see the verses in 2 Thessalonians 2:3-12. The vision increases as we see the overall picture of the warning in the entire letter.

Jesus did often warn the disciples that one of them would betray him. He often foretold them of his approaching suffering. This all seemed to be isolated in their thoughts from what they thought would be the ushering in of the kingdom of God. It seemed delusional to the disciples. "Lord is it I?" "Lord, may it be far from you." All blasphemy against the Father and the Son will be forgiven man, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven man. The Lord told Moses that the angel that He was sending in front of the COI would not forgive their transgressions; so do not offend him.

May the Lord Jesus give us restrain and caution with our tongue.

Joe
 
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Joe67

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This is a bit off topic, but you suggest something interesting. I've often wondered if it's also:

unteachable (hell)

Topic for another thread.
Avonia,

Some things cannot be taught, just witnessed. "Behold the Lamb of God." But we are destroyed as we deny them and fight against them. "I am that I am" is either heard, believed, and obeyed or denied by a golden calf and its worshipers corrupted with sensuality.

God's foolishness through the prophets and apostles is wiser than Athenian philosophy, the accumulation of the wisdom of man from Egypt to India, with its sensuality and worship of the creature.

The children of this world are wiser than the children of light. Ishmael scoffed/scorned Isaac at the celebration party for Isaac's weaning. That is when Hagar and Ishmael had to leave the camp; even though it brought pain to Abraham.

Joe
 
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