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What's wrong with this Passage?

Iosias

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The main problem with this is that you're ignoring the polemical point of Paul within the narrative structure of his letter to Rome. To yank a few verses out of context and change a few words may score some polemical points, but they are hardly a substantive refutation of infant baptism.
 
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Oct 21, 2003
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I'll try to answer but I am watching UFC, priorities...you know.

I wish we could watch it together bro, for awhile I watched it on dvd's I purchased some time ago. It's hard to find the time and money anymore though.


Adamic, covenant of works, 'do and live' in the garden.

Noahic, a republication of the everlasting covenant of grace toward God's elect:

Looks as though we agree.


Physical and Spiritual is precisely the distinction I like to remind folks of concerning baptism.


Enjoyed the quote.


I see the covenant of redemption in chronological order as before the covenants of works and grace, at least as they are revealed in time. From eternity those chosen in Christ (not yet being born, nor having done any good or evil) the elect both before (O.T. times), during, and after Christ, were chosen to enter into the covenant of grace which is made effective by the covenant of redemption. What gets me is that they are not so separate, meaning they are related to one another or maybe stated better, points of contact. Though the chosen by God, the elect, are saved purely by grace, does that mean the righteousness of Christ and the works of the Holy Spirit not prevail in them through faith? Are those works God does through us, according to His will and purpose and mercy and grace, to be under the covenant of grace or works? This may be another reason why I recognize a third primary covenant, because there is absolutely nothing we could ever say or do, not even by the Spirit, could we add to or take away from the finished work of Christ at Calvary on behalf of the elect.

I'm saying the idea of a one to one equivalent between circumcision and baptism cannot be found in scripture.

We have to go with conscience to paraphrase Martin Luther sloppily I might add.

This idea is not found before the Reformation.

I wouldn't use that kind of argument, it doth remind me of Catholic argumentation. Covenant theology they say is an invention of the Puritans...they also say presuppositionalism is not found in Scripture, it's an invention of the Reformed. Of course both are based on Scripture, though Scripture was never intended to be a textbook for either (not to mention countless other topics), though books upon books have been written on them, they can be said to be "biblical" having their foundations rooted firmly in Scripture.


You may be right, I have not done any historical study of the doctrine of baptism, especially pre-Reformation studies. However, pre-reformation sources are not exactly canon for protestants either. There are so many differences in early Catholics, conflicting in "details" of theology, etc. I am inclined to thinking the Catholic Church post-Augustine did not embrace Augustine (probably also while Augustine lived he faced opposition from the Church), rather slipped further and further into commonality with semi-palagianism. One thing I do know, baptismal regeneration carried over into the Reformation into Protestantism and is still held by Lutherans.


I would like to hear the third session, if you could send it, that would be great. If you need my email, just send me a message on facebook.


Thank you, I'll have to check those out asap.
 
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Iosias

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Worth reading is The Law in Romans 2 .

 
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