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Just to answer the OP, I think the book of mormon deserves as much respect as the Koran or the Analects or the Bhagavad Gita or the Talmud or the Tao-te-Ching or the Upanishads or the Veda or the Nag Hamadi Library. I think that's it.
oops! -- I quoted the Book of Mormon on this thread...
In Mal 3 God said "I do not change".
In Heb 13 Christ "is the SAME yesterday today and forever".
in Gal 1:6-9
6 I am amazed that you are so quickly deserting Him who called you by the grace of Christ, for a different gospel; 7 which is really not another; only there are some who are disturbing you and want to distort the gospel of Christ. 8 But even if we (Apostles), or an angel from heaven, should preach to you a gospel contrary to what we have preached to you, he is to be accursed! 9 As we have said before, so I say again now, if any man is preaching to you a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed!
The idea then is to TEST the doctrine against the Bible to SEE IF it is valid.
Acts 17:11 "they studied the scriptures daily to SEE IF those things spoken to them by Paul -- were SO"
The BoM statement I quoted defining "abomination" and "wickedness" is then said to be "commanded by God for the saints to do" according to modern day Mormonism. And so now it returns back to being the "Abomination' that is no longer commanded...so then just "Abomination".
That according to Gal 1 ... Heb 13... Malachi 3... would not be the "God of the Bible" doing that.
The Mormon idea is "If an angel said it - you can do it no matter what the Bible says" -- and that is not what we find in the unchanging God of the actual Bible.
(Then of course there is the fanatic idea of using a seer stone to find treasure in the ground that was apparently popular with a few folks in the early 1800's... only to find out from the LDS church that Smith's early fanaticism on that subject where he got his own seer stone - turned out to be useful as that stone evolved the power to show 'english words' to Smith when placed over the ever-hidden-plates! At some point I think that would be a "wake up call" for bible students)
If "inconsistencies" are what you're going on, you better not read Atheistic & early anti-Christian writings, because they also discourage the reading of scriptures, the bible, etc., & love to point out the many contradictions & inconsistencies found there in too. How would you answer them? Ignore them? Place the Bible under a double standard? If you didn't get past the first alleged "inconsistency" in the Book of Mormon, then you missed out on the rest of the book. Looking for things to make issues over, or find fault with, isn't going to help when it comes to making a spiritual, prayful study too. Don't we ask Atheists the same types of things? Try to get them to study it out & live the good moral codes found in the bible, and try to make it a prayful study too, in addition to accepting the evidences found for the Bible by scholars, etc?
As for Jeremiah, his writings were written on a scroll or "roll" but were burned, then re-written & "there were added besides unto them many like words." (Jer. 36:28, 32). Was Jeremiah the only prophet who predicted the Babylonian captivity to come? No! Where there true prophets who also gave the same prophetic warnings? Yes. The true prophets tried to warn the people, while the false prophets tried to counter their warnings.
Micah (740-700 B.C.) also warned of the Assyrian and Babylonian invasions and predicted the fall of both Samaria and Jerusalem. Was he one of the false prophets that Jeremiah mentioned? If not, then there were other prophets, true ones, that also warned prophetically too. Lehi being one of the true prophets. Besides, even the OT says that there were "prophets," more than one, that gave said warnings, (2 Kings 17:13-15; 2 Chr. 36:15-16). Even Jeremiah mentions how the Lord sent "prophets" (Jer. 7:25), Urijah, prophetically warned too, (Jer. 26:20). I bet you didn't pay attention to the Book of Mormon's foot notes for 1 Nephi 1:4, note d, mentions these Old Testament scriptures to consider about "many prophets."
Then, there's the Jewish historian, Josephus, like in the BOM, he talks of "the elders," (1 Nephi 4:22), some of these elders, perhaps some good, others not so much. At any rate, he pointed out how that some of the "Elders" pointed out how Jeremiah shouldn't be punished for predicting what Micah had warned, before Jeremiah had, for: "...Micah signified the same before him, as well as many others, none of whom suffered anything of the kings that then reigned, but were honoured as the prophets of God. . . ." (Josephus Complete Works, p. 217, Antiquities of the Jews, Book X, Chapter VI:2).
What's the source for your Jeremiah claim anyways? It's always nice when people leave a source to track down, rather than just quick stabs at others' faiths, like a hit & run tactic.
Inconsistancies & Contradictions -- an old tactic: The early anti-Christian Celsus, (2nd cent. AD), like modern anti-Mormon “Christians,” also attempted to show contradictions between leaders. Celsus, for example, “attempted to show that Jesus contradicted Moses”. (Joseph Wilson Trigg, Origen (The Bible and Philosophy in the Third-century Church), (Atlanta: 1946, 1952, 1971, 1973, & John Knox Press, 1983), p. 230).
Like the early anti-Christians, many modern atheists have rejected the Bible because of similar reasons that the [AM] "Christians" reject things in Mormonism. So the [AM] "Christians" would not be able to pass their own test, & tactics, & test for truth, when others challenge them with the same tactics, etc., that they attack others with. The Atheist, M.M. O'Hair, July 27 1970, said for example, that one of the reasons why Atheists reject God was because that the gospels contradict each other. (The American Atheist Sept. 1977, p.23-5, July 27, 1970, Fanciful Facts About Jesus, by M.M. O'Hair, from the A.A. Radio Series, No.107). How would Christians answer the Atheists? Wouldn't that answer, answer the same issues Christians have with the BOM?
CAN THE BIBLE PASS THE SAME TESTS?
1. Was man or beast created first? Gen. 1:25-28 vrs. Gen. 2:18-20.
2. Were the moving creatures & fowl created out of the earth or out of the water? Gen.1:20 vrs. 2:19-21.
3. Were Adam & Eve created separately or together? Gen.l:26-8 vrs. 2:18, 20-3
4. Was Arphaxad the father or grandfather of Sala? Gen.11:12 vrs. Luke 3:35-36.
5. From who did Abraham buy the land for the sepulchre? Gen.23:17-19 vrs. Acts 7:16.
6-8. How old was Terah & Abraham? In Gen.11:26-32 was 70 when he begat Abraham and it adds that he, Terah died in Haran at the age of 205-135 years later. In Gen.12:4 Abraham was 70 when left Haram. Yet Acts 7:4 tells us his father was dead when he left Haran.
9. And where was the land located? Same Scripture.
10. The Location of the land & the settlers correspond between Gen.33:18-19 & Acts 7:16 but in Gen. 33 the buyer is Jacob. Not Abraham.
11. At what age is life fixed? Gen.6:3 vrs. Ps. 90:10.
12. How did Bethel get its name? Gen. 28:10-22 vrs. Gen. 35:10-15.
13. Was Abraham familiar with the name Jehovah? Ex.6:3 vrs. Gen 22:14.
14. Who was Laban's father? Gen. 28:5 vrs. Gen. 29:5
15. Who sold Joseph to Potiphar? Gen. 37:36 vrs. 39:1.
16-17. How many went down into Egypt? Gen.46:26 vrs. Deut.10:22 & Acts 7:14
18. How many years were the Israelites in Egypt? Gen.15:13, Acts 7:6 vrs. Ex.12:40, Gal.3:17.
19. Can man see the face of God? Ex.33:11 vrs. 33:20-23.
20. Were the staves of the Ark to remain in place? Ex.25:15 vrs. Num. 4:5-6.
21. Could Israel see of not? Gen. 48:10 vrs. 48:8, 11.
22. Which is the correct translation, staff (matteh) or bed (mittah)? Gen. 47:31 vrs. Heb. 11:21.
23. Did all the water turn to blood? Ex 7:19 vrs. 7:22, 24.
24. Who taught Moses to delegate? Ex. Ex. 18:13-23 vrs. Deut. 1:9-18.
25. Did all the Egyptian cattle die? Ex.9:6 vrs. 9:20.
26. Were all horses killed? Ex. 9:3 vrs. Ex. 14:9.
27. Was Moses mighty in words? Ex. 4:10 vrs. Acts 7:22.
28. Was Moses meek? Num.12:3 vrs 31.
29. When & where did Aaron die? Num.20:23-28 & Num.33:38.
30. And: Deut. 10:6.
31. Where did Eleazer replace Aaron? Num.20:23-29; 33:37-8; Deut.10:6-7.
32. Had Midran been destroyed or not? Num.31:7-17 vrs. Jud. 6:1.
33. Was Eleazer, son of Aaron allowed to enter the promised land? Num.14:30 vrs. Josh. 14:1.
34. How many Benjamites were killed? Judges 20:35 vrs. Jud. 20:46.
35. How many died in the plague? Num. 25:9 vrs. 1 Cor.10:8.
36. Had the Amalekites been destroyed or not? 1 Sam. 15:6-8 vrs. 30:1:2.
37. Did God give the land of Canaan to Israel as an Inheritance? Ex.12:37 vrs. Acts 7:5.
38. Did God want the people to offer sacrifices? Lev.27:28; Judg.11:34; l Sam. 25:33 vrs. Isa.66:3.
39. Does God punish children for the sins of their parents? Ex.20:5 vrs. Ez.18:20.
40. Did God want Balaam to go? Num.22:20 vrs. Num.22:21.
41. Who was Samuel's firstborn? 1 Sam.8:2 vrs. 1 Chron.6:28.
42. Who were Saul's sons? 1 Sam.14:49 vrs. 1 Sam. 14:49 vrs. 1 Sam.31:2
43. And: 1 Chron. 8:33.
44. Did Saul inquire of the Lord? 1 Sam.28:6 vrs. 1 Chorn. 10:13-14.
45. Was David a youth or an adult when he first met Saul? 1 Sam.16:18 vrs. 1 Sam. 17:33.
46. How Many Sons did Jessee have? 1 Chron. 2:13-15 vrs. 1 Sam. 16:10-11.
47. What was David's first public appearance? 1 Sam.16:18 vrs. 1 Sam.17
48. Was Goliath's death, David's first military exploit? 1 Sam.16:18 vrs. 1 Sam. 17:33.
49. Did Michael have children? 2 Sam.6:23 vrs. 2 Sam.21:8.
50. Was it Merab or Michal whom Saul gave to Adriel? 1 Sam.18:19 vrs. 2 Sam.21:8.
"Being lied to"? Cases, examples?
"Tells a different story?" Of course the BOM does, it's about a separate area of the world which Christ went to, an area which had true prophets that testified of Christ too. It backs up the Bible's witness that Jesus Christ is the Messiah!
However, your comments about "being lied to" offers no examples, which examples would be nice, so they can be discussed, rather than just make little stabs & claims, then running off to hide.
Does the Bible tell a different story too? First, which bible? Which one? Even different versions of the Bible tell a different story too:
(From: DT, Rough Draft).
"90, Jewish Council of Jamnia debates the authority of certain books and fixed a canon of Judaic writings.[6273]
384, Pope Damasus commissions Jerome to translate a version of the Bible, later called the Vulgate version.[6274]
11th century, Pope Gregory VII (A.D. 1073—85), policies were issued against translating the Bible, which was suppressed and held back by the clergy from the common people.[6275]
1170's Waldo, a rich man of the city of Lyons, sought to understand what the Latin that the Priests were reading. Had some of the priests translate the Bible for him.[6276]
1179, Lateran Council, Waldo’s supporters attempt to get Church approval for Waldo’s activities.[6277]
1379, Wycliffe published his treatise On the Truth of Holy Scripture.[6278]
1388, Wycliffe followers attempt to distribute biblical manuscripts, are hunted and suppressed. A second version of the translation is completed.[6279]
1414, a law was established which made those who ready any scriptures in English to “forfeit land, catel, lif[e], and goods from their heyers [heirs] for ever.”[6280]
1430's Johann Gutenberg’s invention, the printing press, was used to print the Bible.[6281]
Early 1500's, Eramus, a professor at Cambridge, sought to help the people know the scriptures through his translations.[6282]
William Tyndale, A.D. 1490's—Oct. 6, 1536, sought to make it so that even the boy who guides the plough would know the scriptures, and was eventually strangled, and his body was burned for making this possible.[6283]
1538, Cromwell, issued an injunction that let the bibles in the making, to be allowed to be freely read by the people in the churches.[6284]
1560, the Geneva Bible was ready for publication.[6285]
1611, the King James version of the Bible was published.[6286]
1546, Council of Trent, Catholicism reaffirms that the Apocrypha should remain in their canon.[6287]
1881, the reconstructed Greek New Testament, used by English editors of the Revised New Testament, had “almost 6,000 changes from the earlier alleged “original Greek,” and one-fourth of these corrections change the sense of the passage.”[6288]
1945, Nag Hammadi Library discovered.
1947, Dead Sea Scrolls discovered.
1948, Dr. Millar Burrows readings in the “St. Mark’s” Isaiah manuscript from the first Qumran cave were turned over to the Old Testament section of the Revised Standard Bible Committee that met at Northfield, Massachusetts, in the summer of 1948.[6289]
1952, September, the Revised Standard Version = RVS of the Bible included “fifteen Dead Sea Scrolls’ insertions in Isaiah.[6290]
1955, three years after the RSV was published, news of these insertions were made known to the public, especially after the appearance of Edmund Wilson’s revealing piece in The New Yorker.[6291]".
Earlier bibles included other books of scriptures too, the Shepherd of Hermas, Book of Enoch, & some don't start with the creation, but with the pre-existence, council in heaven, war in heaven, fall of the angels, etc. Genesis A & B, for example. There are earlier bible illustrations that show this too, plus other early to later Christian art works. (Scroll down to art works).
Cité de Dieu La - Augustinus council in heaven; fallen angels, creation of Eve hand clasp.
Bible of Robert de Bello- England S- E- Canterbury 1240 1253 Historiated initial with scenes of Genesis.
Rev.12:1-5; Gothic manuscript, 1250-85 AD, Angel passes Christ child into Hands of God.
See: Nigel Morgan, Early Gothic Manuscripts (II) 1250-85, (Lon.: Harvey Miller, 1988), fig. 37.
Coppo di Marcovaldo, St. Michael & his legend; AD 1250-60, San Casciano val di pesa museum of sacred art.
Fall of the Rebell Angels - Nelson-Atkins Museum of Art in Kansas City, Missouri.
Chute des anges déchus, BNF Richelieu Manuscrits occidentaux, Français 21, Fol. 17 Saint Augustin, Cité de Dieu (traduction Raoul de Presles), France, Paris, XVe. War in Heaven, God's angels combat rebell angels & thrust them down into the underworld!
The Fall of the Rebel Angels from Les Très Riches Heures du duc de Berry (miniature), c. 1410. Council in heaven, war & fall of the rebellious angels out of their council seats. Their thrusting out of heaven & fall to become the demons of the underworld.
To name a few.
I appreciate your scholarism, it's kind of funny that I posted as I did, I'm more into the spiritual source of revelation, the Holy Spirit. In general, I posted this under the impression that one person in the entire forum would take it as honest feedback.
I think one thing missing from your argument is that the book of Mormon was fabricated so late in the timeline, I Have about as much problem associating it as "biblical literature" as I do associating modern christian denominations with the historic faith. as my faith says, I'm a christian seeker. hope you have a good day, thanks for the information.
I think I've dealt with the argument that falsely charges that "the book of Mormon was fabricated so late in the timeline." In different posts, I've already been answering different issues that different ones have raised against the Book of Mormon & Mormonism, pointing out the parallels between early anti-Christian - Atheistic writings, & the tactics used to vilify the LDS-Mormons, or The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. (Posts: #1, Also, I would invite you to see the posts on The Book of Mormon Challenge. Part 2. One of the challenges us bible believers are hit with is a similiar claim, that the bible was a fabrication, borrowed from pagan mystery religions, & similiar pre-bible mythologies. How would you answer those charges? Ignore them? Wouldn't your answer answer your own charges, which words, if you should ever write, then be words one could use to answer this issue already answered?
T. W. Doane, Bible Myths.
John P. Lundy, Monumental Christianity.
A. S. Garretson, Primitive Christianity & Early Criticism.
DT BOM Evidences rough drafts.
I appreciate your apologietics stuff for your religion and stuff but if you look at the top of the web browser, perhaps the question was the wrong question.
When I look at texts, all I care about is the supernatural power in the application, this is why I regard, the book of Mormon separate from the bible and the quran (which also has an alternate account of the old testament and Jesus) as separate from the bible. Perhaps looking at this from a purely scholastic level is your paygrade, and you do it very well. However, my concern is more related to keeping things separate so they don't tear one another apart in the manifestation.
thanks for your words.
Looking at The Book of Mormon from a scholastic level is only just one level, the more rewarding look is the spiritual quest for truth. Scholarship only serves to back up ones' faith, like scholarly works done on Bible evidences. Sometimes, Biblical evidences & Book of Mormon evidences cross over & compliment each other, like the Lachish Letters, for example. Members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (Mormons, LDS), have asked the readers of the Book of Mormon to make it a prayerful, pondering study. To even ask God, in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ if the book is true, or not. Some of the last testimonials that end the Book of Mormon are by Moroni, an ancient American prophet: "And when ye shall recieve these things, I would exhort you that ye would ask God, the Eternal Father, in the name of Christ, if these things are not true; and if ye shall ask with a sincere heart, with real intent, having faith in Christ, he will manifest the truth of it unto you, by the power of the Holy Ghost." (BOM, Moroni 10:4). The prophet Nephi, also testified: "And now, my beloved brethren, and also Jew, and all ye ends of the earth, hearken unto these words and believe in Christ; and if ye believe not in these words believe in Christ. And if ye shall believe in Christ ye will believe in these words, for they are the words of Christ, and he hath given them unto me; and they teach all men that they should do good. And if they are not the words of Christ, judge ye-- for Christ will show unto you, with power and great glory, that they are his words, at the last day; and you and I shall stand face to face before his bar; and ye shall know that I have been commanded of him to write these things, notwithstanding my weakness." (BOM, 2 Nephi 33:10-11).
It's like what LDS apostle, Huge B. Brown, (Profile of a Prophet), said, from a lawyer's point of view giving evidences. How that after all these evidences, give him an "intellectual conviction," it was also "by the power of the Holy Ghost" he also knew the Book of Mormon to be true, & Joseph Smith to be a true prophet. True prophets now, are like the old & new Testament prophets, they aren't perfect, they admit they make mistakes, they also have to repent too. But, despite their imperfections, like David's, we have God giving through them, the scriptures that help inspire us to do good & believe in the Messiah-Christ. The Book of Mormon represents another long line of prophets in a different part of the world, the ancient Americas. Its intentions is not to replace the Bible, but to back it up as a second separate area of the world's witness of Christ's visits & dealings with other people far away from the Old & New Testament lands. But even early to later Christians also testified that Christ went to other nations too. He did this so that he wouldn't be found neglectful of other far away peoples & lands. Plus, so that "people could be saved wherever they were," says early Christian father, Clement of Alexandria, (2nd-3rd cent., Ante-Nicene Fathers, 2:490-92). Christ's world wide treks, these early Christian doctrines, eventually faded off into legends about Santa Claus' annual Christmas rounds. So while many modern Christians still do the Christmas mythologies during Christmas time, as also do Mormons, we all can take a look at Christ's world trek in the BOM 3rd Nephi. If some might argue it's a myth, then they shouldn't have a problem with it, if they also take part in Christmas lore, traditions & customs. If it's not a myth, as Mormons testify that it isn't a made up story, but that it's true. If it's not a myth or is not a made up story from Joseph Smith's imagination, but is true, but is still not to be believed by non-Mormons, then at least Christians should be willing to believe their own early Christian apologists. Or at least take a look at their own early Christian roots, & the early Christians amongst the early church Fathers, who testified that Christ went to all nations. If Christians don't even accept their answers, then they'll have to answer the early anti-Christians charge as to why Christ neglected other nations! But also, why Satan & his followers seem to have been able to go everywhere about the world to set up counterfeit paganistic religions, but Christ & his apostles weren't able too, (even though that goes against early Christian traditions that say Christ & his apostles did go throughout the world). So, who has the greater powers? I'm asking this, because I've often heard Christians say that Christ couldn't have gone to the ancient Americas because there's "no evidence" of Christianity having been spread there, the religions were too barbaric-paganistic & satanic. Well, that would mean two things: 1. Satan did set up counterfeit religions in the ancient to later Americas, (which the BOM warned would happen, after the people started to reject Christ & hunt down believers in Christ, (over 200 years after Christ's visit, BOM, 4th Nephi & Mormon, Moroni 9:4-20). While, 2: Christ neglected the Americas & all other parts of the world. This is why I ask who has the greater powers? Christ, to do good? Or the Devil & his angels, to do evil all over the world, anciently & modernly?
Did you know that they found evidence of a network of trade with the vikings near the great lakes? I'm sure if Nephi and his crew were there earlier evidence will pop up evenutally, until then it's a faith thing.
You keep on throw-uping the same old issues. Trying the Joseph Gerballs Nazi disinformation propaganda tactic of repeating the lie until it sticks?
We already answered the poligamy BOM issue,
we already answered the seer stone issue, pointing out Biblical uses,early Christian uses,
and parallel charges made by early anti-Christians that early Christains used "magical stones."
You also keep attempting to speak for Mormons: "The Mormon idea is "If an angel said it - you can do it no matter what the Bible says" -- and that is not what we find in the unchanging God of the actual Bible." (What's your source? Can it be shown to be official Doctrine? Or is it another gross distortion of your's to vilify Mormons?)
Can your own faith pass your own tests, ill-logic, vilification tactics, disinformation methods, distortions of beliefs, etc?
But unlike your mean spirited posts, I'm going to be fair.
I'm going to expose your tactics, by exposing them mirrored back to you in the same types of tactics used against your faith, the 7th Day Adventists. Thus, this is not an anti-SDA post, but one to show what could happen if your own disinformation propaganda game was played on your own beliefs.
Tactic 1, citing ex-(members of faiths). "SDA truth is different from Biblical truth." Hmmm. This tactic uses formers, or exes, who, after leaving, turn around to "warn" the public of the dangers,
"The mission of the Seventh-day Adventist Church is to proclaim to all peoples the everlasting gospel in the context of the Three Angels' messages of Revelation 14:6-12." Hmmm, must be guilty of Gal.1:8.
"Adventists have two "inspired" sources of truth: The Bible and the writings of Ellen G. White, which they refer to as the Spirit of Prophecy." Hmmm, guilty of own standard? "The idea then is to TEST the doctrine against the Bible to SEE IF it is valid." What would ex-SDA say about White's visions, prophecies, & extra biblical message?
(Tactic 2: Use of "their own writings" against your rival. A tactic early anti-Christians used too, See The Ante-Nicene Fathers, vol. 4, Origen Against Celsus).
Watch out for those evil, nasty, voo doo pooh SDAs, (Tactic 3, vilification tactic, generalize the whole group as such, list a few cases of wrong doing done by rivals to try to vilify the whole group). "At some point I think that would be a "wake up call" for bible students" (Tactic 2), to examine the false teachings of SDAs. Their deceptive methods too!
SDAs "a cult!" (Tactic 4: Use judgmental vilification name calling brands to vilify rival, as being a cult. This brand creates a negative impression of the group,
SDAs' god a meany? "God destroys everyone at his second coming and the earth is desolate." (
Tactic 5
: Uses unofficial statements & claims to representing beliefs, but which are from an outsider's perspective, & may not be an accurate representation of belief.
Tactic 6: Shocking generalizations, this one takes a concept out of its surrounding doctrinal or belief settings, but fails, on purpose, to give surrounding beliefs & explanations. Like saying: Christians drink blood, (without explaining the sacrament). Atheists use this one against Christians).
SDAs part of the occultic Illuminati? Their symbol, the eye in a triangle, makes them part of a secret society! Watch out!
(Tactic 7: Vilify, mis-represent, misinterpret symbols, try to make connections between symbols used, (even if they have good meanings), & those groups who also use the same, or similiar symbols for evil. This is a popular tactics that some have used to vilify many religions. This tactics would make St. John, America, the Boy Scouts, & others who use the eagle as a symbol
Yes, if someone wanted to do what Bob (SDA), has done against the Mormons here on this Christian message board, one could vilify SDA, just as easily as other faiths could be vilified too.
The point here again is to not be anti-SDA, but to point out how Bob's continual shots at the Mormons, are in fact an attack on his own faith & others here, if & when his tests are mirrored back to him & used against SDA & others' faiths. An approach that only further causes ill-feelings, misunderstandings
I guess we will have to wait and ask Solomon Spaulding since he came up with the Nephi ideas first.
So Jesus wasn't God?
Sounds like a extremely minor detail actually. So he was a man one more time so what?Before He was a Man, Jesus was God.
He was never a Man before He was God.
The idea that God the Father was ever a man from some other planet is not Christian.
I thought this had been established long ago.
I'm actually surprised this thread is still here.
Sounds like a extremely minor detail actually. So he was a man one more time so what?
I don't really see how it changes the whole context of the story to any great degree.Are you saying the Bible said that ?
Or that the BoM says it?
Or are you saying that from an atheist POV having Christ as or God the Father as a man before coming to this earth - as part of the story - does not matter?
And you'll be able to quote Spaulding on this, right?
Oh yeah, all you have is hearsay evidence.
Spaulding Manuscript
See this page in the original 1992 publication.
Author: Chase, Lance D.
The Spaulding Manuscript is a fictional story about a group of Romans who, while sailing to England early in the fourth century A.D., were blown off course and landed in eastern North America. One of them kept a record of their experiences among eastern and midwestern American Indian tribes. The 175-page manuscript was first published as a 115-page monograph in 1885, some seventy years after the death of its author, Solomon Spaulding (sometimes spelled Spalding). The only known manuscript was lost from 1839 until its discovery in Honolulu, Hawaii, in 1884. It was promptly published by both the Latter-day Saints and Reorganized Latter Day Saint churches to refute the theory of some critics that it had served as an original source document for the Book of Mormon, supposedly supplied to Joseph Smith by Sidney Rigdon.
Spaulding was born in Ashford, Connecticut, on February 21, 1761. He served in the American Revolution, later graduated from Dartmouth College, and became a clergyman. He subsequently lost his faith in the Bible, left the ministry, and worked unsuccessfully at a variety of occupations in New York, Ohio, and Pennsylvania until his death near Pittsburgh in 1816. About 1812 he wrote Manuscript Found, which he attempted to publish to relieve pressing debts.
http://eom.byu.edu/index.php/Spaulding_Manuscript
It's a major deal to Christians. God existed before there was a universe, or men, or any planets for men to be born on.Sounds like a extremely minor detail actually. So he was a man one more time so what?
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