what would you do?

[OllieFranz]

You see
'The big red bus went up the hill'
thats what its says a big red bus went up a hill. how can I interpret that differently?
If it means the little green bus went down the hill, how is anyone else going to know what I mean?

Sorry, the Bible texts say what they say and they speak against same-sex sex.
If some dont believe the Bible texts fine but that unbelief not interpretation.

But if it says "The bus was riding on a grade," and you were always told that the bus was a big red bus and that the grade was an uphill grade, then that is not the same as the the verse stating that the bus was a big red bus and the grade was uphill.

And it is not then unbelief if I have some reason for claiming that the bus may have been small and green, or that the grade was downhill.

One example of this from Scripture is the "forbidden fruit" of Genesis 2. Nowhere in scripture is it called an apple, and yet that is what we have all been told.

 

[David Brider]

I have yet to see a one of you who is trying to understand better. Maybe someone else has.

Well, I'm certainly someone who's trying to understand better. Because it seems to me that certain passages of scripture are used to justify some pretty appalling treatment of and attitudes to some people just because of who they're attracted to. And if the verses that are used are in fact being misinterpreted or poorly translated, then that's a major issue, of which those responsible for the appalling treatment really need to be aware.

All I have seen is a bunch of folks who want to be in homosexual relationships presenting word studies from homosexual sympathizers about why God's Word doesn't say what it does so that they can feel less guilty about committing sin.

I've no desire to be in a homosexual relationship.

And basically, are you saying that anyone who offers any translation or interpretation of certain passages which differs from what you accept, then those people are automatically "homosexual sympathisers" - as opposed to, say, people with a valid point to make based on knowledge of the meaning of the original Hebrew or Greek words or the culture in which the texts in question were written?

If you were looking for better understanding, you guys would be doing so on every issue and not just this one that you hold so dear.

I try not to focus to heavily on issues - really, it's only this and pacifism about which I really get involved in these sorts of protracted online discussions. For the most part, I tend to just focus on getting to know God better, following Him, living out a life of obedience to Him, honouring Him with the life I live.

David.

 

[Zaac]

Well, I'm certainly someone who's trying to understand better. Because it seems to me that certain passages of scripture are used to justify some pretty appalling treatment of and attitudes to some people just because of who they're attracted to. And if the verses that are used are in fact being misinterpreted or poorly translated, then that's a major issue, of which those responsible for the appalling treatment really need to be aware.

Verses aren't the reason why folks mistreat homosexuals anymore than Scripture was the reason folks mistreated Blacks.

You're not going to change people's hearts by changing what Scripture says. You're trying to affect the Spiritual with that of the flesh.

If people are grounded and growing in Christ they will know that as the Bible says you Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves Phillipians 2:3

People's hearts and attitudes will be changed by an encounter and a growing in Christ and His Word that makes men free. A changing of what the Scripture says does nothing.

I've no desire to be in a homosexual relationship.

And basically, are you saying that anyone who offers any translation or interpretation of certain passages which differs from what you accept, then those people are automatically "homosexual sympathisers" - as opposed to, say, people with a valid point to make based on knowledge of the meaning of the original Hebrew or Greek words or the culture in which the texts in question were written?

When what you are saying does not align itself with the FULL COUNSEL of God's Word, that's exactly what I'm saying.

 

[David Brider]

Verses aren't the reason why folks mistreat homosexuals anymore than Scripture was the reason folks mistreated Blacks.

Maybe not, but some people seem to be more than happy to treat scripture verses as a good excuse to mistreat homosexuals.

You're not going to change people's hearts by changing what Scripture says.

I'm not trying to change what Scripture says. I'm trying to make sure I read what it says correctly, free of bias or agenda.

If people are grounded and growing in Christ they will know that as the Bible says you Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit, but in humility consider others better than yourselves Phillipians 2:3

But many times, it seems that people are quite happy not to behave like this - rather, when they encounter homosexual men and women, they assume themselves to be superior. Or at least that's the way it comes across.

When what you are saying does not align itself with the FULL COUNSEL of God's Word, that's exactly what I'm saying.

And how do you determine whether something aligns itself with the full counsel of God's Word? If you're basing that your knowledge of the full counsel of God's Word on what's in the Scriptures, then don't you want to be absolutely sure that those Scriptures are translated and interpreted correctly? Or do you assume that they already are?

David.

 

[mont974x4]

Like someone claiming Christ who continues to be a drunkard or live with a woman not his wife, or any other sinful lifestyle we must take them to the Word and encourage repentence in accordance with Matthew 18 and 1 Cor 5.



Hold all sin to the same standard.

 

[Zaac]

Maybe not, but some people seem to be more than happy to treat scripture verses as a good excuse to mistreat homosexuals.

A lot of times that just the excuse that homosexuals are making because they think that Christians hate them and are using the Word to condemn them.

The folks who mistreat homosexuals because they are homosexuals don't need Scripture as an excuse to do so.

I'm not trying to change what Scripture says. I'm trying to make sure I read what it says correctly, free of bias or agenda.

Then forget the word studies and the commentary. deal with what the text says FIRST and allow God to speak to your heart about what the Word means. THEN you isogete(word studies ,etc.) to get the modern day application.

But many times, it seems that people are quite happy not to behave like this - rather, when they encounter homosexual men and women, they assume themselves to be superior. Or at least that's the way it comes across.

Gosh, that works both ways. I'm met plenty of gay people who feel as though they are better than heterosexuals.

And how do you determine whether something aligns itself with the full counsel of God's Word? If you're basing that your knowledge of the full counsel of God's Word on what's in the Scriptures, then don't you want to be absolutely sure that those Scriptures are translated and interpreted correctly? Or do you assume that they already are?

David.

When it does not make God into a liar. When it does not breed confusion.

Aside from what Scripture says specifically about same sex sex acts, in order for homosexual relationships to be of God, you would have to throw out what he says about husbands and wives and raising Godly children. You would have to throw out what he has exampled as the model for the family based on His relationship with us.

You would have to throw out the underlying theme of the Church being the Bride and Christ being the Bridegroom.

You'd have to throw out the commands about fornication.

Once those are gone, it really makes no sense to have one against adultery.

I could go on and on and on( and perhaps some day I'll pen a book) about all the things of God that would have to be undone in order to make this one sin not a sin.