What would it take to disprove atheism?

[PsychoSarah]

That's what I'm saying, if you don't reject God you don't even get a contrast. So if I was saying atheists reject God as if you hadn't already said stop, I would at least be giving them the benefit of the doubt. But actually you don't even deserve that: there is a God.

Not that we should think we deserve anything from God, apart from Christ.

What makes you think humanity deserves a savior? A species willing to torture a supposedly innocent and sinless person just so we aren't accountable for our own actions doesn't sound like people worth saving to me.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Question for the group: If you are an atheist, what would it take to convince you that there truly is "something" rather than "nothing"?

Or is it possible? (I have a feeling that some loathe the concept of God so much, they could watch the seas part & they would STILL find a reason to doubt.....)

That's like asking what would convince me that a shape is not asymmetrical... well... all you need to do is prove that it in fact is symmetrical.

There's nothing in atheism to disprove, because there are no claims to prove or disprove. That would be theism instead. I'm an atheist only because nobody ever presented me with a valid case in support of theism...

To use Matt's analogy from the atheist experience...
As an atheist, i'm not trying to sell anything... as an atheist i'm just not buying what theists are selling.

 

[MoneyGuy]

There's nothing in atheism to disprove, because there are no claims to prove or disprove

Really? Imagine that God comes down and talks to you. He asks what proof do you need and you say something like, "Raise that car into the air, then put it down. Then tell me tonight's score."

He lifts the car and accurately reveals the score. For good measure he also accurately tells you the attendance number. That wouldn't prove it for you?

 

[Freodin]

Really? Imagine that God comes down and talks to you. He asks what proof do you need and you say something like, "Raise that car into the air, then put it down. Then tell me tonight's score."

He lifts the car and accurately reveals the score. For good measure he also accurately tells you the attendance number. That wouldn't prove it for you?

Prove what?

DogmaHunter said it quite perfectly: "As an atheist, i'm not trying to sell anything... as an atheist i'm just not buying what theists are selling."

If we as atheists would state that God coming down, raising cars into the air and telling tonight's score would disprove our atheism, we would instantly be confronted with hordes of enraged Christiant chiding us for wanting to put God to such cheap party tricks, and God
would never ever do that.

We are not buying what you are trying to sell. And we are not buying what you are not trying to sell.

 

[DogmaHunter]

Really? Imagine that God comes down and talks to you. He asks what proof do you need and you say something like, "Raise that car into the air, then put it down. Then tell me tonight's score."

He lifts the car and accurately reveals the score. For good measure he also accurately tells you the attendance number. That wouldn't prove it for you?

I think you misunderstood what I said.

Atheism is not a claim. There's nothing to disprove there.
Atheism is a position on a theistic claims.

 

[znr]

Bingo. This is exactly why the human race needs saving, and to repent (turn away from sin).

Have we not all committed murder in our hearts?

What makes you think humanity deserves a savior? A species willing to torture a supposedly innocent and sinless person just so we aren't accountable for our own actions doesn't sound like people worth saving to me.

 

[bhsmte]

Bingo. This is exactly why the human race needs saving, and to repent (turn away from sin).

Have we not all committed murder in our hearts?

That's heavy and a little over the top IMO.

 

[znr]

Heavy how? Please explain. I don't understand why you'd say that?

That's heavy and a little over the top IMO.

 

[Golden Yak]

Have we not all committed murder in our hearts?

Not me.

And it wasn't my idea for Jesus to die to 'absolve' everybody. I'd have freed him.

 

[znr]

I don't intend to argue (for Christ), or contend with your belief / lack of / View, whatever. I'm sharing mine. But I do want you to know that in no way shape or form am I being rude to you, or anyone, by being so blunt. I do respect your position.

Not me.

And it wasn't my idea for Jesus to die to 'absolve' everybody. I'd have freed him.

 

[bhsmte]

Heavy how? Please explain. I don't understand why you'd say that?

We all need saving because we have all committed murder in our hearts? That is rhetoric, with nothing to back it. I assume also, you are claiming we need to be saved by God correct?

Well, there is an abundance of evidence, that advanced countries with the lowest percentage of God believing people, live quite well; lower crime rates, better education, lower divorce rates and overall quality of living.

What is saving them?

 

[Golden Yak]

I don't intend to argue (for Christ), or contend with your belief / lack of / View, whatever. I'm sharing mine. But I do want you to know that in no way shape or form am I being rude to you, or anyone, by being so blunt. I do respect your position.

That's fine, you didn't come across as rude. I was just answering your (I guess hypothetical?) question.

 

[znr]

Yes, saved by God. I mean exactly that. No mincing words here. Alright, about the murder part, now that I think about it I see how that seems heavy, but IMO still relevant. Yes I realize that some societies have lower crime rates and better living, but asking me to tell you what is saving them is like asking a level I admin asst to be a CEO.

I've read your bio and posts, so I know where you're coming from. I'm sorry to you if I seemed to hit over the head. I can learn to be more gentle.

We all need saving because we have all committed murder in our hearts? That is rhetoric, with nothing to back it. I assume also, you are claiming we need to be saved by God correct?

Well, there is an abundance of evidence, that advanced countries with the lowest percentage of God believing people, live quite well; lower crime rates, better education, lower divorce rates and overall quality of living.

What is saving them?

 

[bhsmte]

Yes, saved by God. I mean exactly that. No mincing words here. Alright, about the murder part, now that I think about it I see how that seems heavy, but IMO still relevant. Yes I realize that some societies have lower crime rates and better living, but asking me to tell you what is saving them is like asking a level I admin asst to be a CEO.

I've read your bio and posts, so I know where you're coming from. I'm sorry to you if I seemed to hit over the head. I can learn to be more gentle.

Bottom line. There are a lot of people in this world who get along just fine and live highly moral lives without believing in a God and that is reality.

I have no issue with others who believe on faith, things only become an issue when someone claims; I am missing something they think I need to have. No one and I mean no one, is in a position to be that authority.

 

[znr]

No one should be sticking their finger in someone else's face like that. But we both know believers are thinking it, right? As i see it people are in great need anyway, myself included. It's not my right to point at you and demean you or invalidate your worth by being arrogant. That would be confrontation worthy.

I don't want to get into those other people or why they live in peace seemingly without God. I think the discussion wouldn't be productive. We would just be back and forth all week, you think?

Bottom line. There are a lot of people in this world who get along just fine and live highly moral lives without believing in a God and that is reality.

I have no issue with others who believe on faith, things only become an issue when someone claims; I am missing something they think I need to have. No one and I mean no one, is in a position to be that authority.

 

[MoneyGuy]

Prove what?

DogmaHunter said it quite perfectly: "As an atheist, i'm not trying to sell anything... as an atheist i'm just not buying what theists are selling."

If we as atheists would state that God coming down, raising cars into the air and telling tonight's score would disprove our atheism, we would instantly be confronted with hordes of enraged Christiant chiding us for wanting to put God to such cheap party tricks, and God
would never ever do that.

We are not buying what you are trying to sell. And we are not buying what you are not trying to sell.

I'm not trying to sell you anything. The question was not posed to you but why don't you answer it? If that happened, would you believe in God.

 

[MoneyGuy]

I think you misunderstood what I said.

Atheism is not a claim. There's nothing to disprove there.
Atheism is a position on a theistic claims.

No, I understood you. If those things happened, would you believe there is a God? That's the question.

 

[bhsmte]

No one should be sticking their finger in someone else's face like that. But we both know believers are thinking it, right? As i see it people are in great need anyway, myself included. It's not my right to point at you and demean you or invalidate your worth by being arrogant. That would be confrontation worthy.

I don't want to get into those other people or why they live in peace seemingly without God. I think the discussion wouldn't be productive. We would just be back and forth all week, you think?

Likely unproductive yes, because it would be an ideological discussion and those are always never ending.

 

[digitalgoth]

I think this is sig worthy. Do you mind if I borrow it?

Feel free.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Feel free.

Dang!

It's too long and I really don't want to reduce it or get rid of my current sig.
(I'm not don't do well with change)

Either way, thanks for the interesting perspective.