What Would Falsify the Flood? (2)

[Gracchus]

Some twisting scripture that happens to fit an opinion. OK.

And, as I remember, if God did not share your opinion, you promised to "kick his keister". Of course that was an empty threat, because your god, being in your head, always agrees with you.

 

[dad]

And, as I remember, if God did not share your opinion, you promised to "kick his keister". Of course that was an empty threat, because your god, being in your head, always agrees with you.

It actually seems God was in a lot of people's heads long before I was born. It also seems that they understood that this earth was created, and not a place Noah brought mankind to from another planet. Really.

 

[Gracchus]

It actually seems God was in a lot of people's heads long before I was born. It also seems that they understood that this earth was created, and not a place Noah brought mankind to from another planet. Really.

God is in a lot of people's heads. Neuroscientists have done MRI brainscans. When people think of their own opinions, one area of the brain "lights up". When they think of other people's opinions, a different area of the brain "lights up". When they think of God's opinions, the first area of the brain "lights up"!

Your "God" is YOU! And that's why he always agrees with you. And that is probably true for every religious person, no matter what religion they profess. God is "I AM". As the Hindus put it: Atman is Brahman. (The soul is God.) Or: Tat tvam asi. (That, thou art.)

You should be very happy! Neuroscience has found God, and you haven't been separated from him. He has always been you.

 

[AV1611VET]

And, as I remember, if God did not share your opinion, you promised to "kick his keister".

That's wrong, and you know it:

Except you of course! Or don't you remember that you threatened to "kick his keister" if he dared to disagree with you?

Think again. The off topic bit you allude to was likely about if He disagreed with His Own word.

 

[dad]

God is in a lot of people's heads. Neuroscientists have done MRI brainscans. When people think of their own opinions, one area of the brain "lights up". When they think of other people's opinions, a different area of the brain "lights up". When they think of God's opinions, the first area of the brain "lights up"!

Doesn't matter if any area lights up. Freudian devotees probably light up thinking of mom!

Your "God" is YOU!

I did not divide the Red Sea. Claiming anyone is God is insane. Truly.

And that's why he always agrees with you. And that is probably true for every religious person, no matter what religion they profess.

His word is what it is and says what it says things that we either agree with or not.

God is "I AM". As the Hindus put it: Atman is Brahman. (The soul is God.) Or: Tat tvam asi. (That, thou art.)

No. Nothing remotely similar to that. He is the Living God of Jacob and Isaac and Abraham. No meditating or deep reflection needed.

You should be very happy! Neuroscience has found God, and you haven't been separated from him. He has always been you.

They see some lights representing what goes on in some brains. Whoopee doo.

 

[Gracchus]

That's wrong, and you know it:

No it isn't. He said that if God disagreed with his interpretation of the Bible, he would "kick his keister". You on the other hand said you would tell God to "Take a hike!"

It would seem that for you, the dead words are more important than the living God.

____________________________________________

Doesn't matter if any area lights up. Freudian devotees probably light up thinking of mom!

Not Freudians, just test subjects, and theists every one!

I did not divide the Red Sea.

No, you didn't, and Harry Potter didn't save Hogwarts. Those are stories in story books.

Claiming anyone is God is insane. Truly.

I thought you claimed that Jesus was God!? Are you admitting or claiming insanity as a defense?

His word is what it is and says what it says things that we either agree with or not.

God's words are not written on paper. God's words are reality. "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God." To claim that God is a book is I believe, in Christian terms, idolatry, blasphemy, and heresy.

No. Nothing remotely similar to that. He is the Living God of Jacob and Isaac and Abraham. No meditating or deep reflection needed.

Is that what you tell yourself? That you don't need to think about it?

They see some lights representing what goes on in some brains. Whoopee doo.

Theist brains! So... No lights would go on in your brain?

 

[dad]

Not Freudians, just test subjects, and theists every one!

Meaningless. Says who? As for whether the mind messers that did the test accepted psychology, for which Freud was a pillar, I'll leave that to the audience to determine!

No, you didn't, and Harry Potter didn't save Hogwarts. Those are stories in story books.

You don't get to toss all things written in a pile and call them equal actually.

I thought you claimed that Jesus was God!? Are you admitting or claiming insanity as a defense?

No. I claim it for those who are on the other side of my offense.

God's words are not written on paper.

Jesus disagreed. So did the devil. So did the apostles and prophets. So do billions of believers over all time.

God's words are reality. "In the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God." To claim that God is a book is I believe, in Christian terms, idolatry, blasphemy, and heresy.

His words are spirit and truth, and come from Him. By them the world was created, and Jesus rose from the dead.

Is that what you tell yourself? That you don't need to think about it?
Theist brains! So... No lights would go on in your brain?

I do not look at lights that are wired into so called theist heads and imagine I am looking at God! Work on that.

 

[Gracchus]

Meaningless. Says who? As for whether the mind messers that did the test accepted psychology, for which Freud was a pillar, I'll leave that to the audience to determine!

They were neuroscientists, not psychologists. However, it doesn't take much psychology to see that you are protecting your delusion with denial, and confabulation.

You don't get to toss all things written in a pile and call them equal actually.

Well, Harry Potter and all holy books are all about magic and miracles, things that cannot be demonstrated.

No. I claim it for those who are on the other side of my offense.

You said that anyone who claimed that someone was God was insane. You claim Jesus is God, and you think he claimed it himself. I have explained that this is a very common perception in Hinduism. I have presented some neurological evidence that your "God" is a neurological phenomenon. You are in denial.

Jesus disagreed.

Well you say he did. But even if he did, it doesn't mean he was right. Remember, his "scripture" did not include the Gospels, Acts, the epistles, or the Apocalypse.

So did the devil.

Your "devil", like your god, is in your head.

So did the apostles and prophets.

And so did the Tooth Fairy, and so did Santa Clause, and so did Red Riding Hood. What all those people have in common is that they aren't around to tell us what they believed. You can just make it up, whatever you can think of, like your "different state past". It is all about protecting your delusion from reality.

So do billions of believers over all time.

It was not even a century after Constantine made Christianity the state religion that Christians started killing each other over points of doctrine. It is only since reason dropped the damping rods into the reactor that the religious murders and persecutions have slowed. Good Christian boys marched into wars of conquest with God on their side, and killed millions over dogmas about things that no one could possibly know, and that could not possibly make any difference in the real world. Homousion vs. homoiusion? They killed and condemned and ostracized over an iota. And Christians spread their religion with the gun and sword, and with terror, and fire, and blood. With such methods of proselytizing, people are afraid not to believe.

His words are spirit and truth, and come from Him.

Perhaps, but your words come from you. And maybe, his words, being mysterious, true beyond human comprehension, cannot be written in a book.

By them the world was created, and Jesus rose from the dead.

And there it is. That is the crux! (Pardon the pun.) You are afraid of death. If the story isn't true you will be dead. You will say anything and probably do almost anything if you don't have to face the fact of death.
Truth is the light of heaven if you can bear it. If you can't, if you cling to your idol, your dead holy book, your comforting delusion, truth is the fire of hell.

I do not look at lights that are wired into so called theist heads and imagine I am looking at God! Work on that.

So called theists? They have to be liars too? They don't really believe in God? Do you see how you lash about striking at random, in your frenzy of fear?
You don't see god there? You don't see God everywhere? Perhaps that is because you don't see God in reality. God has to conform to some ancient book, and must be safely contained between its covers. You do not hear the voice of God in the world.

"This day I call the heavens and the earth as witnesses against you that I have set before you life and death, blessings and curses. Now choose life, so that you and your children may live" --- Deuteronomy 30:19

 

[AV1611VET]

No it isn't.

Yes, it is.

He said that if God disagreed with his interpretation of the Bible, he would "kick his keister".

If he did, I didn't see it.

You on the other hand said you would tell God to "Take a hike!"

No, I did not.

ETA: Here's the conversation:

Well, you said, and I can supply the quote if required, that if God told you the Bible was not his word, you would tell God to "Take a hike!" (dad said that in the same circumstances he would "kick his (meaning God's) keister".) The Bible, or more accurately your personal interpretation of it, is dearer to you than God.

I have not seen anyone correcting "us guys" on such subjects as "witch hunting, the Inquisition, and the Crusades". About Jesus and the "end times" and "this generation" all I have seen is a bunch of handwaving and claiming that Jesus didn't mean what he said.

That's right ... if god told me the Bible was not his Word, I would tell him to take a hike.

You see, I believe very strongly in this verse:

Mark 13:21 And then if any man shall say to you, Lo, here is Christ; or, lo, he is there; believe him not:

You might believe him, but I won't.

You're Arab phoning your own words:

From: "the Bible was not His word"

To: "if God disagreed with his [my] interpretation"

That is disingenuous to the core.

Perhaps one of my stalkers, who called me a "prevaricator" the other day, would care to do the same for you ... but I seriously doubt it.

 

[dad]

They were neuroscientists, not psychologists. However, it doesn't take much psychology to see that you are protecting your delusion with denial, and confabulation.

So folks that think the brain is the be all end all then. OK. They are in bed with Freud then.

Well, Harry Potter and all holy books are all about magic and miracles, things that cannot be demonstrated.

Great...no wonder Obama loves em!

You said that anyone who claimed that someone was God was insane. You claim Jesus is God, and you think he claimed it himself. I have explained that this is a very common perception in Hinduism. I have presented some neurological evidence that your "God" is a neurological phenomenon. You are in denial.
Well you say he did. But even if he did, it doesn't mean he was right. Remember, his "scripture" did not include the Gospels, Acts, the epistles, or the Apocalypse.

Yes Jesus was the messiah and made no secret of it. That is what it is all about.

Your "devil", like your god, is in your head.

That means no spirits good and bad. That means most men are nuts and always have been...but you and the chosen few. Good luck with that.

It was not even a century after Constantine made Christianity the state religion that Christians started killing each other over points of doctrine.

That indicates humans lived...no news there.

It is only since reason dropped the damping rods into the reactor that the religious murders and persecutions have slowed. Good Christian boys marched into wars of conquest with God on their side, and killed millions over dogmas about things that no one could possibly know, and that could not possibly make any difference in the real world. Homousion vs. homoiusion? They killed and condemned and ostracized over an iota. And Christians spread their religion with the gun and sword, and with terror, and fire, and blood. With such methods of proselytizing, people are afraid not to believe.

Good Christian folks still march in evil wars. They think God is on their side. They have those on both sides of almost any war. Wake up folks.

Perhaps, but your words come from you. And maybe, his words, being mysterious, true beyond human comprehension, cannot be written in a book.

Scripture comes from God. I just read it.

And there it is. That is the crux! (Pardon the pun.) You are afraid of death. If the story isn't true you will be dead.

No worries...I will live forever Jesus promised. Come on over to the living side.

So called theists? They have to be liars too? They don't really believe in God? Do you see how you lash about striking at random, in your frenzy of fear?

One could call Satanists theists! The only thing that really matters if if they believe in Jesus....and His word. Otherwise they are misnamed unbelievers!

 

[PsychoSarah]

It actually seems God was in a lot of people's heads long before I was born. It also seems that they understood that this earth was created, and not a place Noah brought mankind to from another planet. Really.

BTW, why was talking to those people not a violation of free will and for some reason god won't talk to people directly like that today?

 

[dad]

BTW, why was talking to those people not a violation of free will and for some reason god won't talk to people directly like that today?

Mostly I was referring to people who heard Him through His word. I find that hearing a well kept record of what He said and did is of as much worth as hearing voices! Not done in a closet was all this!

 

[TLK Valentine]

Mostly I was referring to people who heard Him through His word.

Ah, so nobody, then.

I find that hearing a well kept record of what He said and did is of as much worth as hearing voices! Not done in a closet was all this!

Ah -- God only talks to people who reads His book; that's one way to get sales up, I suppose.

 

[Gracchus]

So folks that think the brain is the be all end all then. OK.

What folks think that?

They are in bed with Freud then.

You believe in souls. I guess that puts you in bed with Hindus?

Great...no wonder Obama loves em!

Lot's of people love story books. The Bible is the all-time best seller and the Harry Potter books, I am told, made J.K. Rowling the richest woman in the world.

Yes Jesus was the messiah and made no secret of it.

Cyrus the Great was the first "messiah" named in the Bible. He, however, as far as I know, did not claim to be God. Jesus, we are told, claimed to be God, and that, according to you means that he was crazy. In fact, according to you, anyone who claims that anyone is God is crazy. Perhaps you merely overstated your case? Maybe they don't have the same definition of God that you have.

That is what it is all about.

Well, early Christians were divided on that issue. Some thought he was God, some thought he was the Jewish king, some thought he was a rabbi, some were "adoptianists", some thought the man Jesus was merely a vessel, and the final decision was finally made in favor of those with the sharpest swords.

That means no spirits good and bad. That means most men are nuts and always have been...

I won't argue with that. I even think it likely that many women are looney tunes.

...but you and the chosen few. Good luck with that.

It is indeed my good fortune, and none of my own doing, so not really praiseworthy. I never claimed to be "chosen", but by the time I was seven years old I realized that the Biblical god was unfair and certainly not worthy of respect, much less worship.

That indicates humans lived...no news there.

“By their fruits you shall know them.” If the tree is known by its fruit and the Christian “Tree of Life” produces no better fruit than the trees around it, why should it be preferred?

Good Christian folks still march in evil wars. They think God is on their side. They have those on both sides of almost any war. Wake up folks.

Early Christians were quite clear. Soldiers couldn't be Christians. That's one reason that the early Christians were persecuted. So those who march off in evil wars are either not Christians, not good Christians, not good folks, or not good Christian folks.

Scripture comes from God.

How do you know it comes from God? That, after all, is the point of contention. Maybe Harry Potter comes from God. Maybe Tarzan of the Apescomes from God. You, and others, know all sorts of things that are contrary to reason. I met lots of folks who knew things contrary to reason when I worked in a mental ward. One of them claimed to be Jesus. In fact, he knew that he was Jesus of Nazareth. When the doctors found the right medication, he got over it.

I just read it.

Yes, I know, you read it uncritically. It must be true because you want it to be true. It is true because you don't doubt its truth. It's true because you know it's true, because God tells you it's true, and you hear him speaking to you in words that no one else can hear.

No worries...I will live forever Jesus promised.

He also promised to come in glory before all those in his audience died. Were you there?

Come on over to the living side.

I would rather work in the asylum than be an inmate. Then I can go home when my shift is over.

One could call Satanists theists!

I actually met a satanist once. He was converted to that strange belief by Christians. I've known Christians who could make God wish he could be an atheist himself. But even for God, “I think, therefore I AM.” Or could God make himself not God? Or maybe he could just forget that he was God? If he is omnipotent, could he choose not to be omniscient? Maybe he just wants to be surprised at how it will all turn out!

The only thing that really matters if if they believe in Jesus....and His word.

“Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.” Matthew 7:21 KJV
Apparently, it doesn't matter what you believe if you don't do the will of God. I notice Jesus didn't say you had to do his own will, but the will of his “Father which is in heaven.”

Of course, if you really did believe him you would sell everything and give the proceeds to the poor, but if you had done that you wouldn't have a computer to post on this forum! One does have to be practical, no?

Otherwise they are misnamed unbelievers!

Right! No matter what they claimed, if the MRI lit up the wrong area of the brain, they couldn't have been Christians. Hey, maybe they've got an MRI at the Pearly Gates! Then Jesus wouldn't have to sit in judgment. The admission process could be completely automated.

 

[dad]

Ah, so nobody, then.



Ah -- God only talks to people who reads His book; that's one way to get sales up, I suppose.

I think it is a good way to get a message to man. Sales is something on our end...not His. He didn't charge..He paid with His blood.

 

[PsychoSarah]

Mostly I was referring to people who heard Him through His word. I find that hearing a well kept record of what He said and did is of as much worth as hearing voices! Not done in a closet was all this!

Moses spoke with god directly. If speaking to people directly is a violation of free will, then god violated the free will of Moses.

 

[dad]

What folks think that?

Well if some think as you seem to claim, that God is all in the brain, and seen in lights from the brain...guess you would be one..no?

You believe in souls. I guess that puts you in bed with Hindus?

Yes. And all the others who realize that there is more than the physical.

Cyrus the Great was the first "messiah" named in the Bible. He, however, as far as I know, did not claim to be God. Jesus, we are told, claimed to be God, and that, according to you means that he was crazy. In fact, according to you, anyone who claims that anyone is God is crazy. Perhaps you merely overstated your case? Maybe they don't have the same definition of God that you have.

The king who was spoken of and named long before he was born, Cyrus, was a shadow of things to come, and had a purpose. Obviously those that are mildly familiar with prophesy know he was not and could not have been the Messiah.

Well, early Christians were divided on that issue. Some thought he was God, some thought he was the Jewish king, some thought he was a rabbi, some were "adoptianists", some thought the man Jesus was merely a vessel, and the final decision was finally made in favor of those with the sharpest swords.

Paul called it the mystery which had been revealed. The prophesies of Christ involved Him coming first as a Lamb to die and Later to rule...most of the Jews then did not really know that.

.... by the time I was seven years old I realized that the Biblical god was unfair and certainly not worthy of respect, much less worship.

In other words you never knew Him.

Early Christians were quite clear. Soldiers couldn't be Christians.

I wish they would all quit the military myself. There are no just wars these days far as I can tell!

That's one reason that the early Christians were persecuted. So those who march off in evil wars are either not Christians, not good Christians, not good folks, or not good Christian folks.

They may have been onto something....but I take your history with a grain of salt. The soldier in John was only asked to do violence to no man and a few things...not quit his job if I recall.

Yes, I know, you read it uncritically. It must be true because you want it to be true. It is true because you don't doubt its truth. It's true because you know it's true, because God tells you it's true, and you hear him speaking to you in words that no one else can hear.

?? You thought I heard weird stuff? Get a grip man.

He also promised to come in glory before all those in his audience died. Were you there?

No, but I understand what was really said and meant.

I would rather work in the asylum than be an inmate. Then I can go home when my shift is over.

I see. So you might like a job at Gitmo?

I actually met a satanist once. He was converted to that strange belief by Christians. I've known Christians who could make God wish he could be an atheist himself. But even for God, “I think, therefore I AM.” Or could God make himself not God? Or maybe he could just forget that he was God? If he is omnipotent, could he choose not to be omniscient? Maybe he just wants to be surprised at how it will all turn out!

Maybe He doesn't worry about the mind games of the little created men, who seem to want to pretend He should fit their dazed and tiny minded fantasies.

Apparently, it doesn't matter what you believe if you don't do the will of God. I notice Jesus didn't say you had to do his own will, but the will of his “Father which is in heaven.”

To believe is His will. That is what matters..what we do comes as a result.

Of course, if you really did believe him you would sell everything and give the proceeds to the poor, but if you had done that you wouldn't have a computer to post on this forum! One does have to be practical, no?

No. That was advice to a certain few at a certain time, not for me!

Right! No matter what they claimed, if the MRI lit up the wrong area of the brain, they couldn't have been Christians. Hey, maybe they've got an MRI at the Pearly Gates! Then Jesus wouldn't have to sit in judgment. The admission process could be completely automated.

MRI has nothing to do with God or Christians. It probably has to do with men, and how brains can be stimulated...like rats.

 

[dad]

Moses spoke with god directly. If speaking to people directly is a violation of free will, then god violated the free will of Moses.

He spoke directly to Peter and Paul and many others too. I do not think that is the way He communicates to most men these days. If He or an angel did, it would have to agree with the bible anyhow!

 

[PsychoSarah]

He spoke directly to Peter and Paul and many others too. I do not think that is the way He communicates to most men these days. If He or an angel did, it would have to agree with the bible anyhow!

If god was willing to speak to people like that at some point, how is this not a violation of free will? Moses had no opportunity not to believe in god, god pretty much did anything it could to assert its existence to him.

 

[dad]

If god was willing to speak to people like that at some point, how is this not a violation of free will? Moses had no opportunity not to believe in god, god pretty much did anything it could to assert its existence to him.

Maybe God knows the hearts, and who wants to hear from Him.