What was the message of Yeshua?

[Chaplain David]

For me trust is harder. And with me it's a thing that has built over time and I hope gets to the point where it is complete. But I trust the Lord more than ever before and it feels so good to do that. It makes dealing with life easier too and gives us someone more than 100% reliable to count on.

As far as obedience goes I do pretty well because well, I was in the army and you pretty much learn that there. I am not teaching here just sharing from my life. Hope you don't mind. I just love the Lord so much. I would be nothing without Him and what He has done for me is really beyond comprehension.

 

[yedida]

For me trust is harder. And with me it's a thing that has built over time and I hope gets to the point where it is complete. But I trust the Lord more than ever before and it feels so good to do that. As far as obedience goes I do pretty well because well, I was in the army and you pretty much learn that there. I am not teaching here just sharing from my life. Hope you don't mind. I just love the Lord so much. I would be nothing without Him and what He has done for me is really beyond comprehension.

I can hear in your words that you do indeed love Him. As I do.
And yes, trust is much, much harder. It's very easy to unawares fall into a mental agreement with what we've been taught and call it "faith", but not so easy to fall into a mental agreement of trust. Trust is something, like you said, that one works at as it continues to grow and flourish. It's so much richer, isn't it?

 

[Lulav]

Agreed, thus doing as Deut 4 says.



I am confused by what the end result of spreading the light is in your opinion, what does it look like? What does it entail?

Not sure I understand your questions, but I'll try to answer from what I think you are asking.

'Spreading the light'

The Light, I am referring to is the Creator, the one true G-d. When Israel was taken from Egypt, from a land overrun with other 'gods', she was bethrothed, she left Egypt with her 'fiancee'. At the foot of the mountain they were married. There was a kettubah, we call it the Torah. Part of this was to be a representative to the world of who their G-d is, to bring them all (the nations) to the knowledge of the only True G-d.

What does it look like? When it happens I would say it looks like this.

They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the L-RD as the waters cover the sea. Is 11

 

[Lulav]

Agreed!!!! 100%

Everything Yeshua did was to establish the New Covenant.

A summation of what Jesus did to establish the New Covenant so we could receive salvation.

1. Fulfill the law (kept is perfectly and taught it perfectly)
2. Showed how the law pointed to Yeshua
3. Taught about repentance
4. Preached the Kingdom
5. Convicted people of sin. Resolution: He came to give life to those dead in sin.
6. Fulfilled prophesy, validating Yeshua as Messiah
7. Signs and Miracles, validating Yeshua as Messiah
8. Gathered and taught disciples/Apostles (for witnesses to establish the truth)

Could you point out where it says that the New Covenant's purpose was to bring salvation?

 

[mishkan]

What does it look like? When it happens I would say it looks like this.

They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the L-RD as the waters cover the sea.
Is 11

I'd go along with that. Passages like this are why I increasingly view the "end game" of MJ as the restored Kingdom of Israel. Not strumming harps in the clouds, but living according to the Torah of the King, as he reigns from his capitol in Jerusalem.

 

[Yahudim]

Could you point out where it says that the New Covenant's purpose was to bring salvation?

You're just a 'bottom line' kinda girl, aren't you? Well, it is written that He would that all be saved...

1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
1Ti 2:6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.


...but I don't think that's what you are looking for, is it? Perhaps an examination of the difference between Testament and Covenant is in order?

 

[mishkan]

The purpose of Yahshua coming here was to fulfill prophecies, and reconcile mankind to Yahwah under the New Covenant.

I'd word this a bit differently.

First, his purpose was not to fulfill prophecy. That is such a tangential issue, it isn't even funny. All miracles and prophetic events in his life served only to validate Yeshua's claims to being the rightful heir to the Davidic throne.

Second, I agree with you regarding reconciliation. As long as we keep in mind that this reconciliation and "New Covenant" era are synonyms for "restored nation of Israel". It's really a very simple message. We lose that in all the narishkeit thrown around by people who want to make everything much more complicated than it should be.

 

[Lulav]

You're just a 'bottom line' kinda girl, aren't you? Well, it is written that He would that all be saved...

1Ti 2:3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Saviour;
1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.
1Ti 2:5 For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;
1Ti 2:6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.


...but I don't think that's what you are looking for, is it? Perhaps an examination of the difference between Testament and Covenant is in order?

Yes, I was speaking of it in the Tenakh. The New Covenant as described in Jeremiah does not mention salvation. Now salvation can be found throughout the tenakh, G-d is our Salvation.

As far as what you quoted, and at the risk of being reprimanded in the thread by superiors, I think that is just Paul's opinion.

To take that at face value, that Jesus came to save everyone and gave himself a ransom for all, goes against what is found in the gospels as well as the Tenakh.

First everyone can't be saved, as it is a free will choice. Many believe they don't need to be 'saved'.

Second, there are certain men of certain beginnings that G-d hates, these he also will not save.

I look at these words from James, Yeshua's brother and the head of the Jerusalem church:

There is only one Lawgiver and Judge, the one who is able to save and destroy.

What can save you?

Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and the evil that is so prevalent and humbly accept the word planted in you, which can save you.

What good is it, my brothers, if a man claims to have faith but has no deeds? Can such faith save him?

These seem to say to me what Yeshua came for, as Moses spoke of him coming to deliver the word from G-d directly, the word, His Torah, and to work it out in love by keeping it.

Remember what James also wrote:

remember this: Whoever turns a sinner from the error of his way will save him from death and cover over a multitude of sins

Despite opposition, which there will always be, we must always strive to love our neighbor as ourselves and follow these words from James.

 

[Lulav]

I'd word this a bit differently.

First, his purpose was not to fulfill prophecy. That is such a tangential issue, it isn't even funny. All miracles and prophetic events in his life served only to validate Yeshua's claims to being the rightful heir to the Davidic throne.

Second, I agree with you regarding reconciliation. As long as we keep in mind that this reconciliation and "New Covenant" era are synonyms for "restored nation of Israel". It's really a very simple message. We lose that in all the narishkeit thrown around by people who want to make everything much more complicated than it should be.

Yes, I didn't like the way that was worded either, for someone to just come to fulfill a prophecy would be more along the lines of witchcraft.

Yes, many forget that the New Covenant was to be made with Judah and Israel. According to the terms this has not be able to be realized. I think it has been stalled by a new religion.

 

[mishkan]

Yes, I didn't like the way that was worded either, for someone to just come to fulfill a prophecy would be more along the lines of witchcraft.

Yes, many forget that the New Covenant was to be made with Judah and Israel. According to the terms this has not be able to be realized. I think it has been stalled by a new religion.

Sounds like we are thinking along the same lines.

 

[someguy14]

What was the message of Yeshua?

I agree with John 8:28.

 

[Avodat]

Yes, I didn't like the way that was worded either, for someone to just come to fulfill a prophecy would be more along the lines of witchcraft.

Yes, many forget that the New Covenant was to be made with Judah and Israel. According to the terms this has not be able to be realized. I think it has been stalled by a new religion.

Certainly his birth was meant to be for the Jews - no Gentiles were involved except, possibly, the inn keeper. The Jewish Messiah's birth was, as Romans puts it, first to the Jews, then to gentiles who came into it much later. It was to the Jews but hi-jacked by the young church.

 

[Lulav]

Certainly his birth was meant to be for the Jews - no Gentiles were involved except, possibly, the inn keeper. The Jewish Messiah's birth was, as Romans puts it, first to the Jews, then to gentiles who came into it much later. It was to the Jews but hi-jacked by the young church.

the Innkeeper in Bethlehem of Judea?

 

[yedida]

Yes, I didn't like the way that was worded either, for someone to just come to fulfill a prophecy would be more along the lines of witchcraft.

Yes, many forget that the New Covenant was to be made with Judah and Israel. According to the terms this has not be able to be realized. I think it has been stalled by a new religion.

Guess I'm in good company!

 

[etZion]

Not sure I understand your questions, but I'll try to answer from what I think you are asking.

'Spreading the light'

The Light, I am referring to is the Creator, the one true G-d. When Israel was taken from Egypt, from a land overrun with other 'gods', she was bethrothed, she left Egypt with her 'fiancee'. At the foot of the mountain they were married. There was a kettubah, we call it the Torah. Part of this was to be a representative to the world of who their G-d is, to bring them all (the nations) to the knowledge of the only True G-d.

What does it look like? When it happens I would say it looks like this.

They will neither harm nor destroy on all my holy mountain, for the earth will be full of the knowledge of the L-RD as the waters cover the sea. Is 11

I probably should have been more clear, I agree with many points you make, but concerning Matthew 28, it is my understanding of what you have said, that when Yeshua referred to making disciples of the nations, he only intended the Jews to become disciples of him and not gentiles, am I understanding you correctly?

 

[Lulav]

I probably should have been more clear, I agree with many points you make, but concerning Matthew 28, it is my understanding of what you have said, that when Yeshua referred to making disciples of the nations, he only intended the Jews to become disciples of him and not gentiles, am I understanding you correctly?

Yes, initially and those made in foreign lands (remember the Diaspora, there were many large communities of Jews outside of Judea), and from there they would teach the gentiles, first in the synagogues as that would be where the Gentile G-d fearers would be. Then the Gentiles actions would attract other followers of the Gentiles who were looking for the truth.

 

[etZion]

Yes, initially and those made in foreign lands (remember the Diaspora, there were many large communities of Jews outside of Judea), and from there they would teach the gentiles, first in the synagogues as that would be where the Gentile G-d fearers would be. Then the Gentiles actions would attract other followers of the Gentiles who were looking for the truth.

Ok, I think I understand you more, so initially the discipleship program was only intended for Jews, and then the Gentiles would become disciples after the Jews. Did I understand you correctly, if so I agree.

 

[Elisha_7]

Shalom but think about Yeshua words, it certainly not demonic why would you say that?

Mat 5:15
Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

FROM CARM
Jesus is speaking about the Old Testament principles and authority of rule and revelation. When Jesus said that He came to fulfill the law, He came to establish it and demonstrate how it pointed to Him and how He would live it perfectly.

Ephe 2:14-22
For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18 For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit.
19 Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God’s people and members of God’s household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. 21 In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. 22 And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.

FROM CARM
Paul is speaking about how the gentiles who were called the uncircumcision (v. 11), were separated from Christ (v. 12), but have now been brought near (to God) by the blood of Christ (v. 13). Jesus removed the requirement of having to follow the Law in order to please God, established justification by faith, and thereby united both Jew and Gentile into one group in Christ. This is when Paul says in verse 15 that he abolished in his flesh the enmity which is the law of commandments in ordinances. The Law was that which separated Jew from Gentile and since it has been fulfilled in Christ, it is no longer something that would separate Jew and Gentile.

It is a rejoycing time for both Jews and gentile!

Does this helps you Luv, Yidida?

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[Chaplain David]

Good Morning Everyone.

I pray the very best for everyone and their family, this forum, and the improvements we are all trying to make in it that will glorify God through the Son.

In Christ,

CH Sacerdote

 

[DennisTate]

You are not him are you - promoting your own views? The proliferation of this apparent vision (or links to or comments about) appearing on some threads makes me wonder.

No, I am certainly not Rick Joyner but i do believe that his book The Vision could set the stage for an outpouring of the Ruach ha Kodesh/Holy Spirit in many lives!

What he was shown regarding how we view people from other groups was an especially good medicine for the attitude that I had been taught in the Worldwide Church of God.

Rick Joyner:

The Foundation of Glory

Wisdom led me down the mountain to the very lowest level, which was named "Salvation." "You think that this is the lowest level," declared Wisdom, "but this is the foundation of the whole mountain. In any journey, the first step is the most important, and it is usually the most difficult. Without 'Salvation' there would be no mountain."

I was appalled by the carnage on this level. Every soldier was very badly wounded, but none of them were dead. Multitudes were barely clinging to the edge. Many seemed ready to fall off at any moment, but none did. Angels were everywhere ministering to the soldiers with such great joy that I asked, "Why are they so happy?"

"These angels have beheld the courage that it took for these to hold on. They many not have gone any further, but neither did they give up. They will soon be healed, and then they will behold the glory of the rest of the mountain, and begin to climb. These will be great warriors for the battle to come."

"But wouldn't they have been better off to climb the mountain with the rest of us?" I protested, seeing their present condition.

"It would have been better for them, but not for you. By staying here they made it easier for you to climb by keeping most of the enemy occupied. Very few from the higher levels ever reached out to help others come to the mountain, but these did. Even when these were barely clinging to the mountain themselves, they would reach out to pull others up. In fact, most of the mighty warriors were led to the mountain by these faithful ones. These are no less heroes than those who made it to the top. They brought great joy to heaven by continually leading other to 'Salvation.' It was for this reason that all the angels in heaven wanted to come to minister to them, but only the most honored were permitted."

Again I felt a terrible shame at my attitude toward these great saints. Many of us scorned them as we climbed to the higher levels. They had made many mistakes during the battle, but they had also displayed more of the Shepherd's heart than the rest of us. The Lord would leave the ninety-nine to go after the one who was lost. These had stayed in the place where they could still reach the lost, and they paid a dear price for it. I, too, wanted to help but did not know where to start.

Wisdom then said, "It is right for you to want to help, but you will help most by going on to what you have been called to do. These will all be healed and will quickly climb the mountain. They will join you again in the battle. These are fearless ones who will never retreat before the enemy."