What TRADITIONS was Paul Teaching?

[Lulav]

First we learn who was doing the teaching

Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus

5 For our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Spirit and in much assurance, as you know what kind of men we were among you for your sake.
6 And you became followers of us and of the Lord

when you received the word of God which you heard from us, you welcomed it not as the word of men, but as it is in truth, the word of God, which also effectively works in you who believe..... 16 forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they may be saved, so as always to fill up the measure of their sins; but wrath has come upon them to the uttermost.

3:1Therefore, when we could no longer endure it, we thought it good to be left in Athens alone, 2 and sent Timothy, our brother and minister of God, and our fellow laborer in the gospel of Christ, to establish you and encourage you concerning your faith,

4:1Finally then, brethren, we urge and exhort in the Lord Jesus that you should abound more and more, just as you received from us how you ought to walk and to please God; 2 for you know what commandments we gave you through the Lord Jesus.

4:10 But we urge you, brethren, that you increase more and more; 11 that you also aspire to lead a quiet life, to mind your own business, and to work with your own hands, as we commanded you,

4:15 For this we say to you by the word of the Lord, that we who are alive and remain until the coming of the Lord will by no means precede those who are asleep. 16 For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. 17 Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. 18 Therefore comfort one another with these words.

5:16 Rejoice always,
17 pray without ceasing,
18 in everything give thanks; for this is the will of God in Christ Jesus for you.
19 Do not quench the Spirit.
20 Do not despise prophecies.
21 Test all things; hold fast what is good.
22 Abstain from every form of evil.

 

[Lulav]

Found some more on the 'traditions' from Paul later on in 2 Thess.

3:6 But we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw from every brother who walks disorderly and not according to the tradition which he received from us. 7 For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us,

14 And if anyone does not obey our word in this epistle, note that person and do not keep company with him, that he may be ashamed.

 

[daq]

2 Thess 2:15 Therefore, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye have been taught, whether by word, or our epistle.

Maybe we should look to 1 Thess to see what was taught in that letter.

Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus

5 For our gospel did not come to you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Spirit and in much assurance, as you know what kind of men we were among you for your sake.

He also says "our gospel" in 2 Thessalonians 2:14, (just before your first quote above). Both letters are stated to be from Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy: moreover Silvanus apparently writes for Peter in the first epistle by that name, (1 Peter 5:12), and is likely Paul's travel companion named Silas, (which is short for Silvanus), in Acts 15.

2 Thessalonians 2:13-15 ASV
13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, for that God chose you from the beginning unto salvation in sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
14 whereunto he called you through our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
15 So then, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye were taught, whether by word, or by epistle of ours.

 

[Lulav]

Found some more on the 'traditions' from Paul later on in 2 Thess.

3:6 But we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you withdraw from every brother who walks disorderly and not according to the tradition which he received from us. 7 For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us,

14 And if anyone does not obey our word in this epistle, note that person and do not keep company with him, that he may be ashamed.

It makes you think that Paul thought he had the right to make commandments to believers and also to judge them if they don't obey his every command to the point they were to shun a brother.

Shouldn't he have been teaching them to obey GOD? to walk in Yeshua's way?

This part almost sounds threatening

'For you yourselves know how you ought to follow us,'

 

[Lulav]

So it seems he was teaching his own commandments and making his own traditions in that way.

Isn't the the Pharisaic way?

This reminds me of another place where he talks about his gospel being the only one to follow.

Makes you wonder why he would start out his letter this way.

6-9 I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, which is not another;​

Different, but not another?

but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. ​

Who were these 'some' and how were they perverting the Gospel of Messiah?

But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. ​

So he would curse an angel from Heaven? That's pretty drastic to me and also seems very vehemently
self defensive.

As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.​

And it bared repeating? That's pretty strong wording and self defensive to his gospel.

Then he goes on with more self defense of his credentials. Here he speaks of the traditions of his fathers.

13 For you have heard of my former conduct in Judaism, how I persecuted the church of God beyond measure and tried to destroy it. 14 And I advanced in Judaism beyond many of my contemporaries in my own nation, being more exceedingly zealous for the traditions of my fathers.​

Are they different than what he was teaching or did it set a precedent for his understanding that you give an 'oral law' to the new covenant?

 

[daq]

Ah well, I tried...

 

[Lulav]

He also says "our gospel" in 2 Thessalonians 2:14, (just before your first quote above). Both letters are stated to be from Paul, Silvanus, and Timothy: moreover Silvanus apparently writes for Peter in the first epistle by that name, (1 Peter 5:12), and is likely Paul's travel companion named Silas, (which is short for Silvanus), in Acts 15.

2 Thessalonians 2:13-15 ASV
13 But we are bound to give thanks to God always for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, for that God chose you from the beginning unto salvation in sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:
14 whereunto he called you through our gospel, to the obtaining of the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
15 So then, brethren, stand fast, and hold the traditions which ye were taught, whether by word, or by epistle of ours.

Was he not the leader though? Silas and Timothy were 'helpers' of a sort that he taught.

 

[Lulav]

Ah well, I tried...

?

 

[daq]

?

Paul teaches the commandments of the Master, (1 Cor. 14:37, 1 Thes. 4:2). Once I put him to the test concerning such statements I found them to be true.

Take, for example, the Matthew 5:17-48 passage: who or what is being overturned or refuted in that passage? Is the Torah being overturned? I know your answer would be no, not the Torah, (with which of course I would agree), but then what exactly is indeed being overturned or refuted? for something or someone is surely being refuted therein.

Paul expounds the answer to this but neither mainstream Christianity nor even MJ's seem to be willing to believe what he says about it. The war was not over the Torah but over the correct interpretations and understanding of the Torah: this is why the Master Teacher was crucified, for his understanding of the Torah, Prophets, and Writings was a threat to the authority of the rulers over the people.

Who won that war? I've only heard and read that the Master was resurrected, and never any of the Sanhedrin Chief Priests, Elders, Pharisees, or Scribes. Therefore it is their own handwritten ordinances, dogmas, and decrees which are being overturned and refuted in places like Matthew 5 and other similar passages, (Matthew 15:1-9, etc., etc.), just as Paul likewise teaches in the places where he himself actually mentions the handwritten ordinances, dogmas, and decrees, (those which were "against us").

 

[Lulav]

Paul teaches the commandments of the Master, (1 Cor. 14:37, 1 Thes. 4:2). Once I put him to the test concerning such statements I found them to be true.

Take, for example, the Matthew 5:17-48 passage: who or what is being overturned or refuted in that passage? Is the Torah being overturned? I know your answer would be no, not the Torah, (with which of course I would agree), but then what exactly is indeed being overturned or refuted? for something or someone is surely being refuted therein.

Paul expounds the answer to this but neither mainstream Christianity nor even MJ's seem to be willing to believe what he says about it. The war was not over the Torah but over the correct interpretations and understanding of the Torah: this is why the Master Teacher was crucified, for his understanding of the Torah, Prophets, and Writings was a threat to the authority of the rulers over the people.

Who won that war? I've only heard and read that the Master was resurrected, and never any of the Sanhedrin Chief Priests, Elders, Pharisees, or Scribes. Therefore it is their own handwritten ordinances, dogmas, and decrees which are being overturned and refuted in places like Matthew 5 and other similar passages, (Matthew 15:1-9, etc., etc.), just as Paul likewise teaches in the places where he himself actually mentions the handwritten ordinances, dogmas, and decrees, (those which were "against us").

And how would Gentiles even know that?

 

[daq]

And how would Gentiles even know that?

They generally don't because all you have to do is interpret handwriting of dogmas to mean "the Law", and abracadabra, "the Law was nailed to the cross and is now abolished". This is well known by the constant drumbeat of the mainstream argument concerning those two primary passages, (Eph 2:15 and Col 2:14), all over the internet forum world.