What should happen to habitual petty criminals?

[Autumnleaf]

Some people just can't help themselves and are a menace to society. Whether it is habitual drunk driving or petty theft to pay for a chronic drug habit some people always seem to find themselves at odds with the law. How should society deal with such people?

 

[football5680]

We could multiply whatever the punishment is by 2 every time they get arrested. Eventually they would get to the point where a petty crime would basically be a life sentence.

 

[mafwons]

Some people just can't help themselves and are a menace to society. Whether it is habitual drunk driving or petty theft to pay for a chronic drug habit some people always seem to find themselves at odds with the law. How should society deal with such people?

We could treat the underlying addiction, we could work to rehabilitate them. There are underlying reasons for addiction, and the drive to fill the need the addiction brings will drive people to do many things. Not all underlying problems can be solved but some can be. And we should loosen up the laws, if cocaine, for instance, was legal and available it could be sold cheaply and no real stigma would be attached to its use so the reasons to commit crimes to procure the drug would be greatly diminished. The war on drugs certainly hasn't solved the problem. As for drunk drivers they should face stiff penalties for drunk driving, and if they injure or kill someone they should face full blown assault or murder charges, as when one puts oneself in the position to drive drunk they by default are choosing to hurt other people, and when they do not it is simply good fortune for them and all of society.

 

[Eudaimonist]

Generally, the humane solution, IMV, is some combination of restitution and rehabilitation.

Harsh punishments don't solve anything, and only lead to a society that is harsh.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[dogs4thewin]

We could multiply whatever the punishment is by 2 every time they get arrested. Eventually they would get to the point where a petty crime would basically be a life sentence.

Remember who pays for that; not to mention it could be argued to be a violation of the 8th amendment.

 

[mafwons]

Generally, the humane solution, IMV, is some combination of restitution and rehabilitation.

Harsh punishments don't solve anything, and only lead to a society that is harsh.

eudaimonia,

Mark

They also generally lead to the marginalization and exclusion from society of those punished, which in many cases lead to more criminal behavior.

 

[dogs4thewin]

They also generally lead to the marginalization and exclusion from society of those punished, which in many cases lead to more criminal behavior.

Well, yes because people will not take a risk on them.

 

[mafwons]

Well, yes because people will not take a risk on them.

This is true. I once knew a person who was convicted of an illegal gun charge, he could not meet the terms of his parole because he had to disclose the charge to prospective employers, and no one would hire him. Eventually he had to return to prison to serve his entire sentance. This persons crime was non-violent, simple possesionn and his life was ruined at 19 college scholarship taken away and all, I have lost track of him over the years but I would be willing to bet in those circumstances he has run afoul of the law since then.

 

[Eudaimonist]

They also generally lead to the marginalization and exclusion from society of those punished, which in many cases lead to more criminal behavior.

That's an excellent point.


eudaimonia,

Mark

 

[GoldenBoy89]

We could treat the underlying addiction, we could work to rehabilitate them. There are underlying reasons for addiction, and the drive to fill the need the addiction brings will drive people to do many things. Not all underlying problems can be solved but some can be. And we should loosen up the laws, if cocaine, for instance, was legal and available it could be sold cheaply and no real stigma would be attached to its use so the reasons to commit crimes to procure the drug would be greatly diminished. The war on drugs certainly hasn't solved the problem. As for drunk drivers they should face stiff penalties for drunk driving, and if they injure or kill someone they should face full blown assault or murder charges, as when one puts oneself in the position to drive drunk they by default are choosing to hurt other people, and when they do not it is simply good fortune for them and all of society.

This is pretty much what I was going to reply with but you've put it better than I ever could.

We could instead of finding new and better ways to punish criminals, actually try to focus on the underlying problems that lead to criminal behavior.

Drunk driving should be punished harshly, but alcoholism should not. Crime, like theft or even murder due to drugs should be punished harshly, but simple possession should not. The drugs themselves should never be illegal to possess, that only creates unnecessary crime.

You should never punish a person for being an addict, you should find a way to help them overcome their addiction and also find ways to educate people against drug use. Then and only then will you see a reduction in crime.

 

[Hetta]

Shoot them all.

 

[GoldenBoy89]

Yeah, or we could do this.

Shoot them all.

 

[mafwons]

Shoot them all.

Is that a joke?

 

[Hetta]

It seems to be the American answer to most things.

 

[mafwons]

It seems to be the American answer to most things.

For some things it is a fine answer, not so much for petty criminals.

 

[MehGuy]

Send them all on an island.

Shoot them all into outer space.

Push them back into their mother's womb..

There's so many possibilities.

 

[Verv]

Every attempt at rehabilitation should be made but I imagine after the ninth or tenth time 4-5 years they are up to the exact same shenanigans they need some separation from normal society for quite some time. Perhaps not prison, but perhaps have even some island where all of the habitual drunk drivers go: there are no cars, so people live near each other, ride bicycles to work, etc.

Perhaps another enclave for people who are habitual drug abusers -- no one allowed out after a certain time unless they have special permission, and no one allowed in without a full body search for narcotics, tc.

All the while receiving very active rehabilitative treatment.

But as Eudomonia has suggested -- restitution is also a goal.

Because without restitution we do not satisfy our feeling for revenge -- I know Eudomonia and I have debated this before, and I have said bluntly that I support revenge as this is just the same thing as restitution, but let's let sophists replace these wods with fancier ones and pretend to be above such feelings.

 

[Cjwinnit]

Shoot them all.

That's a bit harsh!!

 

[LOVEthroughINTELLECT]

Some people just can't help themselves and are a menace to society. Whether it is habitual drunk driving or petty theft to pay for a chronic drug habit some people always seem to find themselves at odds with the law. How should society deal with such people?

Prevent the crimes from ever being attempted in the first place.

 

[mafwons]

Prevent the crimes from ever being attempted in the first place.

Should we use our department of pre-crime and proactively take down those who would possibly commit any petty crime.