What should happen to Alex Jones?

[Yttrium]

What if he isn't lying? Lying, to me, implies he is doing it intentionally knowing it's wrong. I believe he believes it. That's the thing about conspiracy theories. You're allowed to have a different opinion. You're allowed to disagree with the main view.

If you're going to accuse somebody of something in public, you need to be able to back it up with evidence. False accusations against somebody can cause harm. Whether the accuser believes the accusations or not doesn't make a difference as far as the slander goes. It may make a difference in how much of a jerk the slanderer is, but the slanderer is going to be sued just the same.

 

[Saucy]

He already admitted he was. Try again.

Oh I sincerely didn't know he admitted to lying. I thought he believed his own stuff.

 

[Saucy]

If you're going to accuse somebody of something in public, you need to be able to back it up with evidence. False accusations against somebody can cause harm. Whether the accuser believes the accusations or not doesn't make a difference as far as the slander goes. It may make a difference in how much of a jerk the slanderer is, but the slanderer is going to be sued just the same.

I thought he provided "evidence." I've seen it all over the place, not that I ever believed it. "Proof" of actors at various shootings. Etc.

 

[Occams Barber]

Oh I sincerely didn't know he admitted to lying. I thought he believed his own stuff.

Even if Jones did not know that what he was saying wasn't true, he has an ethical responsibility as a public broadcaster to verify the facts before going public. This is even more important when the misinformation will cause harm.

Failing to verify harmful information before broadcasting is equivalent to criminal negligence.

OB

 

[public hermit]

Oh I sincerely didn't know he admitted to lying. I thought he believed his own stuff.

That's alright, bud. What consequences do you think that kind of lying needs? I'm into reform, so I wonder how he could serve a consequence that brings him around for good. Perhaps he could work with families that have lost loved ones to mass shootings. Lord knows, there is no shortage of those. Maybe he could just visit them and listen to their pain. What do you think?

 

[Hank77]

You'd have to prove with evidence that Alex Jones caused harm by intentionally lying.

The jury found him guilty so I guess they did.

 

[Saucy]

Even if Jones did not know that what he was saying wasn't true, he has an ethical responsibility as a public broadcaster to verify the facts before going public. This is even more important when the misinformation will cause harm.

Failing to verify harmful information before broadcasting is equivalent to criminal negligence.

OB

So way more news organizations and newspapers should be out of business and reporters in prison right now then.

 

[Saucy]

That's alright, bud. What consequences do you think that kind of lying needs? I'm into reform, so I wonder how he could serve a consequence that brings him around for good. Perhaps he could work with families that have lost loved ones to mass shootings. Lord knows, there is no shortage of those. Maybe he could just visit them and listen to their pain. What do you think?

I would agree that the punishment fits the crime now. If you intentionally lie to that degree, to grieving parents who just lost their kids, and call them fake, etc. Idk. I'm pretty angry right now that someone can be that evil.

 

[ElCamino]

I think he should pay a massive amount of money for the pain and stress he caused those poor parents.

Money won't bring the kids back; but it looks like it's the one thing that would hurt him the most (other than going to jail, probably.)

I don't think he should be deplatformed, at this point he's basically a parody of himself. It seems a good chunk of his audience just follow him because he's entertaining and don't really believe his nonsense.

The ones who do believe his nonsense will always find ways to get it elsewhere.

 

[public hermit]

The ones who do believe his nonsense will always find ways to get it elsewhere

That's an interesting observation. There is a larger problem that he was able to tap into and feed. I think to deplatform him is the only real option available. Is there another way to stop stupid people from believing stupid things?

 

[Hank77]

I would agree that the punishment fits the crime now. If you intentionally lie to that degree, to grieving parents who just lost their kids, and call them fake, etc. Idk. I'm pretty angry right now that someone can be that evil.

The parents got threatening phone calls, etc. because of his lies.
Parents testimony-
The father of a Sandy Hook victim says Alex Jones has made his life a 'living hell'

 

[public hermit]

The parents got threatening phone calls, etc. because of his lies.
Parents testimony-
The father of a Sandy Hook victim says Alex Jones has made his life a 'living hell'

Yeah, the repercussions of his lies are horrendous. People searched out Sandy Hook families to call them liars and threatened their lives.

 

[Occams Barber]

So way more news organizations and newspapers should be out of business and reporters in prison right now then.

I think that the bar for this crime should be set very high but, in principle, we should be prepared to charge organisations which deliberately promote harmful lies.

If we go back a few decades my opinion would be different since there was less of a problem with misinformation. Social media, the internet and online anonymity have changed things. We now have a situation where misinformation can be spread quickly and widely. This means that misinformation can be easily spread and cause far more harm than in the days when the newspaper or TV news were the main sources of information.

We now have a situation where misinformation is epidemic and needs more drastic action to combat it.

OB

 

[IceJad]

He did worse than merely deny that the Sandy Hook shooting took place - he subjected the parents to harassment and death threats from his followers and accused them of being actors, liars and grifters for profit. And he did this for entertainment.

What his followers do are not his responsibility. You can't pin it to him because you don't like him. There is no such thing as crime by association.

A person is free to say as many stupid things as he wants as long as he doesn't request for harm to be done. I know who Alex Jones is but I don't follow him. But as far as I know he only says conspiratorial things and stops short of asking for direct action.

 

[public hermit]

A person is free to say as many stupid things as he wants as long as he doesn't request for harm to be done

That might be the legal stopping point, as things stand. If it is, it's not sufficient. I think we are learning, in the information age, that just saying things has consequences even if no direct imperative is given. I don't know. We're in new territory.

 

[ElCamino]

That's an interesting observation. There is a larger problem that he was able to tap into and feed. I think to deplatform him is the only real option available. Is there another way to stop stupid people from believing stupid things?

Only a better education system will fix that problem. The day schools teach kids how to think (not what to think) we will have a much better society.

Deplatforming won't solve the problem and it will only fit their persecution narrative. If he's gone 10 other versions of him will pop up.

The next versions of him can be a lot more dangerous because they can easily spew the same nonsense but do it with a more serious and/or "legitimate" tone.

 

[public hermit]

Only a better education system will fix that problem

I'm not going to disagree with this. If we have this many people being clearly irrational, education is not happening. I don't blame teachers; I just don't know, but I agree

 

[Saucy]

I've been very moved by watching the parents of Parkland students testify in the sentencing hearing. I just could not imagine their pain...yet to have a raving madman say it was all fake, my pain was fake, that it was all staged. Then having followers harass me. This level of evil is inhumane. If he legitimately believed it, that's bad, but still, you can't tell people what to believe. But to make it all up...just wow. That's profiting on the misery of others.

 

[Occams Barber]

Only a better education system will fix that problem. The day schools teach kids how to think (not what to think) we will have a much better society.

Deplatforming won't solve the problem and it will only fit their persecution narrative. If he's gone 10 other versions of him will pop up.

The next versions of him can be a lot more dangerous because they can easily spew the same nonsense but do it with a more serious and/or "legitimate" tone.

Like @public hermit I also have my doubts that the problem is education and I live in a different country. with a different education system.

There has always been proportion of the population who, for a variety of reasons, are more susceptible to conspiracy thinking. This 'gradient of gullibility' isn't new and simply reflects the range of critical thinking skills available in any given population. One factor which is particularly relevant to the US is the overall levels of anxiety. Anxious people are looking for the easy explanations inherent in conspiratorial thinking.

OB

 

[Aldebaran]

The parents got threatening phone calls, etc. because of his lies.
Parents testimony-
The father of a Sandy Hook victim says Alex Jones has made his life a 'living hell'

Then it should have been those who made the threatening phone calls being put on trial. Apparently, it was easier and more convenient to go after a radio talk show host. More money can be harvested that way.