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You guys make me laugh...
Kira Light, BlackSabb
BFA,
Yes, the codified system of law is what imputed sin.
Rom 5:13
13(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law. KJV
1 Cor 15:56
56 The sting of death is sin; and the strength of sin is the law. KJV
When that which is perfect comes to us, then knowledge (written language), apostolic preaching (tongues), and prophecy will pass away.
Joe
It only takes a cursory view of Hebrews 10:9 where it states "He takes away the first that He may establish the second", and then compare Scripture against what you posted to conclude your contention in complete error.Jesus' didn't come to die on a cross to take away the Ten Commandment, but rather, He died to to take the penalty for breaking them while under the old covenant and He came to establish with His words the terms of a new covneant.
You haven't found a "fourth commandment", which has been a request made to you by more than one member. The narrative Luke wrote shows he apparently had to explain "according to the commandment" to a Gentile recipient of his Gospel account regarding Mary's rest on the sabbath. Once Jesus resurrected and opened the understanding of His disciples, "according to the commandment" of feigned compliance to the first covenant is never found again in Scripture. Assembling on the sabbath days is not compliance to the first covenant law to keep the sabbath holy, which in the law mandates the burnt offerings under a priesthood that has no part in the new covenant.The fact that His followers rested on the Sabbath (According to the 4th commandment) tells us that Jesus made no changes because if He did they would have known about and since He didn't make a change, while He was living, no changes can be made after His death.
I pointed out that Mary complied with both of the sabbaths the historical account reveals in the week Jesus was crucified. You do not. The hypocrisy of your conversation is consistent with your contradiction with Scripture. Others are able to see the inconsistency in your own witness, and want no part of it. In summary, you don't know the law, it shows, and your posts are a joke.BlackSabb said:I don't believe you k4c, you manage to scrimp every little thing you can in a desperate attempt to put people back into the bondage of the law. Just give it up man. No one here is convinced. Seriously dude, the more you twist, distort and take scripture out of context, the more you show everyone how wrong you are. But keep posting. You are a great proponent for NOT keeping the OT Sabbath.
I disagree - you haven't said anything in response to several posts that show your inconsistencies. Your testimony shows that you have departed from the repentance from dead works that isn't to be renewed (Hebrews 6:1-6), you don't keep any of the sabbaths, and one of your latest contentions is that Jesus didn't die on the cross of Calvary to take away the old covenant. When these are pointed out to you, you offer nothing in defense for your contentions.I think I've said way too much on this already. You guys really need to study on your own and understand all the verses, even the ones that conflict with the belief system you have now.
It only takes a cursory view of Hebrews 10:9 where it states "He takes away the first that He may establish the second", and then compare Scripture against what you posted to conclude your contention in complete error.
You haven't found a "fourth commandment", which has been a request made to you by more than one member. The narrative Luke wrote shows he apparently had to explain "according to the commandment" to a Gentile recipient of his Gospel account regarding Mary's rest on the sabbath. Once Jesus resurrected and opened the understanding of His disciples, "according to the commandment" of feigned compliance to the first covenant is never found again in Scripture. Assembling on the sabbath days is not compliance to the first covenant law to keep the sabbath holy, which in the law mandates the burnt offerings under a priesthood that has no part in the new covenant.
The Gospel describes our adoption as God's purchased possession (Galatians 4:4-7), in which we have the same sovereignty over the created law the King enjoys, that has no jurisdiction over the King's children (Matthew 17:24-26): "Jesus said to him, Then the sons are free". We are not bound to the old covenant anymore, which does not convey a promise of eternal life to those remaining in it (Galatians 4:30).
BlackSabb made an observation that others have made in the past:
I pointed out that Mary complied with both of the sabbaths the historical account reveals in the week Jesus was crucified. You do not. The hypocrisy of your conversation is consistent with your contradiction with Scripture. Others are able to see the inconsistency in your own witness, and want no part of it. In summary, you don't know the law, it shows, and your posts are a joke.
To claim that I don't understand the Gospel doesn't add any credibility to your previous testimony that your salvation demands a return to the dead works Christianity affirms a repentance from. You have also posted your opinion that you wouldn't last long in a traditional Adventist church in the recent past. Now look at your own signature line, and see that you contradict both your contention that you aren't a Christian nor an Adventist with a line stating that you are a Christian and an Adventist. Nothing you have posted has aligned with your conversation.You neither understand the gospel or the work of salvation in our lives.
The old agreement consisted of sin and death of which has been made obsolete through the death of Jesus. The new agreement is God's grace but that does not mean the Law is obsolete. The terms of an agreement can be made obsolete while the contents of an agreement can stay the same.
I can rent you an appartment for a certain price under one agreement and then rent you that same apartment under a different agreement for the same price.
God takes the Law on stone under the old agreement and writes in our hearts under the new agreement, same Law under both agreements
Hebrews 8:10 "For this is the new covenant that I will make with the house of Israel: After those days,'' says the Lord, "I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.
The word, adoption is a legal term with legal guidlines and ramifications.
It only takes a cursory view of Hebrews 10:9 where it states "He takes away the first that He may establish the second", and then compare Scripture against what you posted to conclude your contention in complete error.Jesus' didn't come to die on a cross to take away the Ten Commandment, but rather, He died to to take the penalty for breaking them while under the old covenant and He came to establish with His words the terms of a new covneant.
You haven't found a "fourth commandment", which has been a request made to you by more than one member. The narrative Luke wrote shows he apparently had to explain "according to the commandment" to a Gentile recipient of his Gospel account regarding Mary's rest on the sabbath. Once Jesus resurrected and opened the understanding of His disciples, "according to the commandment" of feigned compliance to the first covenant is never found again in Scripture. Assembling on the sabbath days is not compliance to the first covenant law to keep the sabbath holy, which in the law mandates the burnt offerings under a priesthood that has no part in the new covenant.The fact that His followers rested on the Sabbath (According to the 4th commandment) tells us that Jesus made no changes because if He did they would have known about and since He didn't make a change, while He was living, no changes can be made after His death.
I pointed out that Mary complied with both of the sabbaths the historical account reveals in the week Jesus was crucified. You do not. The hypocrisy of your conversation is consistent with your contradiction with Scripture. Others are able to see the inconsistency in your own witness, and want no part of it. In summary, you don't know the law, it shows, and your posts are a joke.BlackSabb said:I don't believe you k4c, you manage to scrimp every little thing you can in a desperate attempt to put people back into the bondage of the law. Just give it up man. No one here is convinced. Seriously dude, the more you twist, distort and take scripture out of context, the more you show everyone how wrong you are. But keep posting. You are a great proponent for NOT keeping the OT Sabbath.
Paul describes the tenet of compliance to the first covenant accurately in Romans 2:13, as has been pointed out to you before. If your contention is that the only people that are justified before God are those compliant with the first covenant, you contradict the context this verse has been extracted from as well as Paul's conclusion in Romans 3:10 where he points out "As it is written: There is none righteous, no, not one". Paul reaffirms this conclusion in Romans 3:20 where he wrote "by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight".Romans 2:13 For the ones that God will justify are not those who have heard the Law but those who have kept the Law.
So very, very clear. I guess God is sending strong delusion.
But the law demands death k4c. In fact, you should kill everyone who doesn't worship on the Sabbath. Sabbath-breakers are to be killed. That is what is in the law.
I think we've got him on this one. Unless he can show us exactly where the laws he doesn't like were tossed out, he loses this whole argument big time. I'm sure he has some verses that he believes can do this, but they will be highly subjective and open to interpretation. Round and round we go!
Talk about double standards. Talk about having your cake and eating it too. Every argument you use to maintain the OT sabbath can be used to maintain the practice of stoning homosexuals.
You're backed into a corner friend. Give it up.
I noticed that k4c dismissed all the sabbaths with no intent to keep any of them. Others have noted k4c's hypocrisy regarding his selective noncompliance to the law.You guys make me laugh...
Until the Law sin was in the world. Amen.
If there's no Law there's no sin if there's no sin there's no need for grace.
Hypocrisy cannot help but contradict itself.The Law transcends Sinai.
I noticed that k4c dismissed all the sabbaths with no intent to keep any of them. Others have noted k4c's hypocrisy regarding his selective noncompliance to the law.
...and all k4c can do is laugh about his predicament.
It would seem k4c has fallen into a pit of his own making.
Yet you have concluded that the promise of entering into God's rest that has its origin with the seventh day of creation is to be ignored, and you want to claim that others are to abide by the sabbath instead (note I edited out a technical error in your post).When God calls something holy, it's holy.
The seventh day was declared holy as part of creation before all the sabbath days that came as a result of sin. You can deny that all day and explain away all the Scriptural proof but the truth still stands.
The holiness of the seventh day was never supported nor dependent on the law. The law ordained the sabbath instead.God protected the holiness of the seventh by His Law. You can explain that truth too but it still stands.
Yet you won't enter into God's rest that has its origin on the seventh day of creation. You want the sabbath to remain established instead.Jesus neither did away with the holiness of the seventh day nor did He change the day.
You reveal that you have confused the sabbath with God's rest, you confirm your opinion that you don't believe there is a new covenant, and your contention regarding disobedience doesn't align with your practice of disregarding all of the sabbaths, including the sabbath on a weekly cycle. As I mentioned in an earlier post:All you questions have been answered, maybe not the answer you wanted but none the less, they were answer.
Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath so that means the Sabbath is the Lord's day. If Jesus is your Lord than the seventh day is the day you should honor just as the fouth commandments says.
But hey, if you don't want to obey God that's your freewill right.
And that's your only reply? Why don't you detail for all of us how keeping the sabbath is any different to the commandment to stone homosexuals?
If, as SDA's teach, that a law will be passed that prevents people from going to Church on Satuday.......
...Will happen to Catholic Mass that's held each and every Saturday.
Will the Catholic Church be prevented from attending Mass on Saturday each and every week??????
...The Saturday Mass at the Church I go to has nearly as many people attending as on Sunday?
What happens with that?
If, as SDA's teach, that a law will be passed that prevents people from going to Church on Saturday.......
...Will happen to Catholic Mass that's held each and every Saturday.
Will the Catholic Church be prevented from attending Mass on Saturday each and every week??????
...The Saturday Mass at the Church I go to has nearly as many people attending as on Sunday?
What happens with that?
Is the Saturday service the same as the Sunday one? I don't know much about Catholics.
Kira said:I would guess that when the evil pope beast takes over the world and forces all to worship on Sunday he will do away with Saturday Mass.
Salvation is of the heart. This means the Sabbath is first understood in the heart to be God's holy day. We actively seek to make the day holy, going to church is only part of it. I'm sure some Catholics go to Church on Saturday out of convenience rather than it being the Sabbath but either way if they attend church on the seventh day because they want to honor the commandment God will honor them. If that's the case they will suffer persecution in the last days.
That would require that the Catholic Church attack itself via attacking it's own "sheep".....
....The Catholic Church holds Mass "daily".
...Mass is simply the worship of Christ as God.
That would require that the Catholic Church attack itself via attacking it's own "sheep".....
....The Catholic Church holds Mass "daily".
...Mass is simply the worship of Christ as God.
M
You might want to ask Martin Luther about the church turning on their own for not agreeing with the pope's doctrines.
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