what Law did Jesus replace?

digos · Nov 27, 2009

I think if you choose to live under the law you have to obey all the laws in order to make yourself, you can't lower the law standards so that you can fulfil them, it's a whole composite and you have to follow it strictly to be deserved by God and this automatically wouldn't look right once the grace is Jesus himself, and grace is undeserved favour from God. Paul himself, saw that Galatians were being fooled by the mixing of Grace and Law. He called them " FOOLISH galatians". If you want to be " derserved" by God through your own effort you must to follow the law. We can't keep the law. Jesus is the answer, the cross doesn't simply mean you are redeemed of all your past sins, the cross means that YOU were, are and will reemed through the sacrifice of Jesus. Once you deny the grace you deny Jesus himself.

roshan turner · Nov 27, 2009

stelow said:
Romans 3:27, Where, then, is boasting? It is excluded. On what principle? On that of observing the law? No, but on that of faith.

Keep reading bro listen to what paul is saying roman 3:v27-31

roshan turner · Nov 27, 2009

digos said:
I think if you choose to live under the law you have to obey all the laws in order to make yourself, you can't lower the law standards so that you can fulfil them, it's a whole composite and you have to follow it strictly to be deserved by God and this automatically wouldn't look right once the grace is Jesus himself, and grace is undeserved favour from God. Paul himself, saw that Galatians were being fooled by the mixing of Grace and Law. He called them " FOOLISH galatians". If you want to be " derserved" by God through your own effort you must to follow the law. We can't keep the law. Jesus is the answer, the cross doesn't simply mean you are redeemed of all your past sins, the cross means that YOU were, are and will reemed through the sacrifice of Jesus. Once you deny the grace you deny Jesus himself.

You need to read this philippians 2:v5-9 jesus kept the law . now if we cant keep the law then why does jesus speak of sin here john 20 v23 this is after his death ? 1 john 3 :v4-8

digos · Nov 27, 2009

roshan turner said:
You need to read this philippians 2:v5-9 jesus kept the law . now if we cant keep the law then why does jesus speak of sin here john 20 v23 this is after his death ? 1 john 3 :v4-8

Paul said that the strength of the law is the SIN .Whoever follows the law, try with their own effort to deserve God's favour - neutralising Jesus sacrifice. As paul said we have to "rightly divide the word". Jesus came to fulfil the law to make us free and save us by His undeserved,unmerited favour. Jesus was Jesus.He was a man who knew NO SIN, he HAD to fulfil law in order to present Himself to God as a spotless sacrifice. The law , as describe by Paul, is the ministry of Death. Grace is not about what we do , whether we sin or not. It's about what JESUS has done for us. Sin does exist but it has no power over you once you are on the grace of God. Those who are loved much , are forgiven much.Law tells you: "do this, do this, do this" and grace tells you: " I give you this". ONCE you receive the Grace of God and start believing you are a righteous by the grace , you have the power to go and sin no more - do you remember that Jesus did not accuse the prostitute for her sinful behaviour ( she was caught on the act), Jesus didn't condemn her (even though the law would) he simply told her to go and " sin no more". Now, do you think that she would go and start sinning once she was not condemned? No, she saw the grace of Christ. Once you start living by Grace , your failures and your sins are not the focus , but Christ is. Stop underestimating the Love of Christ.

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

SoundCard said:
The only thing that says is, they were convincing people Jesus Christ was the Messiah based upon the prophecies concerning His coming in the OT.

By what you say here.

THAT is what I'm talking about, and I do take offense to that.

SC

you take offense because you don't agree. your words prove that you don't agree!

it will be someone here who take offense to any topic anyone post,

if you don't agree you don't agree. your words is what condemns, your words is what justify.

Mt 12:37 For by thy words thou shalt be justified, and by thy words thou shalt be condemned.

the problem is understanding!!

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

AnotherNobody said:
Why are we arguing whether or not Jesus came to replace any form of law when Jesus, HIMSELF, says He did not. Rather that He came to fulfill....does it really matter who is right? Thought this was to be discussed not debated to the point where it became a my horse is bigger than your horse run...

because it is false doctrine out here that teachs God commandments where done away with or the death of Jesus replaced the commnadments.
the people need to know that Jesus replaced the law of animal sacrifice.

we have people here who don't want others here to understand this.

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

stelow said:
AnotherNobody, welcome to CF.

ozell has this very same thread going on another Christian forum's sight besides this one. Here's the link, I think by knowing this, it gives some insight into the motivation behind it.

what Law did Jesus replace?

actually stelow I have this same topic on 3 to 4 forums. I'll tell you my motivation behind it, there is no eed to go to other forums for this.

I will tell the truth to correct the lie that denominations teach.

do you think its wrong to be on two or more forums?

what law did Jesus replace stelow can you answer the question instead of leading people away from this forum?

what Law did Jesus replace Stelow?

answer it here before you run off to another forum.

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

357magnum said:
What we have is a couple of folks trying to push the Law of Moses and self-righteously attempt to condemn Brothers and Sisters in Christ - much like the Pharisees attempted to do with Jesus Christ Himself.

We are not under the Law, rather Grace. This is a very important issue because we're talking about Salvation. No man was ever Saved by the Law or obedience of the Law. Some are pushing a false Gospel that men are saved by good works and obedience of the law. This is simply not true now, nor was it ever true. Salvation was always by God's Grace and Faith in Him.

These same folks are treating Christians like the Pharisees treated Jesus Christ - with legalistic, self-righteous condemnation. This would be in several threads. The Pharisees didn't know Jesus Christ, and neither did they have any comprehension about what Jesus Christ would do at the Cross. Those who go about trying to establish their own righteousness will never do it, and they FAIL to yield to the righteousness of Jesus Christ.

YES, Jesus Christ and the Cross are much bigger, greater, and more precious than the law of Moses. There is no comparison. What Jesus Christ did at the Cross and what it meant was a mystery to the 12 Apostles and followers of Jesus Christ during His Earthly Ministry. This mystery wasn't revealed until Jesus Christ Himself revealed it to the Apostle Paul. Paul then taught the 12 Apostles and many others the Mystery of Jesus Christ, the Cross, and the Church not made with human hands - the Church which is the Body of Christ.

Ephesians 2:8-9 (KJV) 8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: [it is] the gift of God: 9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

Romans 8:1-2 (KJV) 1 [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit. 2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

Galatians 2:16 (KJV) 16 Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.

Galatians 2:19-21 (KJV) 19 For I through the law am dead to the law, that I might live unto God. 20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. 21 I do not frustrate the grace of God: for if righteousness [come] by the law, then Christ is dead in vain.

Galatians 4:4-7 (KJV) 4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law, 5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons. 6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father. 7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.

Galatians 4:21-31 (KJV) 21 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? 22 For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, the other by a freewoman. 23 But he [who was] of the bondwoman was born after the flesh; but he of the freewoman [was] by promise. 24 Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar. 25 For this Agar is mount Sinai in Arabia, and answereth to Jerusalem which now is, and is in bondage with her children. 26 But Jerusalem which is above is free, which is the mother of us all. 27 For it is written, Rejoice, [thou] barren that bearest not; break forth and cry, thou that travailest not: for the desolate hath many more children than she which hath an husband. 28 Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. 29 But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him [that was born] after the Spirit, even so [it is] now. 30 Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. 31 So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free.

I'm free and belong to Jesus Christ. I give thanks for that every day. I walk in the Spirit, and I'm not under the law.

Romans 10:4-13 For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness to every one that believeth. 5 For Moses writeth that the man that doeth the righteousness which is of the law shall live thereby. 6 But the righteousness which is of faith saith thus, Say not in thy heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down 7 or, Who shall descend into the abyss? (That is, to bring Christ up from the dead.) 8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach: 9 because if thou shalt confess with thy mouth Jesus as Lord, and shalt believe in thy heart that God raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved: 10 for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation. 11 For the scripture saith, Whosoever believeth on him shall not be put to shame. 12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek: for the same Lord is Lord of all, and is rich unto all that call upon him: 13 for, Whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Titus 3:4-11 (KJV) 4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life. 8 [This is] a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men. 9 But avoid foolish questions, and genealogies, and contentions, and strivings about the law; for they are unprofitable and vain. 10 A man that is an heretick after the first and second admonition reject; 11 Knowing that he that is such is subverted, and sinneth, being condemned of himself.

Good News! -- The Holy Bible is the WORD OF GOD! -- God The Father, God The Son, God The Holy Spirit - The Creator Of All Things! -- "GOD'S GRACE" and "OUR WORKS" -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1623 to 1863 ) -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1961 to 2001 ) -- JESUS CHRIST - VERY GOD - LORD - SAVIOUR - MESSIAH - KING

all this and you said nothing

what law did Jesus replace?

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

digos said:
Paul said that the strength of the law is the SIN .Whoever follows the law, try with their own effort to deserve God's favour - neutralising Jesus sacrifice. As paul said we have to "rightly divide the word". Jesus came to fulfil the law to make us free and save us by His undeserved,unmerited favour. Jesus was Jesus.He was a man who knew NO SIN, he HAD to fulfil law in order to present Himself to God as a spotless sacrifice. The law , as describe by Paul, is the ministry of Death. Grace is not about what we do , whether we sin or not. It's about what JESUS has done for us. Sin does exist but it has no power over you once you are on the grace of God. Those who are loved much , are forgiven much.Law tells you: "do this, do this, do this" and grace tells you: " I give you this". ONCE you receive the Grace of God and start believing you are a righteous by the grace , you have the power to go and sin no more - do you remember that Jesus did not accuse the prostitute for her sinful behaviour ( she was caught on the act), Jesus didn't condemn her (even though the law would) he simply told her to go and " sin no more". Now, do you think that she would go and start sinning once she was not condemned? No, she saw the grace of Christ. Once you start living by Grace , your failures and your sins are not the focus , but Christ is. Stop underestimating the Love of Christ.

everyone is under grace even the sinner.

everyone don't keep the law including the sinner

Jesus found grace in Noah yet grace was upon all the people before the flood.

yet only grace was found in Noah.

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

roshan turner said:
Keep reading bro listen to what paul is saying roman 3:v27-31

Roshan

31: Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

Stelow pastor or denomination would not let him read the next few verse

How did Paul establish the law stelow?

what law was established Stelow?

why not answer the topic question?

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

digos said:
I think if you choose to live under the law you have to obey all the laws in order to make yourself, you can't lower the law standards so that you can fulfil them, it's a whole composite and you have to follow it strictly to be deserved by God and this automatically wouldn't look right once the grace is Jesus himself, and grace is undeserved favour from God. Paul himself, saw that Galatians were being fooled by the mixing of Grace and Law. He called them " FOOLISH galatians". If you want to be " derserved" by God through your own effort you must to follow the law. We can't keep the law. Jesus is the answer, the cross doesn't simply mean you are redeemed of all your past sins, the cross means that YOU were, are and will reemed through the sacrifice of Jesus. Once you deny the grace you deny Jesus himself.

how is keeping the commandments denying Jesus or grace?

why would Jesus tell those who love him to keep his commandments?

Jn 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments

digos · Nov 28, 2009

Okay , how can you love one another as Christ loved us without knowing the love of Christ? The only way you see the love of God is through Jesus Christ. Christ was given as a sacrifice to redeem us from all our sin. This is undeserved favour, This is grace. Now If you understand the Love of Christ you will start loving Him. We love Him because he loved us first.This is grace , you don't earn that, it's effortless, Christ has already loved you - This is grace.Once you feel loved , this love you will be reflected through your life in everyone's lives..

"12
This is my commandment, that you love one another as I
have loved you."

stelow · Nov 28, 2009

ozell said:
Roshan

31: Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

Stelow pastor or denomination would not let him read the next few verse

How did Paul establish the law stelow?

what law was established Stelow?

why not answer the topic question?

Yea your right ozell, I'm just a piece of crap that doesn't even deserved to be saved in the first place. I have no pastor or denomination, I don't even go to church, matter of fact I just came out of a 40 year drug scene June of this year. Answer your own darn question, you don't care about me, all you care about is being right. Is that how you keep the commandments of God by making others to feel like their not saved because they can't keep the commandments of God. I hope you feel like a big man of God, if that's what keeping the laws of God is about you can have it, I want nothing to do with your doctrine.

digos · Nov 28, 2009

stelow said:
Yea your right ozell, I'm just a piece of crap that doesn't even deserved to be saved in the first place. I have no pastor or denomination, I don't even go to church, matter of fact I just came out of a 40 year drug scene June of this year. Answer your own darn question, you don't care about me, all you care about is being right. Is that how you keep the commandments of God by making others to feel like their not saved because they can't keep the commandments of God. I hope you feel like a big man of God, if that's what keeping the laws of God is about you can have it, I want nothing to do with your doctrine.

Mate It's not about you , it's about Christ. If Christ it is not being exalted in the whole thing , who's being exalted ? We can't do anything by our own effort, we don't deserve the love of Christ, grace is not a doctrine or a teaching , Grace is the person himself and this person is Christ.Anyone that is not under the grace is under the law. The law as paul said it's the ministry of death! It only shows u that you are a big failure, but under the grace your a justified and righteous through your faith in Jesus Christ.

stelow · Nov 28, 2009

digos said:
Mate It's not about you , it's about Christ. If Christ it is not being exalted in the whole thing , who's being exalted ? We can't do anything by our own effort, we don't deserve the love of Christ, grace is not a doctrine or a teaching , Grace is the person himself and this person is Christ.Anyone that is not under the grace is under the law. The law as paul said it's the ministry of death! It only shows u that you are a big failure, but under the grace your a justified and righteous through your faith in Jesus Christ.

Do what, how did I say otherwise, do you also feel like a big man now. I was talking about the doctrine ozell is promoting about keeping the commandments to be saved.

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

stelow said:
Yea your right ozell, I'm just a piece of crap that doesn't even deserved to be saved in the first place. I have no pastor or denomination, I don't even go to church, matter of fact I just came out of a 40 year drug scene June of this year. Answer your own darn question, you don't care about me, all you care about is being right. Is that how you keep the commandments of God by making others to feel like their not saved because they can't keep the commandments of God. I hope you feel like a big man of God, if that's what keeping the laws of God is about you can have it, I want nothing to do with your doctrine.

stelow

what did I post that requires such a rude response.

I have no doctrine stelow.

I have not made you feel like anything quit putting your problems and accusation on me.

lets discuss the word and keep the emotions out of it.

answer the question is all that I have asked?

yet you and others want to put you personal life into the discussion.

Stelow

what law did Jesus replace? is all I ask

now if you want to discuss personal matter start another thread and I will participate.

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

digos said:
Mate It's not about you , it's about Christ. If Christ it is not being exalted in the whole thing , who's being exalted ? We can't do anything by our own effort, we don't deserve the love of Christ, grace is not a doctrine or a teaching , Grace is the person himself and this person is Christ.Anyone that is not under the grace is under the law. The law as paul said it's the ministry of death! It only shows u that you are a big failure, but under the grace your a justified and righteous through your faith in Jesus Christ.

your right digos, its not about Stelow or me or you, its all about Jesus.

now what law did Jesus replace?

what law is we not under?

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

stelow said:
Do what, how did I say otherwise, do you also feel like a big man now. I was talking about the doctrine ozell is promoting about keeping the commandments to be saved.

Stelow where in the post did I say we have to keep the commandments to be saved.

what law did Jesus replace?

you should keep the law to get eternal life is this not written?

ozell · Nov 28, 2009

digos said:
Okay , how can you love one another as Christ loved us without knowing the love of Christ? The only way you see the love of God is through Jesus Christ. Christ was given as a sacrifice to redeem us from all our sin. This is undeserved favour, This is grace. Now If you understand the Love of Christ you will start loving Him. We love Him because he loved us first.This is grace , you don't earn that, it's effortless, Christ has already loved you - This is grace.Once you feel loved , this love you will be reflected through your life in everyone's lives..

"12
This is my commandment, that you love one another as I
have loved you."

how do we love God and our neighbours Digos?

How do we do this?

nChrist · Nov 28, 2009

digos said:
Mate It's not about you , it's about Christ. If Christ it is not being exalted in the whole thing , who's being exalted ? We can't do anything by our own effort, we don't deserve the love of Christ, grace is not a doctrine or a teaching , Grace is the person himself and this person is Christ.Anyone that is not under the grace is under the law. The law as paul said it's the ministry of death! It only shows u that you are a big failure, but under the grace your a justified and righteous through your faith in Jesus Christ.

We're all talking about the false gospel with a little "g" that ozell is pushing.

You don't buy ozell's gospel.

Stelow doesn't buy ozell's gospel.

I don't buy ozell's gospel.

Below is the Gospel that we believe in:

Romans 3:10-31 10 as it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one; 11 There is none that understandeth, There is none that seeketh after God; 12 They have all turned aside, they are together become unprofitable; There is none that doeth good, no, not, so much as one: 13 Their throat is an open sepulchre; With their tongues they have used deceit: The poison of asps is under their lips: 14 Whose mouth is full of cursing and bitterness: 15 Their feet are swift to shed blood; 16 Destruction and misery are in their ways; 17 And the way of peace have they not known: 18 There is no fear of God before their eyes. 19 Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it speaketh to them that are under the law; that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may be brought under the judgment of God: 20 because by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified in his sight; for through the law cometh the knowledge of sin. 21 But now apart from the law a righteousness of God hath been manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets; 22 even the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ unto all them that believe; for there is no distinction; 23 for all have sinned, and fall short of the glory of God; 24 being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus: 25 whom God set forth to be a propitiation, through faith, in his blood, to show his righteousness because of the passing over of the sins done aforetime, in the forbearance of God; 26 for the showing, I say, of his righteousness at this present season: that he might himself be just, and the justifier of him that hath faith in Jesus. 27 Where then is the glorying? It is excluded. By what manner of law? of works? Nay: but by a law of faith. 28 We reckon therefore that a man is justified by faith apart from the works of the law. 29 Or is God the God of Jews only? is he not the God of Gentiles also? Yea, of Gentiles also: 30 if so be that God is one, and he shall justify the circumcision by faith, and the uncircumcision through faith. 31 Do we then make the law of none effect through faith? God forbid: nay, we establish the law.

Ephesians 2:1-10 1 And you did he make alive, when ye were dead through your trespasses and sins, 2 wherein ye once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the powers of the air, of the spirit that now worketh in the sons of disobedience; 3 among whom we also all once lived in the lust of our flesh, doing the desires of the flesh and of the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, even as the rest: - 4 but God, being rich in mercy, for his great love wherewith he loved us, 5 even when we were dead through our trespasses, made us alive together with Christ (by grace have ye been saved), 6 and raised us up with him, and made us to sit with him in the heavenly places, in Christ Jesus: 7 that in the ages to come he might show the exceeding riches of his grace in kindness toward us in Christ Jesus: 8 for by grace have ye been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; 9 not of works, that no man should glory. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God afore prepared that we should walk in them.

Ephesians 3:8-21 8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, was this grace given, to preach unto the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ; 9 and to make all men see what is the dispensation of the mystery which for ages hath been hid in God who created all things; 10 to the intent that now unto the principalities and the powers in the heavenly places might be made known through the church the manifold wisdom of God, 11 according to the eternal purpose which he purposed in Christ Jesus our Lord: 12 in whom we have boldness and access in confidence through our faith in him. 13 Wherefore I ask that ye may not faint at my tribulations for you, which are your glory. 14 For this cause I bow my knees unto the Father, 15 from whom every family in heaven and on earth is named, 16 that he would grant you, according to the riches of his glory, that ye may be strengthened with power through his Spirit in the inward man; 17 that Christ may dwell in your hearts through faith; to the end that ye, being rooted and grounded in love, 18 may be strong to apprehend with all the saints what is the breadth and length and height and depth, 19 and to know the love of Christ which passeth knowledge, that ye may be filled unto all the fulness of God. 20 Now unto him that is able to do exceeding abundantly above all that we ask or think, according to the power that worketh in us, 21 unto him be the glory in the church and in Christ Jesus unto all generations for ever and ever. Amen.

Good News! -- The Holy Bible is the WORD OF GOD! -- God The Father, God The Son, God The Holy Spirit - The Creator Of All Things! -- "GOD'S GRACE" and "OUR WORKS" -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1623 to 1863 ) -- Thanksgiving Proclamations ( 1961 to 2001 ) -- JESUS CHRIST - VERY GOD - LORD - SAVIOUR - MESSIAH - KING

what Law did Jesus replace?

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