What is wrong with modern culture ?

[Tomm]

What is wrong with modern culture ? Is it a reflection of modern philosophy including atheism ?

On the other hand, why is traditional culture so pleasant and admirable ?

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"In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph." - Mother Mary at Fatima, 1917

 

[Archer93]

The first image won't load- what is it, please?
Also, where is the 'wrong' in the other two? Then I might be able to identify the source of the 'wrongness'.

Probably not, though, as you seem to be treating the value-judgement terms 'pleasant' and 'admirable' as absolutes.

There never was a golden age of universal happiness and 'decency'- however you want to define that latter term.
Some of the Great Masters of today shocked and outraged their audiences when they were first viewed. Clothing which is now considered old-fashioned and frumpy was the height of daring once upon a time.
Beyond every boundry there's another boundry. It's just hard to keep track of what each boundry consisted of- given that it hasn't always been a straight line.

There's always been stuff that some people do like and approve of and others don't. I personally think that humanity is at its best when personal preference in art, fashion, whatever isn't a criteria for how people are treated.

 

[TheManeki]

People have been complaining about the decline of their current cultures for millennia, looking nostalgically back at older days (and ignoring the flaws of those older times in the process).

"A tablet from ancient Assyria, about 2800 B.C., has been found that states: 'Our earth is degenerate in these latter days. There are signs that the world is speedily coming to an end. Bribery and corruption are common.' More than 2,000 years later, Socrates complained, 'Children are now tyrants...They no longer rise when elders enter the room. They contradict their parents, chatter before company, gobble up dainties at the table, cross their legs, and tyrannize over their teachers.' And Plato wrote of his students: 'What is happening to our young people? They disrespect their elders, they disobey their parents, they ignore the law. They riot in the streets inflamed with wild notions. Their morals are decaying. What is to become of them?'"

-- Isaac Asimov's Book of Facts, ed. Isaac Asimov. New York: Wings Books, 1979.

 

[selfinflikted]

This is retarded. What your argument amounts to is like you coming into my home and saying, "What is wrong with people today!? Your furniture is horrible! My furniture is gorgeous compared to this! Mine's christian inspired too."

>.>

People have different tastes, and thank goodness! I'd hate to have a world full of "me's" running around - how boring! Get a life, get over yourself, and realise that everyone is not the same.

Different =/= wrong.

EDIT: I happen to like abstract art such as in the second photo (the first doesn't load). My home is full of that style. Second, I had a weird hairdo when I was in a rockband as well. Big deal. Beats the hell outta a buncha old, white republican men with salt and pepper hair parted on the side wearing outdated tweed suits. Ick.

 

[TheManeki]

That picture of Chartes reminds me of reading about the time when Gothic architecture was new and considered immoral by adherents of the older Romanesque architecture.

 

[Mling]

Oh yeah, I find "traditional" culture to be very pleasant. Especially things like this: http://www.ngbiwm.com/Exhibits/Lync...edia_files/300px-Lynching-of-lige-daniels.jpg

That's a postcard by the way, in case you're not familiar with that altogether pleasant custom of the Bible Belt culture during this time period. Such scenes were popular enough to be put on post cards.


And then there's this cathedral in the Czech Republic. Personally, I think it's sort of interesting, but I don't know if I would call it "pleasant"

 

[cantata]

I happen to like Jackson Pollock. (I'm assuming it's a Pollock. If not, it's a rip-off of his work, anyway.) People are usually uncomfortable with contemporary art because they don't understand it. What they usually don't realise is that it's often supposed to make you uncomfortable. You might be surprised to know, tomc, that Pollock's work may even reflect some of your concerns about secular consumerist culture.

 

[selfinflikted]

I happen to like Jackson Pollock. (I'm assuming it's a Pollock. If not, it's a rip-off of his work, anyway.) People are usually uncomfortable with contemporary art because they don't understand it. What they usually don't realise is that it's often supposed to make you uncomfortable. You might be surprised to know, tomc, that Pollock's work may even reflect some of your concerns about secular consumerist culture.

I like the art because it's extremely subjective. IF you saw a Bob Ross (lol, used to love that guy!) painting of a shed and some trees with a mountain range in the background, you'd know it was just that. Other people would see that as well. With contemporary abstract, that just isn't the case. What one work might "mean" to me, would mean something completely different to someone else. That's why I like it.

 

[cantata]

I like the art because it's extremely subjective. IF you saw a Bob Ross (lol, used to love that guy!) painting of a shed and some trees with a mountain range in the background, you'd know it was just that. Other people would see that as well. With contemporary abstract, that just isn't the case. What one work might "mean" to me, would mean something completely different to someone else. That's why I like it.

Yes. It's rather like a Rorschach test.

That said, knowing something about an artist, their background, their intentions, and the history of art that led up to their work, usually helps me to enjoy it. I can still appreciate it on my own terms, of course, but often it's remarkable how well abstract and other contemporary art does capture the mood that the artist intended, once you understand a bit about what they are trying to say. Sceptics will of course say that you can see whatever you like in them, but I like to give people the benefit of the doubt.

 

[platzapS]

I'm not a huge fan of modern art, but it's all about taste and meaning. Also, that outfit in the last picture looks horribly uncomfortable. But women back then were to be seen and not heard. I don't think it's a flaw in our modern culture that we treat women as more than pretty objects to look at.

 

[cantata]

I don't think it's a flaw in our modern culture that we treat women as more than pretty objects to look at.

 

[Belk]

What is wrong with modern culture ? Is it a reflection of modern philosophy including atheism ?

It's because too many fools think that a return to barbarism is preferable to letting others live how they choose. It seems they feel threatened by the lack of conformity and so they castigate those who are different in an attempt to force them back into behaviors they feel comfortable with.

On the other hand, traditional culture is so pleasant and admirable.
Is it so because it is Christian ?

No, it's because it is in the past, allowing you to cherry pick the parts that where admirable while ignoring the parts that where bad. It's known as "selective recall" and is a well documented human tendency.

 

[Rebekka]

People who like beautiful gothic cathedrals can be the same as the ones who like abstract modern art.

 

[brinny]

actually this subject i find intriguing...here's my bit o' contribution to the discussion:

we are on our way to oblivion and partying along the way...hehe i said 'we' but i meant that figuratively as in the human race, the world....

anyhoo, i belive that hell awaits 'us'. 'Modern' culture is a big ol' party of sorts, with an overwhelming absence of the ability to contemplate, and a huge inclination to embrace and celebrate whatever will bring it to its demise....the water is fun, ain't it? Yet the carnival boat that our culture is steeped in is heading for a waterfall. It sorta reminds me of the scene in 'Independence Day' when all these people gathered at the top of a skyscraper to meet their friends, the aliens. it also reminds me of Noah and the ark. The masses, the 'culture' partied on as the rain fell....until....

 

[selfinflikted]

actually this subject i find intriguing...here's my bit o' contribution to the discussion:

we are on our way to oblivion and partying along the way...hehe i said 'we' but i meant that figuratively as in the human race, the world....

anyhoo, i belive that hell awaits 'us'. 'Modern' culture is a big ol' party of sorts, with an overwhelming absence of the ability to contemplate, and a huge inclination to embrace and celebrate whatever will bring it to its demise....the water is fun, ain't it? Yet the carnival boat that our culture is steeped in is heading for a waterfall. It sorta reminds me of the scene in 'Independence Day' when all these people gathered at the top of a skyscraper to meet their friends, the aliens. it also reminds me of Noah and the ark. The masses, the 'culture' partied on as the rain fell....until....

So you see spikey hair and abstract art as "part[ying] on as the rain [falls]"? That's... a stretch.

 

[TheManeki]

Wouldn't all the rain and humidity mess up the hairdos?

 

[jayem]

Gothic cathedrals are great, but so is modern religious architecture.


I love the Beth Shalom Synagogue in Philadelphia, designed by Frank Lloyd Wright. Stunning.

 

[brinny]

har har...i wasn't speaking of the art...but speaking of culture....and the 'norms' thereof and how we are our own best enemies. Yeah, I betcha those peeps were worried about their hairdooz as they swallowed water and their lungs got waterlogged.

 

[brinny]

Wouldn't all the rain and humidity mess up the hairdos?

hehe deep, mon...kinda like the waters that swallowed all the party-ers

 

[selfinflikted]

Gothic cathedrals are great, but so is modern religious architecture.


I love the Beth Shalom Synagogue in Philadelphia, designed by Frank Lloyd Wright. Stunning.

Wow. That is stunning. IT's just a shame that all those tithes (sp?) are going for something so.. extravagant. Don't get me wrong, the architecture is breath-taking.. but does god really need that?....