What is the line between fact and fiction in America?

[Jimmy D]

I was trying to give people third grade level material and they could not grasp that. In fact I am at the point where I am simply giving teaching we would give to a one year old. We can not make this any more simple or easy for them to understand. I do not know how God can hold them accountable if they are not able to function at that level.

1. What are you talking about specifically? What third grade material are you giving people, what are you teaching? Maybe I don't have the understanding of a one year old but I genuinely don't know what you're talking about.

2. I know most (if not all) of us "skeptics, scoffers, mockers and infidels" who post on this forum are university educated, at least I am. If you can't get 'third grade' ideas across to us do you consider it might be your fault and not ours?

3. Please spare us your arrogant attitude, you constantly brag about your extensive knowledge in theology and the sciences yet you are consistently shown to be wrong on most threads. I can provide examples if you would like.

 

[Jimmy D]

"Journalists should report the truth. Who would deny it? But such a statement does not get us far enough, for it fails to distinguish nonfiction from other forms of expression. Novelists can reveal great truths about the human condition, and so can poets, film makers and painters. Artists, after all, build things that imitate the world. So do nonfiction writers."

https://www.creativenonfiction.org/online-reading/line-between-fact-and-fiction

Did you read the second paragraph of your article?

To make things more complicated, writers of fiction use fact to make their work believable. They do research to create authentic settings into which we enter. They return us to historical periods and places that can be accurately chronicled and described: the battlefield at Gettysburg, the Museum of Natural History in New York City, a jazz club in Detroit. They use detail to make us see, to suspend our disbelief, to persuade us it was "really like that."

Hmmmm, that reminds me of certain lines of debate we've had.

 

[essentialsaltes]

Novelists can reveal great truths about the human condition

And so can the Bible. Without it being literally true. Because it isn't. Noah is as imaginary as David Copperfield.

 

[joshua 1 9]

And so can the Bible. Without it being literally true. Because it isn't.

I believe the Bible is literal truth. That does not change the fact that the Bible is still an allegory.

"Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar." Gal 4:24

"This is why I speak to them in parables:‘Though seeing, they do not see; though hearing, they do not hear or understand.’" Matthew 13 13

 

[Jimmy D]

And so can the Bible. Without it being literally true. Because it isn't. Noah is as imaginary as David Copperfield.

The illusionist or the Dickens character?

 

[bhsmte]

I guess you do not understand, first we have to establish what the rules are. You have to show me you know the difference between truth and fiction. So far you have failed to do that.

It is your thread, so tell us how you tell the difference between truth and fiction.

 

[joshua 1 9]

It is your thread, so tell us how you tell the difference between truth and fiction.

The reason I started this thread is so that you can tell me the difference. In many threads people claim the Bible is not true. So they need to tell me what their concept of truth is. For me the Bible is true. The Old Testament (covenant) begins with Beginning & God. Meaning that God was there in the beginning. This is the truth. The New Testament (new covenant) begins with the Book of Generations. People reject the truth that the Bible is a book of Generations beginning with Adam and Ending at the Cross at Calvary when Jesus said: "It is finished". This is the truth. If you reject this then you reject the truth. We have to build on a firm foundation and Jesus is the Cornerstone. If not then the storms will come and destroy our home. Because we did not build on a sure foundation of the truth.

 

[bhsmte]

The reason I started this thread is so that you can tell me the difference. In many threads people claim the Bible is not true. So they need to tell me what their concept of truth is. For me the Bible is true. The Old Testament (covenant) begins with Beginning & God. Meaning that God was there in the beginning. This is the truth. The New Testament (new covenant) begins with the Book of Generations. People reject the truth that the Bible is a book of Generations beginning with Adam and Ending at the Cross at Calvary when Jesus said: "It is finished". This is the truth. If you reject this then you reject the truth. We have to build on a firm foundation and Jesus is the Cornerstone. If not then the storms will come and destroy our home. Because we did not build on a sure foundation of the truth.

I rely on verifiable evidence to tell the difference.

How about you?

 

[bhsmte]

As Christians we are to bear fruit. The tree is not to be barren. Peach is a nice play on words for preach.

What kind of fruit do you bear?

 

[dickyh995]

"Journalists should report the truth. Who would deny it? But such a statement does not get us far enough, for it fails to distinguish nonfiction from other forms of expression. Novelists can reveal great truths about the human condition, and so can poets, film makers and painters. Artists, after all, build things that imitate the world. So do nonfiction writers."

https://www.creativenonfiction.org/online-reading/line-between-fact-and-fiction

Easy right? Evidence. The more evidence to back a claim, the more true it is.

 

[bhsmte]

This is well establish that college can convert people into scoffers and skeptics. You do not learn common sense in College. They can tend to develop an anti God anti religion attitude. So that they seem to lose the ability to even be able to function at the level of a one year old when it comes to learning the Bible.

LOL

 

[Nicky Blass]

This is well establish that college can convert people into scoffers and skeptics. You do not learn common sense in College. They can tend to develop an anti God anti religion attitude. So that they seem to lose the ability to even be able to function at the level of a one year old when it comes to learning the Bible.

What do you do when you find out that something you believe in is not true? how do you react? do you change your mind or just carry on believing?

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

What kind of fruit do you bear?

Something that's unlikely to bring people to Christ. So probably sour and foul smelling.

 

[joshua 1 9]

What do you do when you find out that something you believe in is not true? how do you react? do you change your mind or just carry on believing?

You go where the evidence takes you. I did believe the earth was only 6,000 years old. When I studied more science I saw that there is overwhelming evidence to show that the earth has been around a lot longer then that. I did some rather elementary math on the spindown rate of the earth and the receding rate of the moon. I did my own math and did not trust others to do the math for me. Also I tend to trust NASA because people die when they do not get it right. When people die that can make it hard for them to get their funding and difficult to keep their job. So a hierarchy tends to be established as to who is trustworthy and who is not. In this case it was a Christian Geologist that challenged me to do the research to see how old the Earth and Universe are.

Also I bring ideas here and give people every chance and ever opportunity to show any errors. Only lately no one seems to be coming up with much of anything, so that is pretty much a waste of time.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Something that's unlikely to bring people to Christ. So probably sour and foul smelling.

 

[joshua 1 9]

Easy right? Evidence. The more evidence to back a claim, the more true it is.

What do we do when people seek to destroy the evidence?

 

[joshua 1 9]

What kind of fruit do you bear?

"The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control. Against such things there is no Law". Gal5:22

 

[Warden_of_the_Storm]

And that has absolutely nothing to do with the fact that your continued inability to accept that you are wrong on many things, your inability to directly answer any questions given to you and your generally condescending and arrogant attitude will do absolutely nothing to bring people to Jesus.
In fact, your reply to my comment only proves my point.

 

[Nicky Blass]

When you look at that list it's completely without evidence, go through them one by one and they all fall apart.
I will just pick on 9, 10 & 11.
The Bible's transforming power for good? good like slavery? good like stone unruly children? to mention but a few.
Testimony of Jesus? where did Jesus write his testimony?
Modern day miracles? what is a miracle and who decides it's a miracle?

 

[Nicky Blass]

your generally condescending and arrogant attitude will do absolutely nothing to bring people to Jesus.

I suspect that is the least of his worries because he firmly believes that he is OK so the rest can either stay or take the bus.