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What is the immediate alternative to suicide when all else has failed??

Catherineanne

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Having only had a moment to glance at your other posts here, I must say I'm impressed by your thoughts and ideas. I was in a hurry to reply to the quote just above.

This is what I've been clinging to, to survive my frustration and disappointment and loathing of the world. At the end of the day, this is all I have left, a challenge to myself to set my standards above that of what I see and despair about. Stripped of religion and belief, this idea you have conveyed so eloquently resonates as a core reason to keep going. Inside my mind I say it in a more ugly way, but it's nice to see it worded in this way, a more pure form of it.

Thank you.

You are welcome.

Without my faith the world is indeed totally without meaning, without sense and without purpose. Not because it actually is, but because I have complex ptsd, and losing faith in people and in life itself is part of that. Even with my faith, those things remain. I have had to create meaning for myself when there isn't one. It ends up being a very small meaning, but that is better than none.

Every day we wake up and get up and do what we have to do is a victory. It may not be much of a victory, but nonetheless it is a step towards life.

St Francis of Assisi said; First do what is necessary. Then do what is possible. Then you will have done the impossible.

That is really all the theology anyone needs, imo.

That is what we do every day; we do the impossible. Sometimes for me the impossible is simply getting up, staying home all day and not speaking to anyone. In global terms this is a complete nothing. In relation to how I am, it is a great achievement. Doesn't look like one, doesn't even feel like one, but it is. I am still here; 14 years of cptsd and SI, inter alia, and I am still here.

If there is a God, then he is on my side because I choose life and I choose love. If there isn't, I lose nothing. Either way, there may be evil all around, but it isn't going to get me without a fight.

It is a matter of perspective.
 
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FutureAndAHope

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Hi Soothfish,

I am at a loss to know what advice to give you. All I can do is say I once went through very intense periods of depression after a relationship break down. To the point that I wanted to comit suicide. I actuallyy gave it a go once, tried to drown myself in the bath of all things. However at the time God put a positive thought in my mind from things I had been told at church, and it prevented me from continueing with the act. After some time I actuallyy started to go out to church again and found that my faith in God's love increased. To the point that I was able to directly ask God for things expecting and answer. On one occassion I prayed to God saying there must be some one in the world who I could marry, I was on a dating site at the time, tell me who I asked. I got a certain name in my head, typed it into the search box, and a profile came up. It ended up being the person who I would marry. We are now happily married and I have a child, and thoughts of suicide are just no longer even a part of my life. So the person I needed came from prayer to God. So I would say don't give up praying, if I had have given up entirely I would have missed out on the blessing.
 
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Soothfish

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Hi Soothfish,

I am at a loss to know what advice to give you. All I can do is say I once went through very intense periods of depression after a relationship break down. To the point that I wanted to comit suicide. I actuallyy gave it a go once, tried to drown myself in the bath of all things. However at the time God put a positive thought in my mind from things I had been told at church, and it prevented me from continueing with the act. After some time I actuallyy started to go out to church again and found that my faith in God's love increased. To the point that I was able to directly ask God for things expecting and answer. On one occassion I prayed to God saying there must be some one in the world who I could marry, I was on a dating site at the time, tell me who I asked. I got a certain name in my head, typed it into the search box, and a profile came up. It ended up being the person who I would marry. We are now happily married and I have a child, and thoughts of suicide are just no longer even a part of my life. So the person I needed came from prayer to God. So I would say don't give up praying, if I had have given up entirely I would have missed out on the blessing.

I used to dream about having a wife and a family. Now I do not. The thought of losing them to the abundant evil in the world is far worse than the thought of being alone.

If I were to look at their cold dead bodies in the morgue or watch them turn into lunatics, I would transform into a violent monster forever.

The only thing that appears to have any meaning is getting the curse of life over with as quickly as possible. I'll do what is necessary to get a paycheck and afford the physical and mental necessities until the curse is finished. There is no joy.
 
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oi_antz

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I used to dream about having a wife and a family. Now I do not. The thought of losing them to the abundant evil in the world is far worse than the thought of being alone.

If I were to look at their cold dead bodies in the morgue or watch them turn into lunatics, I would transform into a violent monster forever.

The only thing that appears to have any meaning is getting the curse of life over with as quickly as possible. I'll do what is necessary to get a paycheck and afford the physical and mental necessities until the curse is finished. There is no joy.

Hi Soothfish, I see you are still struggling. Did you do what I suggested and turn to the bible in your hour of need? How did that work out for you?
 
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FutureAndAHope

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Hi Soothfish,

There is a verse in the bible that I think could help you if you took on that mentality it is:

Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honorable, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

Every one has faults and if we focus on the faults in the world we will become very judgmental, and will not be able to assist people in need. But if we focus on the good in others (even if they are evil), we can better relate to them.

The whole vese of scripture goes as follows:

Php 4:6-8 In nothing be anxious; but in everything by prayer and supplication with thanksgiving let your requests be made known unto God. And the peace of God, which passeth all understanding, shall guard your hearts and your thoughts in Christ Jesus. Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honorable, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

If you can learn to pray with true faith in God youu will overcome anxiety, as we only become anxious when we are isolated and on our own, but when we know we have God on our side, to help us and aid us all our anxiety leaves.
 
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Soothfish

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Hi Soothfish, I see you are still struggling. Did you do what I suggested and turn to the bible in your hour of need? How did that work out for you?

It can distract me for however long I'm reading it but eventually I have to return to stinking planet Earth.
 
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Catherineanne

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I used to dream about having a wife and a family. Now I do not. The thought of losing them to the abundant evil in the world is far worse than the thought of being alone.

If I were to look at their cold dead bodies in the morgue or watch them turn into lunatics, I would transform into a violent monster forever.

The only thing that appears to have any meaning is getting the curse of life over with as quickly as possible. I'll do what is necessary to get a paycheck and afford the physical and mental necessities until the curse is finished. There is no joy.

I think you would do well to return to that dream of your wife and family. Plenty of people manage to live happy lives, even knowing that death exists, and that accidents can happen. Some people will inevitably die, some horribly, some peacefully. But we won't all die all at once. Meanwhile I am reminded of a line from the film Anthony and Cleopatra, where Mark Anthony says to Augustus; 'One day you will die, Octavian, without ever having actually lived.' Life is about taking chances, and one of them is on love.

Bad things happen, yes, but so do good things, and they can happen to you. You could hold your own child in your arms, and feel the greatest love ever known; it is possible.

Why not allow yourself to dream again? A beautiful baby boy, the image of his dad, or a tiny little girl, pretty as a flower. Why not?

I have a daughter who has just started at university, as you know. I often tell her that she is my revenge on the world. The world might have battered me down and destroyed my life, but while she is around life is still worthwhile; it has to be. And if anything happens to her, then I will deal with it as best I can, but I will still have had the happiest years of my life and the happiest times with her. They can't be taken away from me.
 
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GA777

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About your state, I'm sorry to hear that, but that doesnt prove that God doesnt exist.
You need to seek him not because you have no other option, but because you choose him between all the options. I am pretty sure if you can pray from your heart to Jesus and ask his holy spirit to fill you and promising him that you will do some great efforts to get people to him, or in order that you'd get really close to him and confess your sins, you should get an answer. God/Jesus doesnt always respond if the response would be worthless and would change nothing in someone's life.

Btw. It is just too hard to believe that God doesnt exist after many accurate predictions.

Edom and Edomites

The Edomites were the descendants of Esau, who was the brother of Jacob. This nation lived in the land south of the Dead Sea. The prophets foretold their destruction and desolation:
. . . and Edom shall be a desolate wilderness, for the violence against the children of Judah. . . . Joel 3:19 (KJV).

Therefore thus saith the Lord God:
I will also stretch out mine hand upon Edom, and will cut off man and beast from it: and I will make it desolate from Teman Ezekiel 25:13 (KJV). (Before 570 B.C.)

Also Edom shall be a desolation . . .Jeremiah 49:17 (KJV). (Before 540 B.C.)

. . . and there shall not be any remaining of the house of Esau; for the LORD hath spoken it. Obadiah 18 (KJV).

After Jerusalem was taken into Babylonian captivity, Nabataean Arabs took Edom.1 Edomites then lived in southern Judea. In 164 B.C., the Jews defeated them, and in 120 B.C. the Jews conquered these Idumeans.2 In about A.D. 69, an army of 40,000 greatly depopulated them.3 And the Edomites disappeared from history just as the prophets had foretold.

The Romans conquered the Nabataeans in Edom in A.D. 106. They changed the trade route so that it ran through Palmyra instead of Petra (Sela), the capital of Edom. This cut off the country's income, and it lost its importance.4 After the Byzantine period, it became a desolation until this day.

You can visit the land of Edom today. It is desolate from Teman (Maan) in the north on to the south, just as the Old Testament prophets foretold. Tourists visit the remains of the city Petra (Sela). For centuries Edom has been a desolation in fulfillment of the judgment of God. The Edomites have not existed as a people since the time of the New Testament apostles, in fulfillment of the Old Testament prophets.


The Philistines

The Philistines lived in the southwestern part of the land of Canaan, on the plains along the Mediterranean Sea. Their cities were Gaza, Ashkelon, Ashdod, Ekron, Gath, and Gerar. They fought much against Israel. This is recorded in the Bible from the book of Judges to 2 Chronicles. The word of God prophesied against the Philistines that God would destroy them. In about 765 B.C., the prophet Amos recorded:
Amos 1:6-8: Thus says the LORD:
"For three transgressions of Gaza, and for four, I will not turn away its punishment,
Because they took captive the whole captivity
To deliver them up to Edom.
But I will send a fire upon the wall of Gaza,
Which shall devour its palaces.
I will cut off the inhabitant from Ashdod,
And the one who holds the scepter from Ashkelon;
I will turn My hand against Ekron,
And the remnant of the Philistines shall perish,"
Says the Lord GOD. (NKJB)
Also: Zephaniah 2:3-7. Jeremiah 47:4,5. Isaiah 14:28-31.

God used the Babylonians in 604 B.C. to destroy the Philistines. 2 Kings 24:7. The judgment of God came upon the Philistines. They were destroyed, and taken away to punish. (Lawrence Stager, "The Fury of Babylon." Biblical Archaeology Review, Jan./Feb.1996, pp. 56-77.) Today, Arabs live in Gaza, and Israelis live in Askelon and Ashdod. Ekron, Gath and Gerar are ruins. You can visit and see for yourself. The remnant of the Philistines perished, just as foretold by God in Amos.


Tyre

Tyre was a great Phoenician city on the coast just north of Israel. But the people were idol worshipers; their prince called himself God, and they rejoiced over Jerusalem's trouble. God foretold the destruction of Old Tyre:
Therefore thus saith the Lord God; Behold I am against thee, O Tyrus, and will cause many nations to come up against thee, . . . and I will make thee like the top of a rock: thou shalt be built no more; for I the Lord have spoken it, saith the Lord God. Ezekiel 26:3, 14 (KJV).

Nebuchadnezzar besieged Old Tyre for thirteen years before it fell, in about 573 B.C.5 Tyre submitted to the Persians in about 525 B.C.6 Then the prophecies were finally fulfilled in 332 B.C. when Alexander the Great took the island just offshore:
Alexander announced that he would visit their island and sacrifice to their Heracles. They replied that it would be more proper to sacrifice in the ancient temple of Baalmelqart on the mainland at Old Tyre; when he insisted that he must visit the island, they declared that they would admit neither Persian nor Macedonian into their city.7 Possessing no fleet, Alexander demolished Old Tyre, and with the debris built a mole 200 feet in breadth across the straits, and erected tower and war engines at its further end.8

Alexander the Great made Old Tyre like the top of a rock when he cleared it to build his roadway out to the island. Since that time, Old Tyre has not been rebuilt, just as the prophet of God had foretold.

Old Tyre has been like the top of the rock since the time of Alexander the Great. The fishermen dry their nets there. You can visit there and see for yourself the literal fulfillment of the prophecies of the Bible. For 2,300 years, Old Tyre has not been rebuilt, just as the judgment of God said.


Babylon

Babylon was a great city on the Euphrates River. Under Nebuchadnezzar, the Babylonians destroyed Jerusalem and took the people captive to Babylon in 586 B.C. Isaiah and Jeremiah foretold the desolation of Babylon:

And Babylon, the glory of kingdoms, the beauty of the Chaldees excellency, shall be as when God overthrew Sodom and Gomorrah. It shall never be inhabited, neither shall it be dwelt in from generation to generation neither shall the Arabian pitch tent there; neither shall the shepherds make their fold there. Isaiah 13:19-20 (KJV). (Before 680 B.C.)

Because of the wrath of the Lord it shall not be inhabited, but it shall be wholly desolate: every one that goeth by Babylon shall be astonished, and hiss at all her plagues. Jeremiah 50:13 (KJV).

In 539 B.C., Babylon fell to the Medes and the Persians. Its decline was gradual. The Parthians destroyed much of the city. In about A.D. 75 the merchants moved.

With the departure of the merchants, Babylon was left to its doom. Shortly afterwards the Latin author Pliny stated that the temple of Marduk was still standing but that in every other respect the place had become a desert. In A.D. 116 the Roman emperor Trajan wintered in the city during his campaign against the Parthians. Attracted to it by its widespread fame, he found nothing but mounds and stones and ruins.9

The Germans excavated Babylon's ruins. Their maps show the desolation.10 Arab villages are outside of what was Babylon. For 1900 years Babylon has been uninhabited. You can visit the ruins of Babylon in order to see the literal fulfillment of the Bible prophecies.

Egypt

At one time the Egyptian Empire included Canaan, Syria and Lebanon, reaching to the upper Euphrates. The future of Egypt was foretold in detail:

It shall be the lowliest of the kingdoms; it shall never again exalt itself above the nations, for I will diminish them so that they will not rule over the nations any more. Ezekiel 29:15 (NKJV).

. . . and there shall be no more a prince of the land of Egypt: and I will put fear in the land of Egypt. Ezekiel 30:13 (KJV).

History shows the fulfillment of these prophecies. Egypt has not ruled over the nations since the time of the prophet Ezekiel. Egypt has been ruled by the Persians, the Greeks, the Romans, Constantinople, the Saracen Arabs, the Mamelukes, the Turks, the French, and the English. In recent years, Egypt has not had princes.11

For 2,500 years Egypt has been a lowly nation, just as the prophet foretold. You can visit Egypt and see that Egypt is truly one of the lowliest of nations.


Israel

The destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans was foretold in Deuteronomy 29:49-68, and Daniel 9:26-27. These prophecies were fulfilled in A.D. 70. Josephus recorded the detailed fulfillment of the siege and destruction of Jerusalem including the mother eating her child.12 The scattering of Israel among the nations, if they disobeyed God, was foretold:

And I will scatter you among the heathen, and will draw out a sword after you: . . . Leviticus 26:33 (KJV).

And the LORD shall scatter thee among all people, from the one end of the earth even unto the other: . . . and among these nations shalt thou find no ease, . . . Deuteronomy 28:64-65 (KJV).

Israel ceased to exist as a nation from A.D. 70 until 1948. The Jews have truly been scattered among all people, from one end of the earth even to the other during 1900 years. Among the nations they have found no ease, but have been persecuted, just as the scriptures foretold. The nations of the world have persecuted them and killed them. During World War II, Hitler had six million Jews killed.

The amazing thing is that the Jews have survived. This was foretold in Jeremiah:
For I am with thee, saith the Lord, to save thee: though I make a full end of all nations whither I have scattered thee, yet I will not make a full end of thee: but I will correct thee in measure, and will not leave thee altogether unpunished. Jeremiah 30:11 (KJV).

The Babylonians, Philistines and Edomites do not now exist. But the Jews still exist in spite of dispersion and persecution, just as was foretold.

Babylon, Nineveh, Old Tyre and Petra are desolate. They have not been rebuilt. But Jerusalem now stands. Here is empirical evidence!

You can see the fulfillment of prophecy with your own eyes. The Old Testament was written before Christ. It was translated into Greek before Christ. 1900 years of history and conditions which can be seen today testify to the supernatural inspiration of the writers of the Bible. They claimed that they wrote the word which the one living God gave to them. That is demonstrated.


The Return to Israel

Israel became a nation again in 1948. From A.D. 70 on, the Jews were scattered among the nations, and Israel ceased to be a nation. However, in our time, the Jews have been returning to Israel, and Israel has again become a nation after 1878 years. The Bible prophets foretold all this in detail, hundreds of years before it happened.

The prophet Isaiah foretold that God would gather His people, Israel, a second time during the time of Messiah, the root of Jesse. Let us read this prophecy which was given about 700 B.C., about 2700 years ago.

Isaiah 11:10-12:
Then it will come about in that day
That the nations will resort to the root of Jesse,
Who will stand as a signal for the peoples;
And His resting place will be glorious.
Then it will happen on that day that the Lord
Will again recover the second time with His hand
The remnant of His people, who will remain,
From Assyria, Egypt, Pathros, Cush, Elam, Shinar, Hamath,
And from the islands of the sea.
And He will lift up a standard for the nations,
And will assemble the banished ones of Israel,
And will gather the dispersed of Judah
From the four corners of the earth.

You will notice that after the nations have resorted to the root of Jesse, a branch from his roots, Messiah (Isa.11:1), then the Lord will a second time recover and assemble the people of Israel and Judah from all over the world. This has happened and is happening right now. (See also Joel 3:1,2, 7. Amos 9:14, 15. Hosea 3:4, 5. Jeremiah 23:5-8. Zechariah 10:6-10. Ezekiel 39:25-29.)

Jesus was a prophet of God. In Luke, chapter 21, Jesus foretold the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans, which happened in A.D. 70. Let us read one important verse of what Jesus said about the Jews:
Luke 21:24: and they will fall by the edge of the sword, and will be led captive into all the nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled under foot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

Notice: Jesus foretold that the Jews would be led captive into all nations. That happened and the Jews have continued to be in all nations even until our time. Jesus foretold that Jerusalem would be trampled under foot of the Gentiles. That was fulfilled in history. How long did Jesus say that the Gentiles would have Jerusalem? "Until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled." By this statement, Jesus showed that the Jews would get Jerusalem back. When was this fulfilled? On June 7, 1967, Israel took back Jerusalem; Jewish soldiers stormed into the city. The prophecies of Jesus were fulfilled in detail. Here is empirical data, historical proof that God exists, that God has spoken through His prophets and that Jesus is a prophet of God. They are proof that God has revealed Himself to man. They are proof that God rules in history and judges mankind.

For no prophecy ever came by the will of man: but men spake from God, being moved by the Holy Spirit. 2 Peter 1:21 (ASV).

And so we have the prophetic word made more sure, to which you do well to pay attention as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until the day dawns and the morning star arises in your hearts. 2 Peter 1:19.


So, after such facts, it is just impossible to believe that this God isnt real. We wouldnt waste our time believing in a God whom we arent sure of his presence.
 
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Soothfish

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The events you describe seem to be all human-orchestrated. The Hebrews had their "golden age" well before the rise of the Roman empire so it figures that they had many victories.

Also, considering the skill and tenacity of your average Jew today, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that they managed to do those things described in scripture.

Jesus was a prophet of God. In Luke, chapter 21, Jesus foretold the destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans, which happened in A.D. 70. Let us read one important verse of what Jesus said about the Jews:
Luke 21:24: and they will fall by the edge of the sword, and will be led captive into all the nations; and Jerusalem will be trampled under foot by the Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled.

This is an exception to what I stated above but then again the reason is obvious: the Romans were a powerful military force. It was only a matter of time before the Jews would be conquered during that period in history.

Israel became a nation again in 1948. From A.D. 70 on, the Jews were scattered among the nations, and Israel ceased to be a nation. However, in our time, the Jews have been returning to Israel, and Israel has again become a nation after 1878 years. The Bible prophets foretold all this in detail, hundreds of years before it happened.

Unfortunately, the rise of the state of Israel can also be explained very easily in purely human terms. The Jews were smart enough to rise to the top and that made the spoiled godless world very envious (we are seeing something similar right now in the USA just not with Jews in particular) then they attempted genocide. The solution to preventing another genocide was to create a state that would be supported and honored by the Jews as it was promised in the old testament that they already read and believed in.

I'm not saying that this proves that God didn't have something to do with it. I'm just saying that it doesn't prove that he did either.

Did the Bible predict any natural disasters within a specific time period and in a specific place? I can't seem to find any instances of that but such evidence would be extremely helpful if it's dug away in there somewhere.
 
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Soothfish

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I think you would do well to return to that dream of your wife and family. Plenty of people manage to live happy lives, even knowing that death exists, and that accidents can happen. Some people will inevitably die, some horribly, some peacefully. But we won't all die all at once. Meanwhile I am reminded of a line from the film Anthony and Cleopatra, where Mark Anthony says to Augustus; 'One day you will die, Octavian, without ever having actually lived.' Life is about taking chances, and one of them is on love.

Bad things happen, yes, but so do good things, and they can happen to you. You could hold your own child in your arms, and feel the greatest love ever known; it is possible.

Why not allow yourself to dream again? A beautiful baby boy, the image of his dad, or a tiny little girl, pretty as a flower. Why not?

I have a daughter who has just started at university, as you know. I often tell her that she is my revenge on the world. The world might have battered me down and destroyed my life, but while she is around life is still worthwhile; it has to be. And if anything happens to her, then I will deal with it as best I can, but I will still have had the happiest years of my life and the happiest times with her. They can't be taken away from me.

I believe that we are approaching a period in history when that sort of thing won't be possible anymore. We are already at the point when tens of millions of parents kill their own children and many more don't really care if they live or die. I'm already seeing the rise in angst, stress, anger, loathing, and callousness in all the families around me. Maybe this hasn't effected everyone yet but the plague is expanding rapidly. It's even effecting the people who are rather pious.

What type of university is your daughter going to? I went to an east coast public university and all the women I met were brainwashed into unimaginable depravity. Even one who seemed like a sweety-pie was also corrupted. It's why I never had a relationship that lasted more then a week and eventually gave up on relationships completely. I fear for your daughter. That environment is crawling with wolves. It would be a miracle if she comes out unscathed.

I am not able to look at my baby nephews and see anything other than doomed souls. No matter how much my family or myself tries to protect them it's all up to random chance. They will most likely be processed like meat and consumed by the evil powers that dominate this world. If I had children of my own it would be the same thing. I wouldn't even be able to feel happy on the day of their births. It would be like looking at newborn corpses.
 
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Catherineanne

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I believe that we are approaching a period in history when that sort of thing won't be possible anymore. We are already at the point when tens of millions of parents kill their own children and many more don't really care if they live or die. I'm already seeing the rise in angst, stress, anger, loathing, and callousness in all the families around me. Maybe this hasn't effected everyone yet but the plague is expanding rapidly. It's even effecting the people who are rather pious.

What type of university is your daughter going to? I went to an east coast public university and all the women I met were brainwashed into unimaginable depravity. Even one who seemed like a sweety-pie was also corrupted. It's why I never had a relationship that lasted more then a week and eventually gave up on relationships completely. I fear for your daughter. That environment is crawling with wolves. It would be a miracle if she comes out unscathed.

I am not able to look at my baby nephews and see anything other than doomed souls. No matter how much my family or myself tries to protect them it's all up to random chance. They will most likely be processed like meat and consumed by the evil powers that dominate this world. If I had children of my own it would be the same thing. I wouldn't even be able to feel happy on the day of their births. It would be like looking at newborn corpses.

Thank you for the concern, but my d is fine. I came through university unscathed, and she is stronger than I ever was at her age. She is a sensible, mature person, and nobody is going to push her around. She is in a Cathedral town in the south of England, and she is safe. She does not drink, she focusses on her work, and after just a few weeks of her first year she is already working on plans for her third year dissertation. She is a real star!

http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/tyr

This is the link to a series of podcasts for a Radio 4 programme. My d researched all those broadcast in September, and she features in the September 13 episode. Have a listen if you like; when Sally Magnussen talks to Charlie, and describes her as a genealogist, that is my 18 yo daughter. She sounds perfectly competent and happy, and indeed she is, but she has faced just as much in her short life as many people go through in a lifetime. The difference between me and C is that she is far more resilient than I ever was.

Truly the world is not as bad as you are painting it to be; do you not see that your illness is colouring everything a very dark shade indeed?

The fact that you care that the world is as you perceive it to be is itself evidence that your world view is distorted. If you can care, even as you are, then how much more can others care, who are not burdened as you are? There is a great deal of love, and altruism in the world, and there is no need to give up on it just yet. If you read books from Roman times you will see that there were plenty of people even then ready to bemoan the age as one of depravity and wickedness. And here we are, 2.000 years later, doing the same.

You don't know me, you don't know my daugher, but you are concerned for her welfare. Is this not evidence that we are better than you think, and indeed, heading for a brigher future than you imagine?
 
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Soothfish

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Thank you for the concern, but my d is fine. I came through university unscathed, and she is stronger than I ever was at her age. She is a sensible, mature person, and nobody is going to push her around. She is in a Cathedral town in the south of England, and she is safe. She does not drink, she focusses on her work, and after just a few weeks of her first year she is already working on plans for her third year dissertation. She is a real star!

BBC - Podcasts - Tracing Your Roots

This is the link to a series of podcasts for a Radio 4 programme. My d researched all those broadcast in September, and she features in the September 13 episode. Have a listen if you like; when Sally Magnussen talks to Charlie, and describes her as a genealogist, that is my 18 yo daughter. She sounds perfectly competent and happy, and indeed she is, but she has faced just as much in her short life as many people go through in a lifetime. The difference between me and C is that she is far more resilient than I ever was.

I believe that your daughter is an exception to the rule. The hard evidence suggests that the population is overwhelmingly evil, malicious, irresponsible, and profoundly narcissistic. This isn't my opinion or a feeling. It is a fact. We are actually living in countries where between 40-60% of the population thinks that full fledged infanticide should be legalized, that laws should only exist for practical purposes, that feeling good is a human right and anyone [they] don't like should be punished by the law, and that right and wrong are nothing but points of view. Murderers are being released on technicalities and nobody does anything about it. Evil rules the world completely and we are nothing more than prisoners pretending to make a difference. The "good" works are just for passing the time until our lives are finished. I would agree that a healthy mind manages to look on the bright side of things but that mind is grounded in a pleasant brain chemical balance, not the hard data.

Truly the world is not as bad as you are painting it to be; do you not see that your illness is colouring everything a very dark shade indeed?

The fact that you care that the world is as you perceive it to be is itself evidence that your world view is distorted. If you can care, even as you are, then how much more can others care, who are not burdened as you are? There is a great deal of love, and altruism in the world, and there is no need to give up on it just yet. If you read books from Roman times you will see that there were plenty of people even then ready to bemoan the age as one of depravity and wickedness. And here we are, 2.000 years later, doing the same.

You don't know me, you don't know my daugher, but you are concerned for her welfare. Is this not evidence that we are better than you think, and indeed, heading for a brigher future than you imagine?

All I know is that the hard political and social evidence indicates overwhelming depravity throughout the human population. Only a handful of people are holding it all together. I'm not one of them but I am one that wishes to be one of them despite my many flaws. However, the "holding it all together" is all just an illusion. My own country is $14.8 trillion in debt because the rate of insanity, crime, cruelty, selfishness, and brokenness far outpaces the rate of normal development. This normal development was the gradual elevation of the dignity of man that reached its zenith during the cultures of the enlightenment era and continued to a lesser degree throughout the industrial revolution. It led to improvements in living standards and prosperity that previous eras couldn't even imagine. Now we are at the point where technological and social developments are being actively attacked by the highest worldly powers and moral and responsible behavior is so unusual that people get astonished when they finally see it. Either that or the crowd can't understand it at any level and lashes out with hatred.

I don't really know how the violence in the world today compares to every point in history. However, I do know that the law is worse than it has been in thousands of years. We are rapidly returning to an era where the law no longer serves to protect the innocent simply because they are innocent. It is all a measure of convoluted, cold, calculating moral relativity and humanist activism. I've been studying politics for over 6 years and I know that the evidence is simply indisputable.

I don't think it's even possible to turn things around. What does ANYONE do when the majority of people love evil this much? Even God will have to burn this world to a crisp just to get rid of the stench.

I apologize if this rant ruins your mood but it is what I truly believe.
 
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oi_antz

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It can distract me for however long I'm reading it but eventually I have to return to stinking planet Earth.
It sounds to me as though God has not spoken to you. If I was you I would be working hard to try and find out why. God is not dead you know, He is very much alive and watching, but there must be something that is impeding your relationship with Him. If you truly had a relationship with God then you would be satisfied. I think you are taking life for granted, surely you must see that there is something valuable about having your life. Heck, if I had the choice I would trade places with you when my time comes - and I bet even Steve Jobs would too!
 
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GA777

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The events you describe seem to be all human-orchestrated. The Hebrews had their "golden age" well before the rise of the Roman empire so it figures that they had many victories.

Also, considering the skill and tenacity of your average Jew today, it doesn't surprise me in the slightest that they managed to do those things described in scripture.



This is an exception to what I stated above but then again the reason is obvious: the Romans were a powerful military force. It was only a matter of time before the Jews would be conquered during that period in history.



Unfortunately, the rise of the state of Israel can also be explained very easily in purely human terms. The Jews were smart enough to rise to the top and that made the spoiled godless world very envious (we are seeing something similar right now in the USA just not with Jews in particular) then they attempted genocide. The solution to preventing another genocide was to create a state that would be supported and honored by the Jews as it was promised in the old testament that they already read and believed in.

I'm not saying that this proves that God didn't have something to do with it. I'm just saying that it doesn't prove that he did either.

Did the Bible predict any natural disasters within a specific time period and in a specific place? I can't seem to find any instances of that but such evidence would be extremely helpful if it's dug away in there somewhere.

Yes, that can possibly happen without supernatural intervention, but it would be hard too. And these are the 2 least impressive prophecies from the ones I posted. :p

And bible predicted that darkness will reign when Jesus will be crucified, which is recorded in history but not very accurately written by historians.. But the bible has nothing to do with natural disasters. It is mostly about God benefitting the people, like how God is, how people shall live, how to praise God etc..

There are 300s messianic prophecies, prophecy showing when Jesus will be born (through some clear numbering calculations). It is said that in the last days, nature will turn against people too, and that right before the coming of Jesus, the worst natural disasters will happen. (stars falling-moon and sun not giving light...) and other prophecies about nations too
 
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Catherineanne

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I believe that your daughter is an exception to the rule.

Excellent. That is a start.

Now, here is a thought for you. If the rule has an exception, then it is no longer a rule.

The hard evidence suggests that the population is overwhelmingly evil, malicious, irresponsible, and profoundly narcissistic.

So what? If I happen to be the only person left who cares about other people, wants to do the right thing and wants to choose life rather than death, then it is STILL the right choice to make.

Fortunately I am not the only one; there are millions of us, all over the place. The problem is that good news does not make headlines.

Here is another 'exception'. A friend of mine is a priest, living in a 5 bedroomed house. Last year he donated a kidney to one of his parishioners. That parishioner has two boys to care for; not his own, his sister's boys. Without him, they would go into care. Without my friend donating his kidney, that father would have died by now.

The other rooms in my friend's house are currently occupied by a selection of other waifs and strays from the parish, who would otherwise be homeless. He runs youth groups several times a week and takes young people on holiday who would otherwise not get a holiday, very often paying towards it from his own pocket.

Will you ever see any of that on the news? No.

Or my own priest. When my d's father died earlier this year, his mother and sister did not allow her to have any say in the funeral whatever, and did not let her speak or have any writing included. My priest offered her a requiem at our church instead, with her choice of music, and when I showed him what we wanted read out, he said he did not need to even read it; we could have what we wanted. It was a lovely service, and did not undo the pain caused at the funeral, but it did show d that she is loved, and that her grief matters.

I could choose to dwell on the selfishness of his sister and mother, but I choose not to. They are human, fallible and grieving, and they are making a lot of mistakes along the way, particularly in how they are treating d. Instead I choose to think of the ones who were there for us; our friends and neighbours who came to the Requiem, and who cared. In a world of darkness, the small lights show up all the more brightly.

Evil rules the world completely and we are nothing more than prisoners pretending to make a difference. The "good" works are just for passing the time until our lives are finished. I would agree that a healthy mind manages to look on the bright side of things but that mind is grounded in a pleasant brain chemical balance, not the hard data.

There was one person in history qualified to take the sins of the world on his shoulders, and I am not him. I can only carry what I have to carry; my own life, the tasks that fall to me, my daughter, my home, my family. I am not strong enough to bear the rest, nor does God expect me to.

Life is not about the big dramas. Life is about the small victories that we achieve every day. Whether you know it or not, just by staying here, and not giving up, you are part of the solution to all that evil.

I don't think it's even possible to turn things around. What does ANYONE do when the majority of people love evil this much? Even God will have to burn this world to a crisp just to get rid of the stench.

I apologize if this rant ruins your mood but it is what I truly believe.

Your rant is not ruining my mood. It is ruining your mood.

But thanks for the concern. :hug:
 
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