What is the best "way" to, if possible, to work toward of follow in keeping the commandments...?

Lost4words

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The whole point of having the commandments, the moral law, and the teaching of Christ is to show that there is no way that we can comply with them. If a person is to depend on these in order to be saved, or to live a successful Christian life, he needs to do what Paul said, "The person who decides to depend on the Law shall live by it". The problem is that one infraction of the commandments, moral law, and the commandments of Christ leads to condemnation for the person who is attempting to live by the law in order to be justified.

All the posts that tell us that we should comply with the commandments of Christ, get free from sin, do the right thing, obey the commandments, etc, etc, and so on, ad nauseum, have the sole effect of making a believer feel condemned and depressed, because every genuine believer knows that no matter how hard one tries, he cannot comply with the law without fault.

So to tell people that to be good believers they have to get the victory over sinful habit patterns, faults and shortcomings, to to preach condemnation to them. No wonder so many good believers feel like giving it all up!

The truth is that there is no way in the world that we are going to be perfect in holiness. We are always going to trip and fall into temptation and have to confess our fault and receive continual forgiveness from God.

So what is the answer? Total faith, trust, and confidence in Christ. It is by looking to Christ, trusting in His righteousness instead of our own, that will allow the Holy Spirit in us to form us into the persons whom God wants us to be. We cannot reform ourselves. We cannot get rid of our sinful habit patterns by ourselves, we need the Holy Spirit to do that work in us, and He can only do that as we put our trust in Christ, be led by Him from day to day, seek Him in prayer and in the Word.

When we turn our eyes and heart toward Christ, and away from ourselves, and stop navel gazing and worrying about our spiritual state, we find over time that sinful habits that once had us sinning, repenting, sinning, repenting, start to fall away from us, and we somehow lose interest as these habits become weaker and weaker until they disappear altogether - as the Holy Spirit works to conform us to the image of Christ.

Superb post. :oldthumbsup:
 
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LittleLambofJesus

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The whole point of having the commandments, the moral law, and the teaching of Christ is to show that there is no way that we can comply with them. If a person is to depend on these in order to be saved, or to live a successful Christian life, he needs to do what Paul said, "The person who decides to depend on the Law shall live by it". The problem is that one infraction of the commandments, moral law, and the commandments of Christ leads to condemnation for the person who is attempting to live by the law in order to be justified.

All the posts that tell us that we should comply with the commandments of Christ, get free from sin, do the right thing, obey the commandments, etc, etc, and so on, ad nauseum, have the sole effect of making a believer feel condemned and depressed, because every genuine believer knows that no matter how hard one tries, he cannot comply with the law without fault.

So to tell people that to be good believers they have to get the victory over sinful habit patterns, faults and shortcomings, to to preach condemnation to them. No wonder so many good believers feel like giving it all up!

The truth is that there is no way in the world that we are going to be perfect in holiness. We are always going to trip and fall into temptation and have to confess our fault and receive continual forgiveness from God.

So what is the answer? Total faith, trust, and confidence in Christ. It is by looking to Christ, trusting in His righteousness instead of our own, that will allow the Holy Spirit in us to form us into the persons whom God wants us to be. We cannot reform ourselves. We cannot get rid of our sinful habit patterns by ourselves, we need the Holy Spirit to do that work in us, and He can only do that as we put our trust in Christ, be led by Him from day to day, seek Him in prayer and in the Word.

When we turn our eyes and heart toward Christ, and away from ourselves, and stop navel gazing and worrying about our spiritual state, we find over time that sinful habits that once had us sinning, repenting, sinning, repenting, start to fall away from us, and we somehow lose interest as these habits become weaker and weaker until they disappear altogether - as the Holy Spirit works to conform us to the image of Christ.
:amen:
Paul says in Galatians that those who observe specific holy days are trying to continue in the flesh instead of the Spirit. He specifically mentions Sabbaths, showing that those who are adamant about keeping a Sabbath day to remain accepted of God is not in the Spirit but in the flesh, and Paul wonders if he has wasted his time and effect in giving them the true gospel when they have departed from it. He says that those who are in the flesh and trying to observe special holy days, among other things, have no further interest in Christ. Christ is ineffective for them because they have departed from Him.
I agree.............

Romans 14:5

One man regards a certain day above the others, while someone else considers every day alike. Each one should be fully convinced in his own mind.
Galatians 4:10
days ye observe and months and times/seasons and years!
Colossians 2:16
Therefore let no one judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a festival, a New Moon, or a Sabbath.

Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized- Poll Thread

Matthew 24:20
and pray ye that your flight may not be in winter nor on a sabbath
Mark 13:18
and pray ye that your flight may not be in winter

================
Was the feast of the Passover considered a Sabbath? That is when Titus sieged Jerusalem in 70ad:

Titus encompasses Jerusalem feast of Passover....

Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive @
The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD


...........The day on which Titus encompassed Jerusalem, was the feast of the Passover;..........the city was at this time crowded with Jewish strangers, and foreigners from all parts, so that the whole nation may be considered as having been shut up in one prison, preparatory to the execution of the Divine vengeance..........

Revelation 9: Tormented 5 MONTHS and death fleeing 70ad

This memorable siege terminated on the eighth day of the ninth month, A.D. 70 : its duration was nearly five months,
the Romans having invested the city on the fourteenth day of the fourth month, preceeding.

Revelation 9:5
And was given to them that not they should be killing them, but that they should be being tormented five months
And the torment of them as torment of a scorpion/skorpiou <4651>, whenever it should be striking a man;.....................
 
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SkyWriting

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We were all once the same kind of sinners, lost in the world. Then a few of us repented and became new creations, no long continuing to love sin. If you stop sinning, stop loving sinning, and turn to the Father in true repentance, then you also may be saved from your sin. But if not, if there is no repentance, then there is no forgiveness.

Forgiveness is offered to all.

Matthew 9:6-8
But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins”—he then said to the paralytic—“Rise, pick up your bed and go home.” And he rose and went home. When the crowds saw it, they were afraid, and they glorified God, who had given such authority to men.

Ephesians 2:8-9
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Acts 16:31
And they said, “Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved, you and your household.”

John 3:16
“For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life.

Romans 10:9-10
Because, if you confess with your mouth that Jesus is Lord and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes and is justified, and with the mouth one confesses and is saved.

Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

John 5:24
Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.


1 Peter 3:18-22
For Christ also suffered once for sins, the righteous for the unrighteous, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh but made alive in the spirit, in which he went and proclaimed to the spirits in prison, because they formerly did not obey, when God's patience waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was being prepared, in which a few, that is, eight persons, were brought safely through water. Baptism, which corresponds to this, now saves you, not as a removal of dirt from the body but as an appeal to God for a good conscience, through the resurrection of Jesus Christ, who has gone into heaven and is at the right hand of God, with angels, authorities, and powers having been subjected to him.

Romans 6:4
We were buried therefore with him by baptism into death, in order that, just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, we too might walk in newness of life.

John 3:3
Jesus answered him, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.”

1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Romans 5:1
Therefore, since we have been justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ.

Mark 16:16
Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved, but whoever does not believe will be condemned.


Ephesians 2:8-10
For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast. For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.

Romans 2:6-8
He will render to each one according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, he will give eternal life; but for those who are self-seeking and do not obey the truth, but obey unrighteousness, there will be wrath and fury.

John 8:24
I told you that you would die in your sins, for unless you believe that I am he you will die in your sins.”

2 Thessalonians 3:6
Now we command you, brothers, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from any brother who is walking in idleness and not in accord with the tradition that you received from us.

John 6:55-59
For my flesh is true food, and my blood is true drink. Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood abides in me, and I in him. As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so whoever feeds on me, he also will live because of me. This is the bread that came down from heaven, not like the bread the fathers ate and died. Whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.” Jesus said these things in the synagogue, as he taught at Capernaum.

John 8:31-32
So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed in him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”


James 2:18 ESV / 5 helpful votes
But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.

1 Corinthians 11:1-2
Be imitators of me, as I am of Christ. Now I commend you because you remember me in everything and maintain the traditions even as I delivered them to you.

1 Corinthians 3:11-15
For no one can lay a foundation other than that which is laid, which is Jesus Christ. Now if anyone builds on the foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw— each one's work will become manifest, for the Day will disclose it, because it will be revealed by fire, and the fire will test what sort of work each one has done. If the work that anyone has built on the foundation survives, he will receive a reward. If anyone's work is burned up, he will suffer loss, though he himself will be saved, but only as through fire.

Romans 15:13
May the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope.

Romans 8:38-39
For I am sure that neither death nor life, nor angels nor rulers, nor things present nor things to come, nor powers, nor height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Acts 22:16
And now why do you wait? Rise and be baptized and wash away your sins, calling on his name.’

Acts 2:1-47
When the day of Pentecost arrived, they were all together in one place. And suddenly there came from heaven a sound like a mighty rushing wind, and it filled the entire house where they were sitting. And divided tongues as of fire appeared to them and rested on each one of them. And they were all filled with the Holy Spirit and began to speak in other tongues as the Spirit gave them utterance. Now there were dwelling in Jerusalem Jews, devout men from every nation under heaven. ...

John 20:19-24
On the evening of that day, the first day of the week, the doors being locked where the disciples were for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood among them and said to them, “Peace be with you.” When he had said this, he showed them his hands and his side. Then the disciples were glad when they saw the Lord. Jesus said to them again, “Peace be with you. As the Father has sent me, even so I am sending you.” And when he had said this, he breathed on them and said to them, “Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you withhold forgiveness from any, it is withheld.” ...
 
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SkyWriting

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No.
We were all once the same kind of sinners, lost in the world.

Then a few of us repented and became new creations, no longer continuing to love sin.

If you stop sinning, stop loving sinning, and turn to the Father in true repentance,
then
you also may be saved from your sin.
But if not, if there is no repentance, then there is no forgiveness.
Still, you can't find any scripture to quote? There are some you know.

Physically we are born into a sin condition.
We don't walk with God in Paradise anymore.
That is a past phase.

Does this sound like earth?



4This is the account of the heavens and the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made them.
5Now no shrub of the field had yet appeared on the earth, nor had any plant of the field sprouted; for the LORD God had not yet sent rain upon the earth, and there was no man to cultivate the ground. 6But springsa welled up from the earth and watered the whole surface of the ground.
7Then the LORD God formed man from the dust of the ground and breathed the breath of life into his nostrils, and the man became a living being.
8And the LORD God planted a garden in Eden, in the east, where He placed the man He had formed. 9Out of the ground the LORD God gave growth to every tree that is pleasing to the eye and good for food. And in the middle of the garden were the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
10Now a river flowed out of Eden to water the garden, and from there it branched into four headwaters:
11The name of the first river is Pishon; it winds through the whole land of Havilah, where there is gold. 12And the gold of that land is pure, and bdellium and onyx are found there.
13The name of the second river is Gihon; it winds through the whole land of Cush.
14The name of the third river is Hiddekel; it runs along the east side of Assyria.
And the fourth river is the Euphrates.
15Then the LORD God took the man and placed him in the Garden of Eden to cultivate and keep it.
16And the LORD God commanded him, “You may eat freely from every tree of the garden, 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil; for in the day that you eat of it, you will surely die.”

God removed us from there, where God walks:


23 Therefore the LORD God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken.
24 So He drove out the man and stationed cherubim to the east of the Garden of Eden, with a whirling sword of flame to guard the way to the tree of life.

Now....we are born into a sin environment.

Psalm 51
5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, and in sin did my mother conceive me.

Romans 6
23 For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Matthew 19
14 But Jesus said, “Let the little children come to me and do not hinder them, for to such belongs the kingdom of heaven.”

Psalm 58
3 The wicked are estranged from the womb;
they go astray from birth, speaking lies.


But through faith, our continuing life of sin is not counted against us.

Romans 4
8 Blessed is the man against whom the Lord will not count his sin.”

John 5
24 Truly, truly, I say to you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life. He does not come into judgment, but has passed from death to life.

1 Peter 2
24 He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness. By his wounds you have been healed.

Isaiah 64
6 We have all become like one who is unclean, and all our righteous deeds are like a polluted garment. We all fade like a leaf, and our iniquities, like the wind, take us away.

1 John 2
2 He is the propitiation for our sins, and not for ours only but also for the sins of the whole world.

1 John 1
7 But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus his Son cleanses us from all sin.

If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.


 
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Pepper77

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I guess I am basically asking "What is the Way...?" Basically... In which and how we should walk...? What we should pursue to seek to achieve, ect...?

I would say "Walk in the Way", but what is "the Way"...?

God Bless!

Jesus is the Way....I am the way, the truth and the life. If you have placed your faith in Him, He is your life. Your old man died, and the new man lives by faith in the Son of God. For I through the law, died to the law that I might live to God. Gal 2: 16-21.

We are not lawless...the law of the Spirit of life in Christ is what we walk by.

The old law, Mosaic law was a law of commands written in tablets of stone. Now we have Christ living in our hearts, joined to us, who leads us to will and to do of God's good pleasure. Its a law of love, working through the law of faith. Romans 8, 2Cor 3.
 
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Ing Bee

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What is the best "way" to, if possible, to work toward of follow in keeping the commandments...?

What does keeping the commandments mean to you...? What does it look like...?

And/if because if you do have a different view, then, "What is it, basically or IOW's...?"

Or some of you might think keeping the commandments is not the main point, and if so, could you explain that maybe...?

Or some of might think it/that is not the point at all, and if so, could you explain that maybe...? Or tell us what is the point then maybe...?

Is is possible to keep the commandments or not...? And, if not, should we pursue or work toward keeping them at all...? And then if so, or if that answer is yes, then, "how"...?

Comments...?

God Bless!

What a great question. It's one that Paul addresses directly in Romans 6-8. Read the three summaries for a quick overview of the chapters or read the bullet points for a play-by-play.

Chapter 6 Summary: The gospel disconnects us from sin's power and gives us a new, permanent standing before the Father in Christ's perfection. A new option is available: we can choose, moment-by-moment, NOT to sin, and instead partner with the world-healing work of God. This is a fact that we are commanded to embrace and make foundational to all thinking and action.
  • Through Christ's death, burial and resurrection on our behalf, we have experienced a permanent change in our standing before God and our relationship to the Father and to Sin.
    • Since we have been immersed into Christ (v.3,10), we shared in his death to sin(v.2)
    • Now we live toward God (v.10
  • The way we put this into practice is first "consider yourself dead to sin". Paul uses the word logizomai (consider) to make it clear that our being "dead to sin" is a statement of fact, not something up for debate. In the same way, as certain as the resurrection of Jesus (v.10), we are now alive to God because we are "in Christ' and Christ always and only is pleasing to the Father. This should give us great confidence to "approach the throne of grace" (Hebrews 4:14-16) in our "time of need", that is, when we are being tempted to sin.
  • Since it is a FACT that sin is no longer a foregone conclusion, we don't have to offer ourselves to it's tyranncal rule (v. 13)
  • Instead, we offer the various members of our bodies to God to do righteous things.(v.13)
  • We cannot be dominated by sin because we are no longer under the law, but under grace (v.14)
  • This prompts the obvious question: "Is it okay to sin, since we are not under the law?" (v.15)
  • Paul rejects this idea: sin is a cruel, vicious, and deadly master. Why would a free person ever go back to let their life be ruined by the corrosive effects of sin?( v.16)
  • Now that we're free, we can joyfully choose NOT to sin and instead participate with expanding God's kingdom of love and grace(v. 17). (Example: Instead of being bitter at a co-worker who was unkind or slanderous, we forgive and live for that persons good so they too may know the overflowing life, freed from the destructive power of sin. (v.22-23)

Chapter 7 Summary: While we are set from from sin and the law, in ourselves we are powerless to keep the law and will eventually give in to sin. This is the deep frustration many Christians feel when they just "try hard" in themselves. The answer is to continue the mind-shifting process (see Romans 6:11) to live empowered by the Holy Spirit.
  • Paul demonstrates from marriage law, that death nullifies the law. In the same way, he argues, we have died to our old "husband" law (v.4) and are free to be married to our new husband, Jesus, so that we can "bear fruit" -- a life of goodness, generosity, love (1 Cor. 13), joy, and hope (Galatians 5-22-23).
  • Now our goodness flows from an inner life NOT on rule-keeping. We respond in gratitude to the generosity of God in Christ, not out of grudging obligation or fear. Because of this change and the power of the Holy Spirit in us, we DO serve God's will, but not in the old way of the written code (v.6). See Hebrews 8:8-11 (c.f. Jeremiah 31:31-34).
  • Paul is quick to make clear that the law is not bad, but good. It served its purpose: to reveal what sin is and how insidious and deadly it is. (v. 7-13)
  • Paul then gives a further example from his own life: in our own ability we are powerless to defeat sin. The law is unable to help our flesh obey God because it is spiritual and our bodies are fleshly. (v.14)
  • As a result, even though a Christian is now aware of sin and wants to do what is right (not what is wrong), in our own ability we are powerless and will cave in to sin eventually (v.15, 18). But it is not in our new nature to sin, rather sin is trapped like a rat in our mortal bodies and runs around trying to use our members (v.17), especially in our tongues (see James 3:6-11).
  • Paul has discovered a true principle: the law of sin in his body wages war against the delight of God's law in our Newly transformed minds (v.23, 25b).
  • Any Christian who wants to please God but is continually failing by just "trying harder" can relate to how miserable Paul was before he grasped the new life in the Spirit: "What a wretched man I am! Who will save me from this body of death (the body that is powerless to resist death-producing sin)?"
  • Good news! See the facts of Chapter 6! Christ has made the new life possible. (v.25a)
Chapter 8 Summary- Through the power of the Holy Spirit we can do what our mortal flesh cannot do - keep the law. We do this by "setting our minds on the things of the Spirit", that is, letting God's word about reality and goodness shape our thoughts, values, judgments, preferences, and motivations and desires.
  • Since we've been immersed, grafted in, married, etc. to Christ (see Chapters 6-7) there is now no condemnation for those who are in Christ --- because he is not condemned we are not. (v.1)
  • Our inability to keep the law was matched by Christ's perfect keeping so that sin, not us, has been condemned. (v.3)
  • Now we CAN fulfill the righteous requirements of the law, but not through our teeth-gritting effort but by the Spirit who lives in us (v.4)
  • Now we see that the first step to cooperating with God in the world (e.g. keeping the law) is through being empowered by the Spirit of God. Since the Law is Spirit it can be kept by the Spirit in us. (v.4b)
  • How do we do this? By "setting our minds" on eternal things. All action starts in the mind so we have to shape our minds to God's ways (Romans 12:2). Some examples:
    • How did Jesus act? How did he speak? How did he treat people? He has made God known to us so he is our model for living the new life.(John 1:18)
    • Colossians 3 targets the "evil thoughts" we have to put to death, the thoughts that are from above (esp, v. 12-17), and some examples of what that looks like in various human relationships.
  • If you don't have the Spirit you can't please God (v.8). With the Spirit however, He gives empowering life to our mortal (still-imperfect) bodies so that we can walk in step with God (1 John 1:6-7) and put the members of our body to good use (Rom. 6:13-14)
  • More Good News! The Spirit is on our side, he is committed to growing the Sons of God into maturity. (v.14-16). The pattern of those who are adopted into God's family is that we now desire to live in step (fellowship- see 1 John 1: 3) with our Father, listen to his voice rather than our own, confess sin when we fail (1 John 1:8-9), but recognize that sin is not our master and that we don't HAVE to do it, no matter what we feel like in the moment. Instead, we look for opportunities to love our enemies, benefit those around us, speak kindly and truthfully, be generous and hospitable, seek justice for those around us, suffer for doing good without anger... just like our Father (v.15-16).
  • As heirs, we are guaranteed to share in Christ's glory as we share in his suffering. (v.17) including having new, resurrected bodies free from the decay of mortality (v. 23) and the constant fight to control our bodies from the pull of sin.
Conclusion: To change how we act means we first have to change how we think. When we start thinking the way our Father does, we natural act in step with what He's doing and we recognize His goodness.

Examine yourself: find a pattern of wrong attitude in your life and target it with truth.

  1. Truth from Romans 6:11 - you don't have to keep doing the same thing. You are no longer obligated to sin's authority. Believe it as a fact.
  2. Truth from Romans 7:18- you have no power in yourself to overcome sin. "Try harder next time" won't work. Believe it as a fact.
  3. Truth from Romans 8: 3-5 - Through Christ, we now have the Holy Spirit working in us to change our thoughts and desires and empower us to live in step with the Father. Believe it as a fact. Call on Him to empower you and remind you of truth when you are tempted.
  4. Truth from Romans 8:1-2 - In Christ, even when you fail, there is no condemnation. Believe it as a fact. Delight in your adoption as an heir of God.
  5. Now the Law serves as a guide to the likeness of our Father, in whose image we are being transformed into (2 Cor. 3:18).
    • Read what God says about himself in the Old Testament.
    • Look at Jesus's life in the Gospels - he makes God's character visible in human form, he's our master and our standard.
    • Look at the early Christians in Acts. How did they live in community with each other? How did they treat others, even those who wanted to harm them?
    • Make a pattern of examining your life for new ways to develop the mind of Christ.
    • Look at the various lists of Godly character in Paul's epistles and pray, asking the Spirit to transform you in specific areas (patience, kindness, hospitality, truthfulness), not as a way of rule-keeping, but to be like your Father.
 
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Neogaia777

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19 Bible verses about God Judges The Wicked - Online Bible
19 Bible verses about God Judges The Wicked
"When I say to the wicked, 'You will surely die,' and you do not warn him or speak out to warn the wicked from his wicked way that he may live, that wicked man shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand.
It says "warn", not condemn to hell, cause that is not our place, etc...

Warn, yes, but automatically condemn with absolute certainty (to hell, etc) no... for if you do that you only condemn yourself...

And that is the Bible as well...

To judge with righteous judgment means not to ever judge hypocritically, which happens when and if you condemn someone or anyone else (to hell, etc) with 100% absolute certainty...

God Bless!
 
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