What is obedience to the gospel?

Hammster said:

Just read the book as whole and don’t try to find proof texts. That should clear it up.

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Read Acts of the Apostles 15:1, Acts of the Apostles 15:5, and Acts of the Apostles 15:24. It is clear that the counsel was addressing the heresy of Circumcision Salvationism. Paul also did, as well. Read Galatians 5:2.

Hammster said:

Why would He need to die for minor sins?

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Minor faults or transgressions or the sin that does not lead unto death is a bit of a mystery.
In either case, whether Christ died for these sins or not, the point here is that there is a sin that does not lead unto death (See again: 1 John 5:17).

Hammster said:

While circumcision certainly is in focus, it could have been anything that they added to Paul’s gospel. He was addressing grace+. Circumcision just happened to be that issue.

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No. They were saying that they needed to be circumcised FIRST in order to be saved. This is a replacement of the entrance of gate to being justified by faith in Jesus Christ. If circumcision is the basis for the foundation of one's faith, then it is a work, and not God's grace that one is standing upon.

Hammster said:

And what is that sin?

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I explained it in Post #66.

Hammster said:

It’s still gospel+ that he’s arguing against.

1 O foolish Galatians! Who has bewitched you? It was before your eyes that Jesus Christ was publicly portrayed as crucified.
2 Let me ask you only this: Did you receive the Spirit by works of the law or by hearing with faith?
3 Are you so foolish? Having begun by the Spirit, are you now being perfected by the flesh?
4 Did you suffer so many things in vain-if indeed it was in vain?
5 Does he who supplies the Spirit to you and works miracles among you do so by works of the law, or by hearing with faith-
6 just as Abraham "believed God, and it was counted to him as righteousness"? - Galatians 3:1-6

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Paul says,

"Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith? " (Galatians 3:2).

So again, they thought they had to be circumcised to be right with God.
In verse 3 Paul is criticizing them for their wrong stand or position. They think they are saved by circumcision first. When Paul says that what they have begun in the Spirit is a truth stated by him, but they think they need to be perfected by the work of circumcision and not by the hearing of faith in Jesus. A person is first saved by Jesus and not circumcision.

This was the heresy they were addressing:

"And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved." (Acts of the Apostles 15:1).

So this is the belief that the Jews were pushing on Christians and they were believing it.

Hammster said:

How much over the speed limit would be a sin?

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A topic for another thread. The point was not meant to be exhaustive. The point was to show that there is a difference between minor offenses (like parking tickets, etc.) and major crimes like murder, rape, theft, etc. Even our standard of law within our society that is sinful recognizes these differences. Jesus taught us by way of real world examples (i.e. parables). He illustrated spiritual truth by parables. So if your belief is true, then it should have real world examples to back it up. I am comfortable in my belief on this matter in the Scriptures that I can show you real world examples (parables) for it. Can you say the same?

Hammster said:

And you think you need work. So no difference.

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No. The difference is that work of circumcision is the foundation of one's salvation and not God's grace through faith in Jesus. Also, circumcision is not a part of any of the commands in the New Testament, either. It is a part of the Old Law and it is trying to take the place of faith in Jesus Christ. So yeah. There is a big difference.

One is God's grace through faith in Christ + works of faith (according to the commands in the NT) vs. Works Alone Salvationism without God's grace.

Hammster said:

There’s a difference in how those sins affect other people. There is no difference between consequences concerning God. If Christ died for the sin, it’s serious.

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Again, chapter and verse. Prove your case with the Bible.

bcbsr said:

Gal 5:24 "those who are Christ’s have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires."

"have crucified" is in the aorist past tense. It's not talking about an ongoing process. Those of use who are in Christ have crucified our flesh in that we reckon ourselves to be dead to sin but alive to God in Christ Jesus. (Rom 6:11) Since we're in Christ sin is an entity distinct from us and has no impact on our destiny. Unlike the theology of salvation-by-works Christians.

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So do you take this to mean that when a believer sins, they are not sinning because Christ died in their place, right? If so, the problem with this kind of view is that it is not consistent with the context.

Paul's point in leading up to Galatians 5:24 is dealing with crucifying the affections and lusts in the sense of putting sin away by overcoming it (Note: This would be putting away of grievous sin, like lying, lusting, hating, etc.). For Paul says that if we walk in the Spirit, we will not fulfill the lusts of the flesh (Galatians 5:16). Paul says that certain grievous sins can cause one not to inherit the Kingdom of God (Galatians 5:19-21). The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, etc. (Galatians 5:22-23). So the focus here is one's actions and it is not in some kind of sin and still be saved gospel concept (if that is what you are suggesting it is).

Romans 6:11 is also not suggesting that when a believer sins, he is not really sinning because Jesus paid the price for their sin. It is again talking about overcoming grievous sin.

This is also supported by the context.

For the next verse tells us not let sin reign in our body.
"Let not sin therefore reign in your mortal body, that ye should obey it in the lusts thereof."
(Romans 6:12).

You said:

You're interpreting the Bible to mean that salvation is contingent upon one's ongoing performance, which is salvation by works. This as opposed to salvation be a settled matter for those in faith as Jesus said, "I tell you the truth, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be condemned; he has crossed over from death to life." John 5:24

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This would be isolating one verse out of the Bible to support your own conclusions. Of course this is how one initially gets saved. A person first believes in Jesus to be saved, but the story does not end there. In John 8:47, Jesus says to the Jews:
“He that is of God heareth God's words: ye therefore hear them not, because ye are not of God.” (John 8:47). In other words, we have to obey God's words otherwise we are not of God.
This is what Jesus was teaching.

You said:

To view salvation as contingent upon works is a rejection of the gospel. It's essentially disobedience to the gospel. You're reading Rom 11:22 to be saying that salvation is contingent upon you doing good things, which is not what it's saying. "His goodness" is not referring to our goodness. But again your interpretation puts you squarely in the salvation by works category of Christian.

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This is what you have been taught. So this is all that you see. You see works as being bad in relation to being a part of God's good kingdom. But that is what Romans 11:22 says. Believers can be cut off if they do not continue in His goodness (God's goodness). I did not write that verse in the Bible. God inspired Paul to write it. You either believe it or you don't. It says just prior that we are to be not high minded but to fear. Again, fear would be a useless emotion to have in your belief. Yet, again, it is here in Romans 11 and in many other places in our Bible. Philippians 2:12 says to work out your salvation with fear and trembling. Why all the trembling if it is not talking about fear?

You said:

As for Heb 3:11-14 it seems to me that you yourself are calling for people to depart from the faith and put in its place your salvation by works theology. Heb 3:14 is talking about evidence that one has genuinely come to really trust in Christ and subsequently been made a partaker of Christ (like myself) in that they do persevere in their faith to the end, despite being exhorted by salvation by works Christians to depart from the faith.

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So you just ignore the part of the passage that says a believer's heart can be hardened by the deceitfulness of sin?

Also, Hebrews 10:26 says,
"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,"

But by what you said, you give me the impression that a believer can willfully sin and still be saved (Which runs contrary to this verse).

You said:

Heb 4:2 is about people like salvation by works Christians to whom I've preached the gospel of grace. But they reject it because of lack of faith on their part.

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Sorry, it does not say such a thing.
It says they did not mix in faith. This means they were all "Works Alone Salvationism" with no faith in God's grace. So no. You are not reading this verse right. If your view on this verse was correct, it would say nothing about mixing in faith at all. It would say that it should be faith alone in Christ is the only way and that works in any way is heresy. But of course if this was the case, then there would be a problem with the teachings of Jesus in Luke 10:25-28, and Matthew 19:17-19.

You said:

As for Mt 7:23 which you brought up Jesus says, "I never knew you". He doesn't say, "I used to know you, but then you lost your salvation". People who have come to know him do continue in the faith and lifestyle consistent with that faith. But what salvation by works Christians can't seem to get through their thick skulls is that they do so not in order to be saved nor to maintain their salvation status, but rather they do so because of the new creation.

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Now, I am not implying you believe this way personally, but have you considered that these believers who never known Jesus were the kind of believers who have always believed a gospel that justifies iniquity as a part of God's grace? They thought they could commit grievous sin (iniquity) and still be saved. So yes. They did good works, but they also worked iniquity, too. Again, Jesus did not say that one should have trusted in His finished work alone and not worry about iniquity or sin. Yet, Jesus says the opposite of that.

Your issue is with doing good works as a part of salvation, but Jesus said that the unprofitable servant will be cast into outer darkness (Matthew 25:30). So I am not sure what Bible you are reading.

In any event, may the Lord's goodness be upon you (even if we strongly disagree in regards to the Bible).