What is Christianity?

[MorkandMindy]

A person posting in another thread in the philosophy section mentioned:

'Christianity is frequently diametrically opposed to itself.'

so I was puzzled as to what the term 'Christianity' actually means - if anything.

 

[elman]

It refers to one who follows the command of Jesus to love your neighbor.

 

[MorkandMindy]

It refers to one who follows the command of Jesus to love your neighbor.

I like your response very much,

... and I wish our Christian President felt the same way about the rest of the World whom he claims are all against the US and therefore that we need lots of nuclear bombs to drop on them, and extra capacity B52s, and ten super carriers, and...

Which raises again the 'diametrically opposed' point:

American Christian Fundamentalists consider the teachings in the gospels to have been made to the Jews and therefore to be in the dispensation of law and not grace, and therefore do not accept them as a basis for doctrine.

 

[elman]

I like your response very much,

... and I wish our Christian President felt the same way about the rest of the World whom he claims are all against the US and therefore that we need lots of nuclear bombs to drop on them, and extra capacity B52s, and ten super carriers, and...

Which raises again the 'diametrically opposed' point:

American Christian Fundamentalists consider the teachings in the gospels to have been made to the Jews and therefore to be in the dispensation of law and not grace, and therefore do not accept them as a basis for doctrine.

The loss of 3000 people to the terrorists on 9/11 were not dreams of President Bush. The threat from the terrorist is real.

 

[MorkandMindy]

Also quoting from Crazy Fingers, there are a lot of non Christians who do follow the Golden Rule:

The first known enunciation of the Golden Rule is from around 4500 years ago by the Mesopotamian King Ur-Nammu.

After that it’s found in ancient Hindu texts. The Brahman version dating back to 1000 BCE was
"This is the sum of duty: Do naught unto others which would cause you pain done unto you."

In the 5th century BCE Socrates said
"Do not do to others that which would anger you if others did it to you."

In the 4th century BCE Plato said
"May I do to others as I would that they should do unto me."

One of my favorite versions is from Confucius in 500 BCE
"Do unto another what you would have him do unto you, and do not do unto another what you would not have him do unto you. Thou needest this law alone. It is the foundation of all the rest."

This is what Aristotle said
"We should conduct ourselves toward others as we would have them act toward us."

According to ancient Roman Paganism it's
"The law imprinted on the hearts of all men is to love the members of society as themselves."

Under Taoism it's:
"Regard your neighbor's gain as your own gain, and your neighbor's loss as your own loss."

Under Buddhism
“Hurt not others with that which pains yourself.”

Native American spirituality
“All things are our relatives; what we do to everything, we do to ourselves. All is really One."

More close to home, in Judaism it's
"What is hateful to you, do not to your fellow man. This is the law: all the rest is commentary."

Under Islam it’s
“No one of you is a believer until he desires for his brother that which he desires for himself.”

And finally in the New Testament, around 70 CE Matthew wrote:
"Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets."

Those quotes are all different ways to say the same thing. The Golden Rule is simple and universal to nearly all beliefs.

I think that it's safe to say that there will never be agreement on which religions are true and which are false or if any are true at all. But I hope that we can agree that a more universal acceptance of the Golden Rule would make this world a much better place and help to bring us together.

It serves to bind us together because if I know that my neighbor will cause me no harm I have no reason to fear or hate him. The first step to unity is the lack of fear.

But in the end there will still be differences of opinion. Thomas Jefferson once said
"it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods, or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg."

With the Golden Rule, we can live happily with our differences.

 

[MorkandMindy]

"It refers to one who follows the command of Jesus to love your neighbor."

In short, one concern I have about this definition is that it is:

common to many religions, and would be expected within any life form where the community had a genetic relationship, and many where there was none if a reciprocal relationship existed between 'neighbours', so it would be expected to exist in some non human communities, so I'm not sure how to use it as a definition for Christianity specifically.

 

[MorkandMindy]

I’ll explain how I got into this quandary:

DEFINITION OF CHRISTIANITY TAKE 1
It is a belief system based on the teachings of Jesus Christ

CHALLENGE
Which teachings, can you be specific?

TAKE 2
It is a belief system based on statements recorded in the gospels accredited to Jesus Christ.

CHALLENGE
American Christian Fundamentalists consider the teachings in the gospels to have been made to the Jews and therefore to be in the dispensation of law and not grace, and therefore do not accept them as a basis for doctrine.

Can we have a definition that covers Christianity in a broader way?

TAKE 3
Christianity is a belief that God defined as creator of the Universe, consists of three persons; Father, Son and Holy Spirit, where Father is law giver among other things, son is the man Jesus Christ and the Word of God, and Holy Spirit is the means of salvation and edification among other things.

CHALLENGE
There are many non trinitarian Christians, evidently Christianity does not have to include trinitarianism.

I feel stupid that I can't answer this simple question.

TAKE 4
I give up, I'll ask the audience, they're all Christians, lets see if any of them know what their religion is

 

[elman]

"It refers to one who follows the command of Jesus to love your neighbor."

In short, one concern I have about this definition is that it is:

common to many religions, and would be expected within any life form where the community had a genetic relationship, and many where there was none if a reciprocal relationship existed between 'neighbours', so it would be expected to exist in some non human communities, so I'm not sure how to use it as a definition for Christianity specifically.

Yes it is common to other religions, but it is not central in those religions. Jesus said it summed up the law of God. He said it was what was important at the last judgment.

 

[elman]

TAKE 2
It is a belief system based on statements recorded in the gospels accredited to Jesus Christ.

CHALLENGE
American Christian Fundamentalists consider the teachings in the gospels to have been made to the Jews and therefore to be in the dispensation of law and not grace, and therefore do not accept them as a basis for doctrine.

I don't think that is accurate and even if it is I don't agree with it.

Can we have a definition that covers Christianity in a broader way?

Mine was very broad.

 

[MorkandMindy]

Yes it is common to other religions, but it is not central in those religions. Jesus said it summed up the law of God. He said it was what was important at the last judgment.

Any belief system with 'love your neighbor as yourself as the core element would be Christian? By that definition humanism is Christian and the Inquisition and witchcraft trials are not.

I agree.

I don't think the others have read their Bibles in a sufficiently receptive way.

 

[MorkandMindy]

It refers to one who follows the command of Jesus to love your neighbor.

I think you have put a profound truth in a very simple way.
I'll expand it and see if that is what you meant.

What does the term ‘God’ when used by Christians actually mean?

'He who has seen me has seen the father'
So all we can know about God is present in a man, Jesus Christ.

Now we have a problem because even if he did exist it was thousands of years ago.
Christians claim there is a record of his life and deeds and that tells us what we need to know.
So according to a gospel what sort of life does God want us to live?

Mark 12.29"The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.[e] 30Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'[f] 31The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'[g]There is no commandment greater than these."

And in other texts it is stated that ‘to love God is to obey his commandments’, so the first commandment means to obey the second, so there is really only one commandment; to love your fellow man.

I seem to recall a text that says ‘how can you claim to love the God you have not seen when you do not love the man you have seen’ or something like that, puts the same idea more clearly.


I would conclude that as far as humans are concerned the term ‘God’ means that we are to love one another.


(Yes, I know the Judeao Christian God was also creator, but that is a bit more difficult to relate to and this 'post quick reply' has to end somewhere)

 

[elman]

Any belief system with 'love your neighbor as yourself as the core element would be Christian? By that definition humanism is Christian and the Inquisition and witchcraft trials are not.

I agree.

I don't think the others have read their Bibles in a sufficiently receptive way.

 

[elman]

I think you have put a profound truth in a very simple way.
I'll expand it and see if that is what you meant.

What does the term ‘God’ when used by Christians actually mean?

'He who has seen me has seen the father'
So all we can know about God is present in a man, Jesus Christ.

Now we have a problem because even if he did exist it was thousands of years ago.
Christians claim there is a record of his life and deeds and that tells us what we need to know.
So according to a gospel what sort of life does God want us to live?

Mark 12.29"The most important one," answered Jesus, "is this: 'Hear, O Israel, the Lord our God, the Lord is one.[e] 30Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.'[f] 31The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'[g]There is no commandment greater than these."

And in other texts it is stated that ‘to love God is to obey his commandments’, so the first commandment means to obey the second, so there is really only one commandment; to love your fellow man.

I seem to recall a text that says ‘how can you claim to love the God you have not seen when you do not love the man you have seen’ or something like that, puts the same idea more clearly.


I would conclude that as far as humans are concerned the term ‘God’ means that we are to love one another.


(Yes, I know the Judeao Christian God was also creator, but that is a bit more difficult to relate to and this 'post quick reply' has to end somewhere)

You are talking about First John. We also have Paul saying in 1 Cor 13, faith without love is worthless. James said it another way, faith without works is dead.

 

[iannassah]

Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Rom 3:24being justified freely by His grace (undeserved favor) through the redemption (Christ's blood pays for our sins )that is in Christ Jesus,
Rom 3:25whom God set forth as a propitiation (by his becoming our substitute and assuming our obligations he expiated our guilt, covered it, by the vicarious punishment which he endured.) by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness , because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed,
Rom 3:26to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness (how we are reconciled to God/forgiven), that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Rom 3:27Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith.
Rom 3:28Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith apart from the deeds of the law.


Rom 6:23For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Rom 6:9knowing that Christ, having been raised from the dead, dies no more. Death no longer has dominion over Him.
Rom 6:10For the death that He died, He died to sin once for all; but the life that He lives, He lives to God.
Rom 6:11Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Rom 6:12Therefore do not let sin reign in your mortal body, that you should obey it in its lusts.
Rom 6:13And do not present your members as instruments of unrighteousness to sin, but present yourselves to God as being alive from the dead, and your members as instruments of righteousness to God.
Rom 6:14For sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace.
Rom 6:15What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not!

 

[iannassah]

Christians are not perfect, but, we are forgiven. We will make mistakes. However there are people that call themselves Christians but don't talk, act or think like a Christian out to.
Here is a parable to hopefully get the point across about true Christians and those who say they are Christians and really aren't. Just to give you a head up, "tares" look like wheat until they are full grown---they are actually poisonous. Which is the same effect that false Christians have---they are used to poison unbeliever's hearts & minds against God!
"Another parable He put forth to them, saying: "The kingdom of heaven (Jesus) is like a man who sowed good seed in his field;
"but while men slept (while Jesus is gone), his enemy (satan) came and sowed tares (false Christians) among the wheat (true Christians) and went his way.
"But when the grain had sprouted and produced a crop (Christians sharing the Gospel & people accepting the salvation that God has provided through Jesus Christ), then the tares also appeared (the false Christians can be seen but say that they are Christians).
"So the servants of the owner came and said to him, 'Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?'
"He said to them, 'An enemy has done this.' The servants said to him, 'Do you want us then to go and gather them up?'
"But he said, 'No, lest while you gather up the tares you also uproot the wheat with them.
'Let both grow together until the harvest (until Christ comes back), and at the time of harvest I will say to the reapers (angels), "First gather together the tares and bind them in bundles to burn them (in hell), but gather the wheat into my barn."'"
Matthew 13:24-26

The "tares," or false Christians, are used by the bad guy to keep you and many other people away from God and salvation. satan hates and the human race & will use any means necessary to destroy us spiritually. Didn't he tempt Eve? he obviously didn't have good intentions towards man in the beginning and he hasn't changed---God longs for us to have a personal relationship with Him. Christians have that personal relationship with God because they have accepted what God has done for them.... God can be hurt if someone ends up in hell where they would be eternally separated from Him.

 

[plmarquette]

Christ - the greek word for Messiah , the anointed one , from Isaiah 61.1-3 , we as Christians are little anointed ones .. empowered by the Holy Spirit to demonstrate the love of Christ-Jesus , the 11th commandment , love as God loves (agapo).

back in the day there were Pharisees, Saducees, Scribes ... religious men , who had their agenda: power , prestige , postion , authority ... which differed from that of God ... love, grace, mercy, patience , endurance, assistance , empathy

there are people who profess to be christians but wish to superimpose their agenda atop of God's plan ... just like the religous men of old ...

there are those who believe they are of God , but are not born again of water and spirit ... know of him, but do not have a relationship with him

and there are those who know and serve him ...