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What is Charismatic?
- Thread starter Dominus Fidelis
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victoryword
Senior Veteran
One who believes that the Charismata as taught in 1 Cor. 12 is for today and are usually allowing God to use them in it.Defens0rFidei said:What does Charismatic Christian mean?
Thanks!
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a non-ceasationist... we believe the gifts of the Holy Spirt, such as tongues, prophesy, healing, etc. did not cease once the original disciples passed... that the Holy Spirit is still able to work/speak through believers today 
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I can't, but God can.... the disciples healed people, it wasn't really them doing it, but the Holy Spirits power through them.Defens0rFidei said:
I would say it's similar with doctors also... they have God given skills they use to heal people... but even still, it's only God who heals... he uses doctors and medicine as his tools to heal sometimes.
note: I am not into the whole 'word of faith' thing... I don't believe someone who hasn't received healing lacks faith... I believe regardless of whether it comes through prayer and laying on of hands or through modern medicine (doctors, surgeries, medications, etc) that it's God who heals... I don't beleive someone will be healed, even by medical means unless it's Gods will.
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victoryword
Senior Veteran
Was that even necessary to say?OnederWoman said:
I am not into the whole "Vineyard" thing but I did not see anyone asking about them in particular.
I am not into the whole "Third Wave" thing but again I did not see anyone asking about them in particular.
Neither am I into the whole "Prophetic Movement," "Present Truth Movement," "Apostolic Movement," "Deliverance" or any of the other fringe aspects of the Charismatic movement. But since no one asked about it I did not find it necessary.
Wouldn't we get along better if the Faith Movement wasn't continually flamed as the bad boys of the movement?
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Since your Profile indicates your are, Catholic, you might be more comfortable reading about Charismatic issues from a Charismatic Catholic site.Defens0rFidei said:What does Charismatic Christian mean?
Thanks!
Follow the LINK >> http://religion-cults.com/spirit/charisms.htm
[despite the site name, this link is PRO Catholic and written by Catholics to Catholics and is FAVORABLE to the Charismatics within that faith.]
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YIKES!! first let me say that its not MAN that does the healing but God, and that not everyone who is a charismatic has the gift of healing, but we do believe in healing and there are those whom God uses to heal people.Defens0rFidei said:
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http://ccc.garg.com/ - The catholic Charismatic Center
http://www.franciscanconferences.com/confdetails.asp?ConferenceID=31
http://www.dljc.org/
http://www.franciscanconferences.com/confdetails.asp?ConferenceID=31
http://www.dljc.org/
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There are problems with the WoF movement and people are not inclined to be identified with them.victoryword said:
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victoryword
Senior Veteran
There are problems in all of the movements I mentioned but as I stated earlier, they were not part of the discussion. None of them should have been mentioned including WoF. The question was concerning Charismatics and healing. That is what we should have stuck to.Br. Max said:
Every thread need not tunr into an occasion for WoF bashing or even to insert one's opinion on WoF.
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welp, look at it this way - if your right, Scripture tell us that blessed are those who are persecuted for the sake of Jesus Christ. If you are wrong, I've got this pole I need you to stand next to . . . . Yea I know there are an awful lot of logs stacked at the base of this pole . . . . just stand there for a second . . . WHo has the matches??
You are right though we should stick to the topic but there is nothing wrong with identifying who you agree with and who you disagree with. For myself I have to say that there are many "Pentecostal" churches that I will distance myself from. They claim to have the spirit of God and practice such things as the "baptism of laughter."
You are right though we should stick to the topic but there is nothing wrong with identifying who you agree with and who you disagree with. For myself I have to say that there are many "Pentecostal" churches that I will distance myself from. They claim to have the spirit of God and practice such things as the "baptism of laughter."
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Gosh there are also "problems" with the Catholic faith (like Mary being sinless to her being the Ark of the New Covenant to purgatory), there are also "problems" with dead denominational churches that keep the Holy Spirit out of their doors and reject His gifts and moves calling them demonic, and there are "problems" with Messianic Judaism and Orthodox churches that still mix law and grace....
so what is your point? you are simply hitting out at denominations that dont believe the way you do.
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If only they would observe the rules:
3) Non-Charismatic members can only post fellowship posts here or posts to ask a question regarding Charismatic or Pentecostal doctrine. Once the question is answered, there shall be no debate over the answer in this forum by the Non-Charismatic. Any debate posts by Non-Charismatics will be deleted or moved to the Interdenominational Doctrine Debate forum. In other words, only Charismatic members can debate here.
5) No posts that denigrate a Christian denomination or Christian group including the Catholic church will be tolerated - these will be deleted and the poster will be warned.
Not allowed: "Word of Faith preachers are false prophets"
Allowed: "The Word of Faith movement have gone too far in certain instances" - as long as scripture and evidence is posted to argue this.
Where are the scriptures and evidence. quit giving us your opinions.
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SoliDeoGloria
Active Member
Hmm...as a believer in the Lord Jesus Christ, and nurtured in the Protestant heritage of classical Pentecostalism, I guess I would qualify in participating in this threads..?
Of course, that does not mean I wholly subcribe to Charismatism now, albeit grown out of the faith of my youth.
Hmm..
There is a slight distinction that has to be recognized between a Pentecostal and a Charismatic.
Pentecostalism is a denomination as well as a Christian tradition within itself, sprouting out of the Holiness movement in the late 1890s. Even within the Holiness movement, there has already a prevailing belief in a second and separate experience of sanctification, apart from salvation. The Holiness people do not adhere to the typical Christian belief of progressive sanctification, but of a once and for all separate experience which would sanctify the believer. This notion had been held since the times of the Great Awakening, and when the Methodist movement arose.
This becomes a precursor to the classical theology of Pentecostalism, which emphasized the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, a separate experience apart from salvation which would grant the believer power and passion. Charles Parham, a minister who founded a Bible school in the late 1890s and whose initial class introduced the world the experience of tongues; asked his class to do a research into the evidence of the Spirit Baptism. Using the Thompson-Chain Reference method (which was in vogue in those days), his students supposedly found out that "tongues" was the initial evidence, after reading the Book of Acts. One of Parham's students, one Agnes, spake in tongues during a class session...that was the first known account of tongues in modern times (apart from the Montanists, Moravians, and the Irvingites).
Then in 1906 - 7, William J. Seymour, in his Asuza Street church, led a group to experience a revival of the Holy Spirit which had come to be known as the Asuza Street Revival, a milestone in Pentecostal history. From that time on, Pentecostalism as a movement grew, and became a denomination eventually, with the conception of the Assemblies of God, which is one of the first Pentecostal denominations.
Now, Charismatism is actually neo-Pentecostalism, an offshoot from the classical Pentecostalism. It arose as a inter-denominational movement in the 1960s, when an episcopalian priest started to emphasise the Spirit Baptism even in the mainline Protestant churches.
Charismatism is not so rigid in its understanding of tongues and baptism, and it is more of a religious sociological movement than a denominational tradition. It emphasizes the gifts of the Spirit (the non-cessationist theory of the gifts) in practice.
Then in the 1980s, the "Third Wave" (as labeled by Dr. Peter Wagner of Fuller Theological Seminary) was conceived, with the likes of John Wimber taking the reins and introducing "Power Evangelism" into contemporary Christendom. This third offshoot acknowledges the other gifts of the Spirit as plausible evidences of the Spirit Baptism, not necessarily tongues per se.
Within the Charismatic movement, there are many variances as well, many of the contemporary movements include the Church Growth movement started by Donald McGravan, the Spiritual Warfare movement by Peter Wagner, Word-Faith movement by Kenneth Hagin (the true founding father being E.W Kenyon), which sprouts the prosperity teachings of more extreme Faith teachers such as Fred Price.
What is a Charismatic Christian..?
Simply, someone who subscribes to the Baptism of the Spirit, a tongues-speaker, and a non-cessationist. But even within Charismatism, there would be many other variances as well.
Of course, that does not mean I wholly subcribe to Charismatism now, albeit grown out of the faith of my youth.
Hmm..
There is a slight distinction that has to be recognized between a Pentecostal and a Charismatic.
Pentecostalism is a denomination as well as a Christian tradition within itself, sprouting out of the Holiness movement in the late 1890s. Even within the Holiness movement, there has already a prevailing belief in a second and separate experience of sanctification, apart from salvation. The Holiness people do not adhere to the typical Christian belief of progressive sanctification, but of a once and for all separate experience which would sanctify the believer. This notion had been held since the times of the Great Awakening, and when the Methodist movement arose.
This becomes a precursor to the classical theology of Pentecostalism, which emphasized the Baptism of the Holy Spirit, a separate experience apart from salvation which would grant the believer power and passion. Charles Parham, a minister who founded a Bible school in the late 1890s and whose initial class introduced the world the experience of tongues; asked his class to do a research into the evidence of the Spirit Baptism. Using the Thompson-Chain Reference method (which was in vogue in those days), his students supposedly found out that "tongues" was the initial evidence, after reading the Book of Acts. One of Parham's students, one Agnes, spake in tongues during a class session...that was the first known account of tongues in modern times (apart from the Montanists, Moravians, and the Irvingites).
Then in 1906 - 7, William J. Seymour, in his Asuza Street church, led a group to experience a revival of the Holy Spirit which had come to be known as the Asuza Street Revival, a milestone in Pentecostal history. From that time on, Pentecostalism as a movement grew, and became a denomination eventually, with the conception of the Assemblies of God, which is one of the first Pentecostal denominations.
Now, Charismatism is actually neo-Pentecostalism, an offshoot from the classical Pentecostalism. It arose as a inter-denominational movement in the 1960s, when an episcopalian priest started to emphasise the Spirit Baptism even in the mainline Protestant churches.
Charismatism is not so rigid in its understanding of tongues and baptism, and it is more of a religious sociological movement than a denominational tradition. It emphasizes the gifts of the Spirit (the non-cessationist theory of the gifts) in practice.
Then in the 1980s, the "Third Wave" (as labeled by Dr. Peter Wagner of Fuller Theological Seminary) was conceived, with the likes of John Wimber taking the reins and introducing "Power Evangelism" into contemporary Christendom. This third offshoot acknowledges the other gifts of the Spirit as plausible evidences of the Spirit Baptism, not necessarily tongues per se.
Within the Charismatic movement, there are many variances as well, many of the contemporary movements include the Church Growth movement started by Donald McGravan, the Spiritual Warfare movement by Peter Wagner, Word-Faith movement by Kenneth Hagin (the true founding father being E.W Kenyon), which sprouts the prosperity teachings of more extreme Faith teachers such as Fred Price.
What is a Charismatic Christian..?
Simply, someone who subscribes to the Baptism of the Spirit, a tongues-speaker, and a non-cessationist. But even within Charismatism, there would be many other variances as well.
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Bruce S said:
Thanks, that was informative.
Is there some evidence for these claims of supernatural gifts actually being observed?
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When the Charismatic movement won recognition by Paul VI there were documented miracles presented.Defens0rFidei said:
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