What is Charismatic, and why specify Spirit-Filled?

[leferowe]

Please note that I'm in no way trying to start a debate! This is an honest curiosity - I'm new to the faith, so I'm not very educated regarding the various terms. I'm not trying to imply hostility, disbelief or disapproval in any way, shape or form.

What does it mean to be a charismatic Christian, exactly? Does it simply mean one who is good with words and good with people? If so, then wouldn't the title of charismatic be in the eye of the beholder, and not the right of the person toting the title to present it to themselves?

I thought that all Christians were spirit-filled. Indeed, when I first prayed to Jesus and ask him to take my sins, I also asked him to fill me with the Holy Spirit. I've always believed that he did so, but here I see a specification for those who are 'spirit-filled' - does this mean that many Christians, in fact, do not have the Holy Spirit within them?

 

[LinkH]

'Charismatic' comes from the Greek word 'charismata' which means 'gifts.' The singular is 'charisma.' This is often translated as 'spiritual gifts' and the word 'charisma' is related to the Greek word 'charis' which means 'grace.'

In the Bible, 'charismata' refers to spiritual gifts like those listed in I Corinthians 12 or Romans 12. Somewhere along the line in history, the word 'charisma' came to be used to describe personality and leadership traits, apparently under the assumption that certain leaders had a divine gift for it. But this is a different meaning of 'charismatic'. It is not the sense that the word is used in when referring to churches.

A Charismatic church is a church that believes in and/or ooperates in certain gifts of the Spirit, for example prophecy, tongues, healing, miracles, words of knowledge, words of wisdom, and other spiritual gifts.

Typically Charismatics believe that the baptism with the Holy Spirit is available for believers after salvation. For more information about this read Acts 2, 8, 10, 11, and 19. A typical Charismatic belief is that all true believers have the earnest (downpayment) or seal of the Spirit, but that not all believers are filled with the Holy Spirit. Many Charismatics believe that Holy Spirit baptism is (or can be) accompanied by the evidence of speaking in other tongues as in some of the passages mentioned above.

Believe it or not, there are some Christians who do not believe that God does actual miracles through people anymore like He did in the Bible. People who believe that way are called cessationists.

 

[nephilimiyr]

Good answer LinkH. That takes care of the charismatic part of the question. As for Spirit-filled, after 3 years of being active in this sub-forum the use of the term Spirit-filled concerning the title for this sub-forum forum still baffles me. Escentially you are right leferowe about the meaning, however I would say any born again person is Spirit-filled. that means anyone who has accepted Jesus Christ as their personal Lord and savior. However, that doesn't mean anyone claiming that is allowed to debate in this forum, and or considered a member of this congregational forum. You have to believe in what LinkH said in his post.

 

[leferowe]

Thank you both for responding. It's both clarified the title of the sub-forum for me, and led to further confusion.

Given the answers I've been given, it seems as though one cannot believe oneself to be charismatic unless they attend a charismatic church and/or have been baptised in the Holy Spirit - does another person have to baptise one in the Holy Spirit for that to be seen as charismatic, or can a person do that themself? How does one know if their church is charismatic? Both churches I've visited have talks about the gifts of the Spirit - and both were of different denominations.

 

[nephilimiyr]

Concerning wanting to know about whether a church is charismatic, if they believe the Spiritual gifts that are listed in 1 Cor. 12 are still in operation today and God gives them freely to those who seek them then they are charismatic. Also, charismatic is a term to describe a movement not a church or denomination, so yes, you will find many different churches and denominations that are charismatic.

As for Holy Spirit baptism being a necessity, that is debateable but I think you'll find the majority of charismatic people believe that, for instance, the gift of speaking in tongues will come during the Holy Spirit baptism or afterwards. The belief is that the Holy Spirit baptism makes it posible for you to experience these gifts, but not everyone agrees with that.

 

[leferowe]

Thanks. C:

So is it a charismatic belief that the tongues being mentioned are a language impossible for us to understand, or that it's actually communicating in other worldly languages? Or, does it vary from charismatic Christian to charismatic Christian?

 

[nephilimiyr]

Some charismatics believe that the speaking in tongues is speaking in another language of the world, others, like myself, believe it is a language that no one understands. It's sometimes refered to as the language of angels. Also it can be refered to as a pray language. So yes, the belief in it and what it actually is varies.

 

[leferowe]

Thank you. I don't think that I have any more questions regarding this.

 

[meerkat]

I'd go along with the definitions as per the churches but there is a personal deifinition as well and that is someone who is free in their style oif worship, can be free expressive in dancing, lifing arms, using flags, streamers and staffs and anything else the Spirit moves them to use. Contemporary music is often de riguer as is praying in tounges and being 'in the spirit'. In short, almost anything goes. My church encompasses all those things and worship time generally ranges from quiet, contemplative prayer and singing (ever heard a congregation singing in toungues - it's heavenly!) to joyful and exuberant worship. This si where I meet my God!

 

[leferowe]

Your church sounds amazing, Meerkat.

 

[JimB]

Please note that I'm in no way trying to start a debate! This is an honest curiosity - I'm new to the faith, so I'm not very educated regarding the various terms. I'm not trying to imply hostility, disbelief or disapproval in any way, shape or form.

What does it mean to be a charismatic Christian, exactly? Does it simply mean one who is good with words and good with people? If so, then wouldn't the title of charismatic be in the eye of the beholder, and not the right of the person toting the title to present it to themselves?

I thought that all Christians were spirit-filled. Indeed, when I first prayed to Jesus and ask him to take my sins, I also asked him to fill me with the Holy Spirit. I've always believed that he did so, but here I see a specification for those who are 'spirit-filled' - does this mean that many Christians, in fact, do not have the Holy Spirit within them?

Thanks for this, Leferowe. You point up an interesting fact. We love wearing titles. But all they are good for is keeping us separated, us vs. them. I a Charismatic and they are, ugh!, cessationist. I am Spirit-“filled”; they are Spirit-empty. I am “Full”-Gospel; they are, well, Half-Gospel. I am better than thou.

Of course, wearing a title means nothing. You can claim anything and you can wear any title you choose. You can boast of believing in healing the sick but if you don’t heal the sick, so what? You can go to a church that believes in casting out devils but if you don’t do it, what makes you any better than those who don’t believe in it? Being a spectator and being a player are two different things. Just hanging around the team does not make you a player—a spectator, maybe, but not necessarily a participant.

You are right about been filled with the Spirit when you were saved. Every believer was filled with the Spirit the moment they were saved because 2 Peter 1.3; Ephesians 1.3 says so. But being filled with the Spirit is a continuing thing. It’s like gasoline; the more use it the more you need refilled. God fills you when you need it, He fills you to use you when you are available for service; not to make you or your group superior to other believers. Being Spirit-filled is not just a label we wear.

In fact, wearing an SF/PC label means absolutely nothing. Successfully arguing a theological position (which we do a lot of in these SF/PC forums) means nothing. IMO, there are just as many hearers but not doers of the Word among those who call themselves “Spirit-filled” as there is in any other group.

Thanks for the thread.

~Jim

Church is the only society on earth that exists for the benefit of non-members.​

 

[SharonL]

Hi leferowe:

First off - I am so happy to see you searching at such a young age. I missed the joy of being Spirit Filled most of my life - although I was a Christian all my life.

Spirit Filled means a beautiful powerful personal relationship with God.

When a person is saved they have the Holy Spirit - they are not lacking - however I don't know how to explain it, but I received the anointing where my walk became more powerful and my life has never been the same.

I saw a friend of mine that had such a beautiful walk with Jesus that I wanted it - I started searching - I was reading a book 'In the shadow of His Hand' about a preacher searching for the Holy Spirit - I just put the book down and said "God if this is of you - I want it." The Holy Spirit fell on me so strong and my prayer language came forth and for 3-1/2 hours I worshiped with the presence of the Lord that I did not feel like I was in this world.

There are two kinds of tongues - one is your prayer language that is just between you and God - does not need an interpretation - the other is when the Lord brings a Word to the church or a gathering and it must have an interpreter or it is not of God.

Once you become Spirit Filled, the church you go to is not the leading factor in your life - the Holy Spirit will guide you and you do not need a label of a denomination - you follow the leading of the Holy Spirit - your prayers become more powerful, your walk is closer, you actually know that what God said in the Bible that He would never leave you is very powerful - you feel the presence of the Holy Spirit at all times.

It is different for each person - God knows our hearts and the hunger we have - just draw closer to Him, place your hand in the hand of Jesus and ask the Holy Spirit to guide you.

You will be just fine, just don't let the different denominations confuse you - everyone has their own opinion - the only leading you need is the Holy Spirit and He will tell you if you are going in the wrong direction.

Blessings and you will be a great light for the Love of God.

 

[irenemcg]

Thank you both for responding. It's both clarified the title of the sub-forum for me, and led to further confusion.

Given the answers I've been given, it seems as though one cannot believe oneself to be charismatic unless they attend a charismatic church and/or have been baptised in the Holy Spirit - does another person have to baptise one in the Holy Spirit for that to be seen as charismatic, or can a person do that themself? How does one know if their church is charismatic? Both churches I've visited have talks about the gifts of the Spirit - and both were of different denominations.

Mat 3:11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.


Jesus is the baptizer of the Holy Spirit and fire. You can be baptized with the Spirit anywhere when you seek more of the Lord and allow the Hly spirit more sway in your life. Often this happens in church after a time of worship and a message and others may lay hands on you to receive a baptism in the Spirit but it can happen in your own prayer closet when you spend time with the Lord.

This is not about a denomination. People of many denominations move in the gifts of the Spirit.

 

[banish'd]

leferowe,

I am an older "word of faith" charismatic, and I plan to stick with it. However, there is something new happening with the young charismatics, and it's called, "Presence". Well known pastors like Dutch Sheets and Bentley are preaching about, "I come into your Presence".

I am posting a YouTube with music that is simular to Presence worship. Listen to it and let the Holy Spirit guide you. Shut your eyes and lift your hands slightly. Is that how you want to worship, or do you prefer the traditional worship while singing in the Spirit? I do both, but prefer the traditional.

YouTube - Vineyard Music - My Everything

 

[banish'd]

leferowe,

Okay, here is the traditional word of faith, while singing in the Spirit and praying in the Spirit, plus prophesy at the end. They keep singing "Even so, come Lord Jesus", which is the second to the last verse in Revelation.

"He which testifieth these things saith, Surely I come quickly. Amen. Even so, come, Lord Jesus." (Revelation 22:20)


YouTube - Terry MacAlmon - Even so

 

[JimfromOhio]

According to the Greek word charisma, we have received grace gifts. We are free in God's grace and empowered by the Holy Spirit to do right, to look at these others in a condescending way.

There are alot of debates relating to Charismatic doctrines. Spirit-filled-Charismatic section is VERY diverse with all forms of denominations and movements with different doctrinal views. To be spirit-filled, because the Spirit indwells us as Christians, we ought to daily live a Spirit-controlled and empowered life. God wants us to be busy rejoicing in the gracious prospect of all opportunities of God's will. Those charismatics who knows what it means to be charismatics emphasize that the purpose of spiritual gifts is to build up the church and enrich worship of God, not to gratify the individual.

Jesus said:
John 6:63
It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.

Romans 8:2
For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus has made me free from the law of sin and death.

All Christians are to live in spirit as Paul wrote "If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit." (Galatians 5:25).

At time of our salvation, in Spirit (in Christ), we all have the SAME faith. First Corinthians 12:9 says "To another faith by the same Spirit." The Bible clearly says that all Christians are a body of believers indwelt by the Spirit (1 Cor. 12:13).

 

[LinkH]

Thanks. C:

So is it a charismatic belief that the tongues being mentioned are a language impossible for us to understand, or that it's actually communicating in other worldly languages? Or, does it vary from charismatic Christian to charismatic Christian?

Charismatics will differ on this. Also, my statements about charismatic beliefs also apply to most Pentecostal groups. Pentecostals are from older groups associated with revivals that took place around the beginning of the 20th century. The Charismatic movement swept through the 'mainline denominations' in the 60's and 70's when people began to experience baptism with the Holy Spirit, speaking in tongues, and other gifts in these churches. Then Charismatic denominations and independant churches started to form.

Also, we don't baptize each other in the Holy Spirit. According to the prophecy of John the Baptist, Jesus baptizes in the Holy Ghost. Pastors, evangelists, other preachers or just someone who has received it will lay hands on another person and pray for that person to receive the baptism of the Holy Spirit.

There are many independant Charismatic churches and various Pentecostal and Charismatic denominations.