What is a Christian Deist?

[Speedwell]

As to verbal plenary inspiration: faith comes by hearing, and hearing comes by the word of God.

No word of God = no faith = no Heaven.

Plenary verbal inspiration wasn't invented until abut a century ago. What did Christians do before that?

 

[AV1611VET]

Plenary verbal inspiration wasn't invented until abut a century ago. What did Christians do before that?

Believed in verbal plenary inspiration.

Where did Australians live before Australia was discovered?

 

[Albion]

Believed in verbal plenary inspiration.

That's approximately what I was thinking.

 

[Speedwell]

Believed in verbal plenary inspiration.

No, they believed something else. Most Christians still do believe something else. Plenary verbal inspiration is the recent invention of a 19th century Protestant novelty sect.

 

[AV1611VET]

No, they believed something else.

What?

 

[cre8id]

What Episcopalians will get up to these days is hard to predict. Many people feel that they are on the tipping point of not being Anglicans at all.

Spong's case is interesting, though. He was raised a strict Fundamentalist Protestant and subject within that context to physical abuse. I think of him as PTSD victim and am not surprised that he threw doctrine overboard and became a mystic. And don't forget, we are saved by faith, not the precision of our doctrine--at least I assume this conversation is about whether Spong is justified in naming himself a Christian, not whether he is saved.

Spong is a flagrant heretic!

The "precision of our doctrine" has a lot to do whether one is a true Christian or not. One's faith is no better or worse than the object of one's faith... the what or who they place their faith in. Scripture tells us "there are many false Christs". A false Christ cannot save anyone! If one believes in a false Christ, they are not saved! Period! That is why doctrines are divided into Primary Essential Doctrines and Secondary Non-essential doctrines. It also why knowing and understanding the essentials of Christianity is so important!

Here is the Nicean Creed from an Anglican website for reference:
Anglicans Online | The Nicene Creed

 

[Speedwell]

Spong is a flagrant heretic!

The "precision of our doctrine" has a lot to do whether one is a true Christian or not. One's faith is no better or worse than the object of one's faith... or what or who they place their faith in. Scripture tells us "there are many false Christs". A false Christ cannot save anyone! If one believes in a false Christ, they are not saved! Period! That is why doctrines are divided into Primary Essential Doctrines and Secondary Non-essential doctrines. It also why knowing and understanding the essentials of Christianity is so important!

Well, you'd better get the tongs hot and the oil boiling.

 

[Albion]

Spong is a flagrant heretic!

Many would agree. However, he's not a cultist. (and don't make out that I'm a fan of the bishop; it's just a matter of definition).

 

[cre8id]

Well, you'd better get the tongs hot and the oil boiling.

Not my job! Jesus will actually judge his soul. But I am told to discern what people say and believe and test it against scripture. Spong believes in a false Christ and therefore a false God therefore he is unsaved. He can call himself a Christian all he wants, but, there is an old saying that one cannot make a silk purse put of a sow's ear!

 

[Speedwell]

Here is the Nicean Creed from an Anglican website for reference:
Anglicans Online | The Nicene Creed

Thanks, but though it may come as a surprise to you I already have a copy of it and having sworn to it every Sunday for the past sixty years I even know it by heart.

 

[Albion]

But you haven't been reciting THAT (lame-o) version for sixty years.

 

[cre8id]

Thanks, but though it may come as a surprise to you I already have a copy of it and having sworn to it every Sunday for the past sixty years I even know it by heart.

Then you already know Spong and others like him are heretics!

 

[Speedwell]

But you haven't been reciting THAT (lame-o) version for sixty years.

LOL! No, the version I know is from the 1928 BCP which is still used in my church.

 

[Speedwell]

Then you already know Spong and others like him are heretics!

I know nothing of the kind. Spong is a mystic and his beliefs, right or wrong, are beyond the categories of formal theology.

 

[cre8id]

I know nothing of the kind. Spong is a mystic and his beliefs, right or wrong, are beyond the categories of formal theology.

No, again, according to the Nicean Creed, Spong is an outright heretic! Spong denies the deity of Christ, the Trinity, Jesus' virgin birth, and more.

Too bad you are too liberal to call a spade a spade!

 

[Albion]

LOL! No, the version I know is from the 1928 BCP which is still used in my church.

God bless you, brother, for your steadfastness!

 

[Speedwell]

No, again, according to the Nicean Creed, Spong is an outright heretic! Spong denies the deity of Christ, the Trinity, Jesus' virgin birth, and more.

Too bad you are too liberal to call a spade a spade!

You seem to think you know a lot about it. How much of his stuff have you read? Never mind, go ahead and deny his faith--you seem to enjoy that kind of thing. I will just pray for him.

 

[cre8id]

You seem to think you know a lot about it. How much of his stuff have you read? Never mind, go ahead and deny his faith--you seem to enjoy that kind of thing. I will just pray for him.

I place Spong at a notch above the average person claiming to be a "Christian" because he was in the clergy, he is a successful author, and has influenced many people with his absolutely false beliefs.

 

[JackRT]

Then you already know Spong and others like him are heretics!

From time to time the body of believers generates men and women who attempt to shake up the established order. Frequently they are called heretics and sometimes they are silenced. It sometimes takes a very long time before their worth is recognized. Such people are sometimes recognized as being prophetic. I have a suspicion that John Shelby Spong is just such a person.

You can call me a heretic now.

 

[cre8id]

From time to time the body of believers generates men and women who attempt to shake up the established order. Frequently they are called heretics and sometimes they are silenced. It sometimes takes a very long time before their worth is recognized. Such people are sometimes recognized as being prophetic. I have a suspicion that John Shelby Spong is just such a person.

You can call me a heretic now.

No, only if you deny an essential doctrine of Christianity. I do not throw around the term "heretic" litely.