What does the NT say about REAL SAVING BELIEF?

[BCsenior]

The New Testament words “belief” and “faith” are very inadequate!
Because of what the whole NT teaches, it is readily apparent that ONE word is completely insufficient to describe what “belief” and “faith” really mean! We know that a mere intellectual belief in Jesus and the gospel will not save anyone. But also, is just a deep heart-felt “belief” enough to save anyone?

Initially ● When believers first receive the Holy Spirit through God’s free gift of mercy/grace,
they receive everything >>> reconciliation, justification, righteousness, (positional) sanctification, holiness, salvation … everything!

But this is critical ● Our free-will co-operation with the Holy Spirit is critically important during our (continuing) sanctification. We read in the NT that believers are tested to prove their faith is genuine! Our initial salvation is a free gift, but we see a lot of warnings in the NT that IF our righteous standing (i.e. salvation) is not maintained, it can be lost. So, let’s not focus on our initial receiving of salvation; instead let’s focus on the end of our salvation process!

NT “believe” means continuing belief
In the NT, the Greek indicates that “believe” is a present tense imperative verb!
So, a continuing belief-faith is necessary for continuing salvation-eternal life!
“… whoever believes [present tense: continues to believe] in Him may have
[present tense: may continue to have] eternal life. For God so loved the world,
that He gave His only Son, that whoever believes [present tense: continues to believe]
in Him should not perish but have [present tense: continue to have] eternal life.”
(John 3:16)

NT “believe” and “repent” are 2 sides of the same coin
“Repent (metanoeo) and believe (pisteou) may be understood as opposite sides
of the same coin. Repent means to turn from one’s allegiance to sin and unbelief,
whereas believe means to place one’s trust in Christ. Thus, when one is mentioned
the other is implied … John never used the words repent, repentance, or faith
to describe the way people are saved. Instead, he used believe since this term
included all of these ideas.” (The Holman Christian Standard Bible)

Many NT verses teach the following spiritual Truths

Believers stay righteous by practicing righteousness
E.G. “… let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous
just as He is righteous … In this the children of God and the children of the devil
are manifest: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God” (1 John 3:7-10)

Believers stay righteous through their obedience
E.G. Those who are righteous in God’s eyes are …
“(slaves) of obedience leading too righteousness” (Romans 6:16)
“… only we who believe can enter His rest … but those who first heard
this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God.” (Hebrews 4:3-7)
This is saying: disobedience = unbelief.

Believers faith must endure until the end of their lives
E.G. “IF we endure, we shall also reign with Him.” (2 Timothy 2:12)
“… the one who endures to the end will be saved.”
(Matthew 10:22, Matthew 24:13, Mark 13:13)

Believers keep salvation by repenting of their sins
E.G. “If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us
of our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1 John 1:9)
“… whoever confesses and forsakes them (sins) will have mercy.” (Proverbs 28:13)

Believers were chosen and called to live holy lives
E.G. “God’s will is for you to be holy … live in holiness and honor …
God has called us to live holy lives, not impure lives. So, anyone who
refuses to live by these rules is rejecting God.” (1 Thessalonians 4:3-8)

Believers must love, forgive, not judge or condemn
E.G. “… forgive us our sins, as we have forgiven those who sin against us …
IF you forgive those who sin against you, your heavenly Father will forgive you.
But IF you refuse to forgive others, your Father will NOT forgive your sins.”
(Matthew 6:12-15)

Believers must be victorious overcomers
E.G. “To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne,
as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.” (Revelation 3:21)
Jesus overcame sin, the world, and the devil.
John wrote about overcoming only “the world” of non-believers (1 John 5:4-5)

Believers must have some fear of the Lord
E.G. “And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul.
But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.” (Matthew 10:28)
“… work out your own salvation with fear and trembling” (Philippians 2:12)
.

 

[Kenny'sID]

IOW, it's the same old argument, salvation doesn't come from a so called faith alone. Or, claiming we have faith without actions to show it, dosn't save, while "walking the walk/talk." or essentially, it's walking in true faith that leads to salvation.

So, I agree, as fortunately most do at this point anyway, at least until Satan tips the scales in the opposite direction putting us that much closer to the end of this age. That's going to happen eventually but thanks for being diligent in trying to fight it, and for attempting to awaken those that have taken a wrong turn on to easy street during their plight for salvation.

 

[eleos1954]

The New Testament words “belief” and “faith” are very inadequate!
Because of what the whole NT teaches, it is readily apparent that ONE word is completely insufficient to describe what “belief” and “faith” really mean! We know that a mere intellectual belief in Jesus and the gospel will not save anyone. But also, is just a deep heart-felt “belief” enough to save anyone?

Initially ● When believers first receive the Holy Spirit through God’s free gift of mercy/grace,
they receive everything >>> reconciliation, justification, righteousness, (positional) sanctification, holiness, salvation … everything!

But this is critical ● Our free-will co-operation with the Holy Spirit is critically important during our (continuing) sanctification. We read in the NT that believers are tested to prove their faith is genuine! Our initial salvation is a free gift, but we see a lot of warnings in the NT that IF our righteous standing (i.e. salvation) is not maintained, it can be lost. So, let’s not focus on our initial receiving of salvation; instead let’s focus on the end of our salvation process!

NT “believe” means continuing belief
In the NT, the Greek indicates that “believe” is a present tense imperative verb!
So, a continuing belief-faith is necessary for continuing salvation-eternal life!
“… whoever believes [present tense: continues to believe] in Him may have
[present tense: may continue to have] eternal life. For God so loved the world, that
He gave His only Son, that whoever believes [present tense: continues to believe]
in Him should not perish but have [present tense: continue to have] eternal life.”
(John 3:16)

NT “believe” and “repent” are 2 sides of the same coin
“Repent (metanoeo) and believe (pisteou) may be understood as opposite sides
of the same coin. Repent means to turn from one’s allegiance to sin and unbelief,
whereas believe means to place one’s trust in Christ. Thus, when one is mentioned
the other is implied … John never used the words repent, repentance, or faith
to describe the way people are saved. Instead, he used believe since this term
included all of these ideas.” (The Holman Christian Standard Bible)

Many NT verses teach the following spiritual Truths

Believers stay righteous by practicing righteousness
E.G. “… let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous
just as He is righteous … In this the children of God and the children of the devil
are manifest: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God” (1 John 3:7-10)

Believers stay righteous through their obedience
E.G. Those who are righteous in God’s eyes are …
“(slaves) of obedience leading too righteousness” (Romans 6:16)
“… only we who believe can enter His rest … but those who first heard
this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God.” (Hebrews 4:3-7)
This is saying: disobedience = unbelief.

Believers faith must endure until the end of their lives
E.G. “IF we endure, we shall also reign with Him.” (2 Timothy 2:12)
“… the one who endures to the end will be saved.”
(Matthew 10:22, Matthew 24:13, Mark 13:13)

Believers keep salvation by repenting of their sins
E.G. “If we confess our sins, He is faithful and just to forgive us
of our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.” (1 John 1:9)
“… whoever confesses and forsakes them (sins) will have mercy.” (Proverbs 28:13)

Believers were chosen and called to live holy lives
E.G. “God’s will is for you to be holy … live in holiness and honor …
God has called us to live holy lives, not impure lives. So, anyone who
refuses to live by these rules is rejecting God.” (1 Thessalonians 4:3-8)

Believers must love, forgive, not judge or condemn
E.G. “… forgive us our sins, as we have forgiven those who sin against us …
IF you forgive those who sin against you, your heavenly Father will forgive you.
But IF you refuse to forgive others, your Father will NOT forgive your sins.”
(Matthew 6:12-15)

Believers must be victorious overcomers
E.G. “To him who overcomes I will grant to sit with Me on My throne,
as I also overcame and sat down with My Father on His throne.” (Revelation 3:21)
Jesus overcame sin, the world, and the devil.
John wrote about overcoming only “the world” of non-believers (1 John 5:4-5)

Believers must have some fear of the Lord
E.G. “And do not fear those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul.
But rather fear Him who is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.” (Matthew 10:28)
“… work out your own salvation with fear and trembling” (Philippians 2:12)
.

Philippians 1:6

And I am certain that God, who began the good work within you, will continue his work until it is finally finished on the day when Christ Jesus returns. AMEN!

 

[BCsenior]

... I agree, as fortunately most do at this point anyway, at least until Satan tips the scales in the opposite direction putting us that much closer to the end of this age. That's going to happen eventually but thanks for being diligent in trying to fight it, and for attempting to awaken those that have taken a wrong turn on to easy street during their plight for salvation.

Yes, Kenny, there are always new people coming on board.
So, we need to make sure that everyone is on the same page,
that everyone is on the narrow road to eternal life.

 

[BCsenior]

Philippians 1:6
And I am certain that God, who began the good work within you, will continue his work until it is finally finished on the day when Christ Jesus returns. AMEN!

Yes, He most certainly will continue His work in us.

However, we can certainly continue our work of disobedience
and rebellion against Him ... IF we choose to do so!
Man is NOT a robot with no free will, correct?

Or, is it a guarantee that He will overcome our free wills, if need be?

If this is the case, then WHY all of the many dire warnings
in the NT written to the churches in the epistles ... about:
falling away, being estranged from Christ,
falling from grace, drawing back to perdition,
not being allowed into the kingdom of heaven,
not being allowed into the city of New Jerusalem,
being blotted out of the Book of Life, etc.

Hopefully, all of this will cut down on the negative comments to the OP.

 

[eleos1954]

Yes, He most certainly will continue His work in us.
However, we can certainly continue our work of disobedience
and rebellion against Him ... IF we choose to do so!
Man is NOT a robot with no free will, correct?
Or, is it a guarantee that he will overcome our free wills, if need be?

We respond to the work He does in us ... yes ... mankind always has free will ... we have a relationship with the Lord and abide with Him in love. Love overcomes disobedience. He love us, we love Him.
It is our freewill to love Him.

 

[BCsenior]

We respond to the work He does in us ... yes ... mankind always has free will ...
we have a relationship with the Lord and abide with Him in love.
Love overcomes disobedience. He love us, we love Him.
It is our freewill to love Him.

Well, sorry to have to request some Scripture verses for this one!
Is it "love overcomes all things"?
And ...
Some BACs do love Jesus for saving them by His grace,
but they believe in hyper-grace, i.e. they cannot lose their salvation.
Such false doctrines are from the very pits of hell.

 

[eleos1954]

Well, sorry to have to request some Scripture verses for this one!
Is it "love overcomes all things"?
And ...
Some BACs do love Jesus for saving them by His grace,
but they believe in hyper-grace, i.e. they cannot lose their salvation.
Such false doctrines are from the very pits of hell.

1 Peter 4:8

Above all, keep loving one another earnestly, since love covers a multitude of sins.

1 Corinthians 13:4-7

Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things.

1 Corinthians 13:4-8

Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; it does not rejoice at wrongdoing, but rejoices with the truth. Love bears all things, believes all things, hopes all things, endures all things. Love never ends. As for prophecies, they will pass away; as for tongues, they will cease; as for knowledge, it will pass away.

1 Corinthians

If I speak in the tongues of men and of angels, but have not love, I am a noisy gong or a clanging cymbal. And if I have prophetic powers, and understand all mysteries and all knowledge, and if I have all faith, so as to remove mountains, but have not love, I am nothing. If I give away all I have, and if I deliver up my body to be burned, but have not love, I gain nothing. Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant or rude. It does not insist on its own way; it is not irritable or resentful; ...

Leviticus 19:18

You shall not take vengeance or bear a grudge against the sons of your own people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself: I am the Lord.

1 John 4:19

We love because he first loved us.

1 Corinthians 13:4

Love is patient and kind; love does not envy or boast; it is not arrogant

Hebrews 13:8

Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever.

1 John 4:12

No one has ever seen God; if we love one another, God abides in us and his love is perfected in us.

1 John 4:8

Anyone who does not love does not know God, because God is love.

Romans 12:10

Love one another with brotherly affection. Outdo one another in showing honor.

Deuteronomy 6:5

You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your might.

John 14:23

Jesus replied, "If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word (out of love willingly). My Father will love him, and we will come to him and make Our home with him.

Romans 5:8

But God proves His love for us in this: While we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

 

[BCsenior]

Love overcomes disobedience.

What do all of your verses in post #8 have to do with the red?

Would you like to see the verses in Hebrews about
disobedience proves unbelief.

Are you saying love overcomes unbelief?

No, it all begins with belief ... and unbelief means you're an unbeliever!

 

[BCsenior]

We respond to the work He does in us ...
yes ... mankind always has free will ...
we have a relationship with the Lord and abide with Him in love.
Love overcomes disobedience. He love us, we love Him.
It is our freewill to love Him.

Of course, some do ... and that's God's plan for us,
but others don't bother because they believe in OSAS!
Why return His love, which requires obedience, etc.
when we can just trot merrily along our way to heaven, doing as WE please?

 

[eleos1954]

What do all of your verses in post #8 have to do with the red?

Would you like to see the verses in Hebrews about
disobedience proves unbelief.

I know those verses and they are true of course.

If we love ... the way God loves ... and He is working in us ... we will become obedient with His help ... willingly ... out of love ... He's teaching us what true love is and changes us over time conforming us to His image (God is love) that IS His image.

The Lord willingly came to this earth in the form of a man, willingly gave His life for us and defeated the enemy and everything sin the world has ever known or ever will know ... why? Because he loved/loves us that much.

God IS love. And His Love conquered everything on the cross .... that's how powerful true love is.

John 3:16 ... For God so LOVED

If one misses the motive (Love) ... they miss the message ... and the message is love God and others the way God loves.

The greatest of these is LOVE ... that's the message.

 

[eleos1954]

Of course, some do ... and that's God's plan for us,
but others don't bother because they believe in OSAS!
Why return His love, which requires obedience, etc.
when we can just trot merrily along our way to heaven,
doing as WE please?

2nd Timothy

For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine. Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.

sad .. but true

 

[BCsenior]

2nd Timothy
For the time will come when people will not put up with sound doctrine.
Instead, to suit their own desires, they will gather around them a great
number of teachers to say what their itching ears want to hear.
sad .. but true

So, the picture is coming in clear now.
We're NOT talking about us.
We're warning others who are NOT like us,
and are in dire need of help/correction.

They are BACS who have been deceived by Satan through their churches
into believing in OSAS, grace-only, hyper-grace, easy-believism, etc.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

The Scripture is fairly clear about salvation. it says that it is not man who will is, but God who shows mercy. This means that a person cannot be converted to Christ just by choosing the Christian religion. God has to initiate by showing mercy to the sinner. He does this through the work of the Holy Spirit to give the required insight into what the gospel really means. A sinner cannot understand the gospel because he is blinded through his slavery to sin. This is why many cannot believe the gospel even though it is clearly presented to them.

Then after sharing the gospel with so many who cannot seem to understand it - how we can have faith in a crucified God, one person comes along and responds, "I see it! Yes! I want to receive Christ as my Saviour. I know I am a hopeless sinner on the road to hell, but I know that Jesus died for me and I want to commit my life to Him!" This is because the person has been given the required insight by the Holy Spirit, his spiritual eyes are made to see the light of the gospel of Christ and his heart turns toward Christ.

This is why a sinner cannot understand the gospel and be able to repent unless the Holy Spirit, through God's mercy and grace, initiates the process by supernaturally giving the required spiritual insight.

And then, even though the sinner may be convicted of his sin and knows that he has to repent and receive Christ, he will not be able to do it until God gives him the saving faith. Just deciding to become religious and putting on the Christian badge, attending church and doing spiritual duties is not enough. He must seek God to receive saving faith to receive Christ in his heart because God is the only one who can give it.

 

[eleos1954]

So, the picture is coming in clear now.
We're NOT talking about us.
We're warning others who are NOT like us,
and are in dire need of help/correction.

They are BACS who have been deceived by Satan through their churches
into believing in OSAS, grace-only, hyper-grace, easy-believism, etc.

I can't imagine anyone studying His Word and coming to that belief.

Romans 6:15

What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

Romans 6:2

May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?

Hebrews 10:26

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

Many many more of course.

Do churches actually teach one can continue in sin, not changing, being changed at all and still be saved? This don't make logical sense, much less biblical sense.

I don't attend church, I study Gods word.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

I can't imagine anyone studying His Word and coming to that belief.

Romans 6:15

What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

Romans 6:2

May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?

Hebrews 10:26

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

Many many more of course.

Do churches actually teach one can continue in sin, not changing, being changed at all and still be saved? This don't make logical sense, much less biblical sense.

I don't attend church, I study Gods word.

If a person is genuinely converted to Christ having received saving faith from the Holy Spirit, and has the Holy Spirit dwelling in him, he will be totally committed to Christ and will have the Holy Spirit to teach him everything he needs to know, and Who will work in him to keep him from error and to work holiness in him.

Those who seem to receive Christ and then go back into sin after a while, show that they never received saving faith, or the Holy Spirit in the first place.

 

[PizzaAddict]

I can't imagine anyone studying His Word and coming to that belief.

Romans 6:15

What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? May it never be!

Romans 6:2

May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it?

Hebrews 10:26

For if we go on sinning willfully after receiving the knowledge of the truth, there no longer remains a sacrifice for sins,

Many many more of course.

Do churches actually teach one can continue in sin, not changing, being changed at all and still be saved? This don't make logical sense, much less biblical sense.

I don't attend church, I study Gods word.

It does make sense like it's said in 1 John 1:8 and 1 John 3:9.

It's not like one author of book is contradicting the other , the same John wrote not so far something which would seem like contradiction at first but actually is not and John was not stupid.

God gave you new birth when you believed but he did not remove your first birth and your flesh , untill you die or get changed at rapture you have to choose daily to crucify "Old Man" as told in Bible so the flesh and it's desires and live by Spirit as " New Man".

Whatever you do in your body does nothing since it will be lost , forgotten and burned up , whatever you do in Spirit will remain forever.

Spirit never sins and can never die , after ressurrection Spirit will have new immortal body to live inside.

Flesh will always sin and will die and it can't get to heaven because of it's nature.


So that's the difference hope that it cleared up something .

Also please don't make the gospel into something hard to understand or do , it's simply believing that Christ died for sins according to Scriptures and rose from dead no works needed.

 

[eleos1954]

It does make sense like it's said in 1 John 1:8 and 1 John 3:9.

It's not like one author of book is contradicting the other , the same John wrote not so far something which would seem like contradiction at first but actually is not and John was not stupid.

God gave you new birth when you believed but he did not remove your first birth and your flesh , untill you die or get changed at rapture you have to choose daily to crucify "Old Man" as told in Bible so the flesh and it's desires and live by Spirit as " New Man".

Whatever you do in your body does nothing since it will be lost , forgotten and burned up , whatever you do in Spirit will remain forever.

Spirit never sins and can never die , after ressurrection Spirit will have new immortal body to live inside.

Flesh will always sin and will die and it can't get to heaven because of it's nature.


So that's the difference hope that it cleared up something .

Also please don't make the gospel into something hard to understand or do , it's simply believing that Christ died for sins according to Scriptures and rose from dead no works needed.

[/QUOTE] simply believing that Christ died for sins according to Scriptures and rose from dead no works needed.[/QUOTE]

Hmmmm .... so ... satan and the angels know that ... and they won't be saved.

Works claimed by one's self are filthy rags.

Works done by Christ IN the believer changing them is evidence of His presence. No changes ... no evidence.

James 2

18But someone will say, “You have faith and I have deeds.” Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by my deeds. 19You believe that God is one. Good for you! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.

20O foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is worthless? 21Was not our father Abraham justified by what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? 22You see that his faith was working with his actions, and his faith was perfected by what he did. 23And the Scripture was fulfilled that says, “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,” and he was called a friend of God.

24As you can see, a man is justified by his deeds and not by faith alone.

 

[BCsenior]

The Scripture is fairly clear about salvation.
it says that it is not man who will is, but God who shows mercy.

Methinks you're posting to the wrong thread ... here's the right one:
Man is totally unable (on his own) to believe in Jesus and the gospel

 

[BCsenior]

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