What does it matter??

[bigat]

Hello All -

I've been looking around this website & the various forums and "discussions" that are going on and I have to say I am getting very frustrated with the "Christians".

I see "discussions" about everything from "Harry Potter" (this is really getting old) to "Should my child dress up for Halloween". To me this things have no meaning in my christian walk. To put it bluntly - they have no eternal impact IMHO.

In the Christian faith - what matters to you? In your opinion what issues have an eternal impact?

Gay rights?
Gay Marriage?
The 04 election?
Guns?
Abortion?
What we watch on t.v. or movies?
Books we read?

There are obvious exceptions - wouldn't see viewing a porno movie as being something good to do - but viewing Harry Potter having an eternal impact on me going to heaven or hell? Some have even said that if you go see "the Passion of Christ" then you are sinning. huh?

I feel like I am back in my grandparents church when everyone practiced RELIGION and not a personal realtionship with Christ. To me - this is the key. A personal relationship with Christ. IMO - if you have this relationship - then other things in life would fall into place. Does reading HP harm that relationship? Then don't read it. Does viewing The Passion harm your relationship with Christ? Then don't view it.

For me - The passion had an amazing impact on my relationship with Christ & has brought me closer to Him.

for me - Reading HP just gave me an escape from my day - life. It was a good read - great imagination. Did it take me away from Christ? No.

It just seems like Christians spend so much time "discussing" these things of little or no impact and avoid the "hot topics" or the faith: Your walk w/ Christ - Your prayer life - Witnessing to others - Ministry - Missions ect..

I know these other things are good to talk about - but telling people they are sinners for viewing a movie - reading a book - or allowing their children to dress up as clown & get candy?

I'm ranting - sorry. But it's something that has really started to bother me. Sometimes I just want to reply to these posts - "What does it matter?"

 

[Daily Miracle]

I understand what you are saying. I think.

I read Harry Potter and enjoyed it. I saw The Passion and thought it was amazing.

As far as your questions about gay marriages, gay rights, guns, etc., my answer is this. It doesn't matter what I think about these issues, what matters is that I try to do what pleases God on these issues.

I'm new at this, so I can't quote scripture or verses, but doesn't the Bible say something about not spreading God's word among other Christians, but to spread His word to non-Christians? I might have the wording of that wrong, but my take is that Christians are supposed to live in a way that draws non-Christians into Christianity. In my opinion, you can't do this if you are living a life that is sheltered by only Christians. The importance of fellowship and church activites is to add strength and wisdom to ourselves so we are better able to do work with non-Christians without getting sucked into their "non-Christian" beliefs.

How can you be kind, or show love to a gay person if you don't allow yourself to know them? How can you convince a woman that had an abortion that she needs God if you are telling her she's evil and vile at the same time? Instead of making these people hate what you stand for, isn't it better to make them love what you stand for?

Why would anyone WANT to be a Christian if it meant they had to give up everything that is pleasurable? The importance of "moderation" should be stressed. If we close our eyes and ears to the sins of the world, that doesn't stop them from happening. We aren't serving God if no one wants to be like us.

 

[Tami]

I've never read a Harry Potter book. I did read one sentence in one at Wal-Mart a long time ago just to see what all the controversey was about. I can't remember exactly what the sentence said but I remember that it creeped me out and decided that I nor my children would be reading those books. Even though I don't believe those books are a good thing to read, I don't think it makes someone unsaved if they choose to read them. I may not agree with their choice of book reading but I don't put some rule on it that it makes their salvation go down the toilet if they read them. I do believe that we should pay careful attention to what goes in our minds and I believe in the old saying "garbage in, garbage out" but I don't base everyone else's salvation on my standards.

 

[LuxPerpetua]

One of the best books I ever read was Philip Yancey's "The Jesus I Never Knew." In this book Yancey looks at how Jesus was truly a radical in his day, associating with lepers, adulterers, tax collectors, the poor, and now that I understand how Jesus lived his life, I have changed my life to be open to the people who are most unlike me to show them Christ's love. I love Jesus' quote that He did not come to heal the healthy but the sick (or something like that). Like you, I get really frustrated with my fellow siblings in Christ when they want to live in their own little bubble and exclude the rest of the world from hearing about Christ. This is NOT what Christ said to do, and we all have the responsibility to lead others to Him.

That brings me to the "walking the walk" part of my post: As Christians we are ambassadors for Christ, as Paul says in one of his epistles (I love that terminology!). How we act publicly can either encourage others toward Christ or discourage them. That's a major responsibility. As Christians, we know that we are saved by our faith in Christ but our works are important too. I think it is in Revelation (can't recall off-hand) that it is written that although Christians are saved they still have to answer to God for how they lived their lives. No sin is too much for Christ to cover (the only unforgivable sin is NOT accepting Christ's offer of help, healing, and forgiveness), but out of love for Him we should try our best to do as He commanded us: "Stop sinning!" (this is in the Gospels!). When we show our changed lives to others, they can see God's power working through us--not unlike what happened in Paul's life when people knew that he, who had persecuted Christians, became one of the most vocal Christians of his era. As ambassadors of Christ, we need to do our utmost to show the world the goodness of God. This, does NOT, however, mean boasting in ourselves about how good and holy we are, but rather boasting in God that he can forgive EVEN US! An attitude that I see among a lot of Christians is the tendency to become Pharisees themselves--myself included, unfortunately.

As Christians, our bodies are temples of God, and we should seek to keep them holy. Right speech, right thoughts, openly professing Christ as our Lord, and witnessing by example (when necessary use words ) are ways that we can bring others to Christ. One of the biggest condemnations the world uses against Christianity is that we are all a bunch of hypocrites. Well, I'm far from perfect, but I do my best to practice what I preach. If I didn't I would be lying to God. I live not for myself alone but to bring others to Christ. That's my mission, simply put. And that's the call for all Christians.

I'm rambling, but ultimately I agree with you that Christianity is about a personal relationship with God. I do think that how we act is a public example of just how deep a relationship we have with Him. I personally enjoy reading Harry Potter myself, and I just got back from seeing The Passion film, and I don't think my relationship with God has changed. I think that God knows we need "down" time, and as much as I love prayer, reading my Bible, and witnessing for Him, I get very drained, emotionally and physically, doing these things all day, every day. I don't think that doing secular things(like reading Harry Potter) are wrong if you are a strong Christian (I probably would not encourage my children to read Harry Potter unless they had a thorough understanding of reality vs. fiction and right living vs. wrong living) but I think that seeking God is better. Understanding what consititutes sin is a very important part of your walk with Christ--how can Christians change themselves and the world if we don't know which actions are right and wrong before God? I think, however, that on issues like Harry Potter, we've set our sights on things that aren't THAT harmful. I'm far more worried about the sexual content of basic television programming these days to get uptight about Harry--not to mention the sexuality that girls and boys alike are being encouraged to explore younger and younger thanks to Britney Spears, Seventeen magazine, movies, tv, ads, etc. Let's not even get into hunger, malnutrition, contaminated water supplies, houses built in squalor, pain, suffering, debt, oppression, hatred, genocidal violence, theft, etc.!

Um, yeah . . . very long post here just to say I totally understand where you are coming from for the most part. I really needed to get that out, too. Thanks for letting me vent with you!

 

[Cordy]

I think that these little issues are important. Not to the point of bringing division, but they need to be addressed. Harry Potter has actually caused such a surge in occultic interest that in the UK, the official wicca organization (don't know the "official" name offhand) has had to start a new branch just for kids who are interested in witchcraft due to these books.

I watched two of the HP films and was really upset that people who identify with Christ and the gospel entertain themselves with this. It lead people to be interested to what is actually evil. Now, if a child wants to experiement with witchcraft, it doesn't seem as "wrong" or "scary" is it did before. Films and books like this "lighten" up evil - disguising it. And yes, I think long term this does have significant consequences. As Christians, we are supposed to be a light to reveal the truth as it is, not disguise and reshape things into what they are not.

I just used HP as an example, because bigat mentioned it. I think all these things DO matter. The media and the outside world don't want us to think so though. The key is to remember that when we do discuss these things that we remember we are supposed to be doing so to edify and encourage each other to righteousness, not just for the point of getting all heated, upset and divided over something.

I think it comes down to intent.

 

[RangeMaster]

I think that these little issues are important. Not to the point of bringing division, but they need to be addressed. Harry Potter has actually caused such a surge in occultic interest that in the UK, the official wicca organization (don't know the "official" name offhand) has had to start a new branch just for kids who are interested in witchcraft due to these books.

This is also happening right here in the United States. I'v noticed a large rise in wicca and other drudic organizations here in Norfolk, VA. But, it's not just Harry Potter, things like this have been weeding their way in for a while now; Dungons and Dragons, Magic the Gathering (card game), Ever Quest..and the list goes on. It's all stuff that leads the weak minded from the right path. I have to admit, before I became a Christian, I was into that stuff...and the day after I became a Christian, it all went into the round file (trash can).

RangeMaster

 

[marc]

One of the best books I ever read was Philip Yancey's "The Jesus I Never Knew." In this book Yancey looks at how Jesus was truly a radical in his day, associating with lepers, adulterers, tax collectors, the poor, and now that I understand how Jesus lived his life, I have changed my life to be open to the people who are most unlike me to show them Christ's love. I love Jesus' quote that He did not come to heal the healthy but the sick (or something like that). Like you, I get really frustrated with my fellow siblings in Christ when they want to live in their own little bubble and exclude the rest of the world from hearing about Christ. This is NOT what Christ said to do, and we all have the responsibility to lead others to Him.

That brings me to the "walking the walk" part of my post: As Christians we are ambassadors for Christ, as Paul says in one of his epistles (I love that terminology!). How we act publicly can either encourage others toward Christ or discourage them. That's a major responsibility. As Christians, we know that we are saved by our faith in Christ but our works are important too. I think it is in Revelation (can't recall off-hand) that it is written that although Christians are saved they still have to answer to God for how they lived their lives. No sin is too much for Christ to cover (the only unforgivable sin is NOT accepting Christ's offer of help, healing, and forgiveness), but out of love for Him we should try our best to do as He commanded us: "Stop sinning!" (this is in the Gospels!). When we show our changed lives to others, they can see God's power working through us--not unlike what happened in Paul's life when people knew that he, who had persecuted Christians, became one of the most vocal Christians of his era. As ambassadors of Christ, we need to do our utmost to show the world the goodness of God. This, does NOT, however, mean boasting in ourselves about how good and holy we are, but rather boasting in God that he can forgive EVEN US! An attitude that I see among a lot of Christians is the tendency to become Pharisees themselves--myself included, unfortunately.

As Christians, our bodies are temples of God, and we should seek to keep them holy. Right speech, right thoughts, openly professing Christ as our Lord, and witnessing by example (when necessary use words ) are ways that we can bring others to Christ. One of the biggest condemnations the world uses against Christianity is that we are all a bunch of hypocrites. Well, I'm far from perfect, but I do my best to practice what I preach. If I didn't I would be lying to God. I live not for myself alone but to bring others to Christ. That's my mission, simply put. And that's the call for all Christians.

I'm rambling, but ultimately I agree with you that Christianity is about a personal relationship with God. I do think that how we act is a public example of just how deep a relationship we have with Him. I personally enjoy reading Harry Potter myself, and I just got back from seeing The Passion film, and I don't think my relationship with God has changed.

I think that God knows we need "down" time, and as much as I love prayer, reading my Bible, and witnessing for Him, I get very drained, emotionally and physically, doing these things all day, every day. I don't think that doing secular things(like reading Harry Potter) are wrong if you are a strong Christian (I probably would not encourage my children to read Harry Potter unless they had a thorough understanding of reality vs. fiction and right living vs. wrong living) but I think that seeking God is better. Understanding what consititutes sin is a very

important part of your walk with Christ--how can Christians change themselves and the world if we don't know which actions are right and wrong before God? I think, however, that on issues like Harry Potter, we've set our sights on things that aren't THAT harmful. I'm far more worried about the sexual content of basic television programming these days to get uptight about Harry--not to mention the sexuality that girls and boys alike are being encouraged to explore younger and younger thanks to Britney Spears, Seventeen magazine, movies, tv, ads, etc. Let's not even get into hunger, malnutrition, contaminated water supplies, houses built in squalor, pain, suffering, debt, oppression, hatred, genocidal violence, theft, etc.!

Um, yeah . . . very long post here just to say I totally understand where you are coming from for the most part. I really needed to get that out, too. Thanks for letting me vent with you!

You "get drained" you need time away from Jesus? So do you get refilled with things from the world? Every minute away from Jesus is a minute He can't use you to "walk the walk". "you can do all things through Christ who strengthens you", Philipians. He is our refiller.
I pretty much agree with your post, but this really jumped out at me and really didn't seem to fit. It actually sounds hypoc...

In Christ

Marc

 

[LuxPerpetua]

Sorry for the confusion, Marc. What I was saying is that actively witnessing for Christ (like doing charitable works, thinking about and discussing theological issues with Christians and non-Christians, getting involved in church programs, spending hours in prayer for others and reading your Bible to more clearly comprehend the mysteries of your faith, etc.) can be very draining upon your resources (time, money, and health). These activities are all wonderful things, but out of human weakness, we must maintain a balance of seriousness and play. I need to sleep, I need to laugh, I need to spend time with my family, I need to read stories, I need to play music. God is still there--He is always with his saints--but in these times I'm not *actively* seeking God but enjoying the blessings and gifts that He has given to me. What is important to remember is to have a firm foundation in God. If something secular (like watching TV, for example) causes you to stumble, then don't do it. Many Christians that I know go to the theaters and watch movies, they read People magazine (among others), watch secular programming on TV, read secular literature (Lord of the Rings, Charles Dickens, you name it). I don't agree that everything they do is spiritually uplifting, but I also don't think that these things have an eternal consequence. I know many Christians who boycott Disney, and just as many who go to DisneyWorld for vacation. We all do what we can, fully knowing that we cannot earn God's grace or salvation. He loves us in spite of our human weaknesses, and through Christ are we saved, and out of gratitude we do our best to love others as Christ commanded so that they, too, can learn of Christ's love. Debates over Harry Potter, The Passion of the Christ, etc., seem to zap too much of our energy and take our minds off of the bigger picture. Like I said before, I wish more Christians would get put more energy into demonstrating love to each other and to the world rather than becoming like Pharisees. We are saved not by our own merit, but by grace. Things like Harry Potter, yoga, The Passion of the Christ, secular music, birthday cakes, Christmas trees, etc., to me are all personal judgments. I promise that I can read Harry Potter and NOT want to pick up a stick and think it's a wand. Reading Harry Potter to me is like reading Calvin and Hobbes or Jane Austen or watching Finding Nemo. It is entertainment, not ethical or didactic material. I felt the same way reading The Chronicles of Narnia. If you feel that Harry Potter and the like will harm your spiritual walk, then don't do it. But just remember that no one is completely free of the secular world or of sin, for that matter. Do your best, and God, in His infinite mercy and love, will take care of the rest.

This argument also has interesting implications for alcohol use--and we all know that many Christians consume wine as a part of the Eucharist. Since the alcohol industry in general leads weak people into sin, should those Christian churches that use wine in their services abstain from using wine? I think of Harry Potter in the same way--I don't know of a single Christian who has ditched his/her Christian beliefs for witchcraft because of Harry Potter. You could give the world a toothpick and people would sin with it, but that doesn't mean that all who use toothpicks will sin or even that the toothpick is to blame for the sin. If you want to blame something, blame people for not accepting Jesus as Lord and seeking spiritual fulfillment elsewhere.

 

[Daily Miracle]

With or without the Bible or God's word, most of our opinions and passions are based on the shoes we've each walked in and how these things have affected our lives.

 

[Cordy]

But, it's not just Harry Potter, things like this have been weeding their way in for a while now; Dungons and Dragons, Magic the Gathering (card game), Ever Quest..and the list goes on. It's all stuff that leads the weak minded from the right path. I have to admit, before I became a Christian, I was into that stuff...and the day after I became a Christian, it all went into the round file (trash can).

Praise God for how He liberated you for these things! Whoohoo!!!

 

[RangeMaster]

Yes, Yes...Praise God!! For it is to Him that we owe all things! Even ourselves!