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ALL4J3SUS

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Hi. i'm a 14 year old girl from New Zealand. I am now in high school and will soon be having more in-depth lessons on evolution and how the earth is millions if not billions of years, by my science and social studies teachers.
1)How should I react to this?

2)I also want to be a zoologist, God willing, and I really don't know how I'm going to deal with being taught about evolution and stuff like that.
 

dctalkexp

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ALL4J3SUS said:
Hi. i'm a 14 year old girl from New Zealand. I am now in high school and will soon be having more in-depth lessons on evolution and how the earth is millions if not billions of years, by my science and social studies teachers.
1)How should I react to this?

2)I also want to be a zoologist, God willing, and I really don't know how I'm going to deal with being taught about evolution and stuff like that.
Hi ALL4J3SUS. You should react in a prayerful way. Always ask God for guidence and follow His ways.

Secondly, make sure you stay up to date on what the creationist arguments are. There are many resources by which you can do this: www.answersingenesis.org, www.icr.org, www.trueorigin.org, http://www.equip.org/store/index.asp?Title=evolution&view=results&Sub=1&Range=10000&TargetID=0&DeptID=0&auName=&Topic=0&REST=2

I would highly recommend that you view the videos by Dr. A.E. Wilder-Smith that are freely available on-line, that deal with design in nature, biology, etc. The link is http://www.wildersmith.org/library.htm I recommend viewing the "Logos [design] in biology," and "Logos in nature" videos first, which are located at the bottom.

Many will tell you that evolutionary theory and Christianity are perfectly compatible, thereby hoping you don't question or critically examine it. If you do critically examine it, you will be labeled an imbecile by many secularists, and not worthy to be taken seriously. But stay strong and let the Lord guide you, not the bullies of anti-creationism.

I hope that you keep your mind open, but that does not mean believing every silly thing thrown at you. It simply means considering the evidence in a way that allows multiple interpretations. Evidence isn't limited to only one view.

I hope you do well, and I pray that you do become a zoologist. There are many zoologists who believe in the Biblical view of creation, the following are just a few.

Professor Walter Veith
http://www.answersingenesis.org/docs/4188cen_d1999.asp /
http://www.icr.org/creationscientists/veith.html

Dr Johan Kruger
http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/bios/j_kruger.asp

Dr Joachim Scheven, Ph.D.
http://www.answersingenesis.org/home/area/bios/j_scheven.asp

Frank Sherwin, M.A. Zoology (Parasitology)

Robert Franks, M.D. (Adjunct Faculty/Board Member)
He has a B.A. in Zoology

Sharon K. Bullock, Ph.D. Pathology and Laboratory Medicine
She has a B.S. in Zoology

Also keep in mind that science is not against Christianity. In fact, most founders of modern science were Christians who believed in creation. Sir Isaac Newton, one the finest scientists to ever walk the face of the earth, was a believer. Then there's Lewis Pasteur, Johannes Kepler, James Maxwell, Lord Kelvin, et al. The founders of science were believers and creationists.

God bless.
 
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Late_Cretaceous

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Hi. I have a degree in Zoology and - although I am an "evolutionist" - can tell you that your presonal beleifs need not interfere with your education. One student I knew quite well was a very vocal creationist and would even question the prof in an "evolutionary biology course". However, as far as I know her marks were not affected by her opinions - no matter how openly she objected in class. One of Stephen J Gould's PhD students was also a creationist (Gould wrote many books on evolution).

How should you react to your teachers? Well you are entitled to your opinions, and to express your opinions. You should take care not to be disruptive in class, however. Remember, your teachers are doing their job. They have to teach what they have to teach.

How are you going to deal with "all that evolution stuff" while studying zoology? Above all, remember that having an OPEN MIND will get you farther then anything else. Many students may have a "spoon feed me the information and I will regurgitate it on the exam" attitude. You may be more apt to critically analyze what you are being taught. That is a good thing. However, do not go in there with a closed mind thinking you already know everything. Remember that school is a place to learn, and you would not need school if you already knew everything. If your mind is closed you will learn nothing.

Do analyze what you are being taught. Do question it. That is what makes a good scientist. Do not be scared.
 
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Late_Cretaceous

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Anybody who suggests that evolution and christianity are incompatible are basically saying that the majority of christians worldwide are deluded. A literal interpretation of geneis is only one interpretation - and not necessarily the right one. Millions of people believe in Jesus and salvation, and also accept the reality of evolutionary science.

One sign of an open mind is someone who can admit that there is a possibility that they are wrong in their opinions.
 
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Mr.Cheese

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Science can only operate by the things it observes. If God did in fact create the universe in six literal days, then, from what we can see and observe, God did his work in fast forward, for the earth appears to be very old. So science is not trying to be dishonest. People make science dishonest.

I don't believe that these issues create any crisis of faith or salvation.
 
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wblastyn

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Most educated Christians accept evolution and still manage to stay Christians. They believe Genesis is supposed to be interpreted as a non-literal theological message telling us about God and our relationship with Him, it is not supposed to be interpreted as a literal historical event.
 
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Late_Cretaceous

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One thing to keep in mind is that the message of the bible is ment to be understood by anybody on earth at any time in history. The message is open to the stone aged tribes of the Amazon, to our own modern technological society to those living in the days of the roman empire.

The actual way in which the earth was formed or how man came to be - physically - is not really important. What good would it have done to try and tell illiterate shepards of the first centruy AD about quarks and distant galaxies, or the nature of light, or that the earth was billions of years old. For such people it would have all sounded like nonsense and they would have shut off their ears.

Also remember that nodoby, and I mean NOBODY, really interprets the bible 100% literally. DO you believe the earth rests on pillars and is imobile, or that the sky is made of something solid? Would you literally kill your son for being disobedient? DO you really think women should be subservient to men?

Once someone starts insisting that the bible is inerrant and must be taken literally to be a "ture christian" they become stymied in dogma and deaf to the message.
 
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dctalkexp

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Late_Cretaceous said:
One thing to keep in mind is that the message of the bible is ment to be understood by anybody on earth at any time in history. The message is open to the stone aged tribes of the Amazon, to our own modern technological society to those living in the days of the roman empire.

The actual way in which the earth was formed or how man came to be - physically - is not really important. What good would it have done to try and tell illiterate shepards of the first centruy AD about quarks and distant galaxies, or the nature of light, or that the earth was billions of years old. For such people it would have all sounded like nonsense and they would have shut off their ears.
There was no need to tell the ancients about quarks, and galaxies, etc. The only truth that needed to be coveyed was that God created the earth, and man and beast from the ground, seperately. That's what was conveyed. There was no need to go into detail. It was a simple, but truthful account.

Also remember that nodoby, and I mean NOBODY, really interprets the bible 100% literally. DO you believe the earth rests on pillars and is imobile, or that the sky is made of something solid? Would you literally kill your son for being disobedient? DO you really think women should be subservient to men?
Of course no one interprets every word of the Bible literally, no one claims to. There are times in the Bible when it is clear that it's parabolic, such as a lot of the book of Revelations, some of Jesus' stories, or some of the psalms, etc. However, Genesis is written in historical narrative, and is an essential point in why we need salvation. It is not a parable. Genesis is taken literally in Romans 5.17: "For if by the one man's offense death reigned through the one, much more those who receive abundance of grace and of the gift of righteousness will reign in life through the One, Jesus Christ.)" Here we see Romans talking about a literal man (Adam) who literally sinned, and then it talks about Christ's grace. Genesis is literal history, no doubt about it.

Once someone starts insisting that the bible is inerrant and must be taken literally to be a "ture christian" they become stymied in dogma and deaf to the message.
I agree, no one should say that you have to take Genesis literally to be a "True Christian," but when you insist that Genesis is not literal, then you have problems reconciling what the NT says about Genesis. It has a lot to say about the literal fall of a literal Adam, thus clearly indicating the literal truth and history of Genesis. Don't be deceived, Genesis is real history.

God bless.
 
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thekawasakikid

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If only I had had the advice of Late_Cretaceous' first post when I was studying Zoology at undergraduate level! I had great difficulty resolving what I had been taught on Sundays with what I was being taught in lectures, and I even took to suggesting a creationist alternative in essays and such... unlike LC's acquaintance, I think this very much did affect my performance in the course.

At a very late stage in my education, I sought advice from one of the learned men in my church - who suggested that simply because I was taught the material did not necessitate that I believe it.

I hope you're able to resolve the apparent difficulties more quickly than I did ;)

Enjoy!
 
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Late_Cretaceous

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Don't be deceived, Genesis is real history
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Not according to most mainstream protestant and catholic clergy.
 
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Ark Guy

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Evolutionism is a dangerous belief and totaly disagrees with the Word of God.

Many ...do good christians...like to claim they are compatable, but when you really read the Word of God you quickly see the contradictions.

Either mans fallible view of science is correct..or God lied.

Either Adam was formed form the dust then Eve from his side..or man evolved from ape. You can't have it both ways.
 
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Ark Guy

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Late_Cretaceous said:
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Don't be deceived, Genesis is real history
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Not according to most mainstream protestant and catholic clergy.

I don't really care what the main strean says...I care what the bible says.

The bible says NO EVOLUTION
 
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ikester7579

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Late_Cretaceous said:
Also remember that nodoby, and I mean NOBODY, really interprets the bible 100% literally. DO you believe the earth rests on pillars and is imobile, or that the sky is made of something solid? Would you literally kill your son for being disobedient? DO you really think women should be subservient to men?
Here we are again, speaking as if we know what everybody thinks or does. Discrediting God's word at every turn, pick and choose what we like and cast all the rest in the trash. You never give up. I see you seem to think you have presuaded everyone to your way of thinking.
Sorry to mess up your 100% status, but I do take it literal from begining to end.
So now are you tempted to start quoting things out of context to try and make me look stupid because I have not conformed to your way of thinking? Go ahead, I know it's to much to resist.:)
 
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ikester7579

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Late_Cretaceous said:
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Don't be deceived, Genesis is real history
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Not according to most mainstream protestant and catholic clergy.
And they do not dictate to the whole world what to believe now do they? Seems funny that this is the only ones you will quote polls on. For if true believers were polled you'd find a different story. But then again you have to keep with what supports your conclusions. Never give a chance for what you don't agree with. If you poll a bunch of satanists you'd get about the same result.
 
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seebs

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Ark Guy said:
Evolutionism is a dangerous belief and totaly disagrees with the Word of God.

Hmm.

So, I'm just curious. Does your Bible say this:

[1] In the beginning was the Bible, and the Bible was with God, and the Bible was God.
[2] The same was in the beginning with God.
[3] All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
[4] In him was life; and the life was the light of men.
[5] And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
[6] There was a man sent from God, whose name was John.
[7] The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all men through him might believe.
[8] He was not that Light, but was sent to bear witness of that Light.
[9] That was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.
[10] He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.
[11] He came unto his own, and his own received him not.
[12] But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
[13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
[14] And the Bible was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
[15] John bare witness of him, and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.
[16] And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.
[17] For the law was given by Moses, but grace and truth came by Jesus Christ.
[18] No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.

If it doesn't say this, then I think you have a problem, which is you are saying "the Word of God" when you mean "the Bible", and if the Bible isn't actually the eternal Word, who became flesh and dwelt among us, then you are making a grave error.
 
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seebs

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ikester7579 said:
Sorry to mess up your 100% status, but I do take it literal from begining to end.

That's unusual! Most Protestants consider the Eucharist to be symbolic, and claim that Adam's death on the day that he ate the fruit was spiritual death, rather than literal death.
 
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Ark Guy

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ikester7579 said:
And they do not dictate to the whole world what to believe now do they? Seems funny that this is the only ones you will quote polls on. For if true believers were polled you'd find a different story. But then again you have to keep with what supports your conclusions. Never give a chance for what you don't agree with. If you poll a bunch of satanists you'd get about the same result.

The ONLY reason why believers believe in evolutionism is because they were force fed it in school and the discovery channel jams it down our throats.

Anyone with the abiliity to read and who has visited any decent creationist web sites sees where mans science is fallible.
Now I'm not saying that the creationist have if all figured out, but they are creating working models that do agree with the Word of God.
For example they have models that can create the Grand Canyon in a short period of time and not the millions upon millions of years required by the old earthers.
 
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notto

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Ark Guy said:
The ONLY reason why believers believe in evolutionism is because they were force fed it in school and the discovery channel jams it down our throats.
Nice projection. Could it not be possible that some believers have done a great deal of study, reading, experimentation, and scientific research themselves and based on this experience, accept evolution and the rest of mainstream science?

Science is not 'force fed'. Anybody can do it and follow up on research or recreate it if they so choose (this is after all, a big part of scientific studies - repeatability).

Why wouldn't schools and science channels deliver mainstream science as determined through consensus, peer review, and experimental data? What alternative is there that can still be called 'science'?
 
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