What did the Priests Do?

SonWorshipper

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This has been a question in my mind for some time. I am hoping that someone can help, perhaps from a Rabbinic source, Talmudic, etc and tell me what did the Priests (especially the High Priest) do when they discovered that the heavy veil that stood between the Holy place and the Holy of Holies was ripped from top to bottom?



We read in Acts about the way that they still persecuted the followers of the one crucified on that day that it happened, so from this resource we can only speculate. But what did the Priest do on the following Yom Kippur?



I know that there is also Rabbinic sources that record that the scarlet thread no longer turned white when he returned from the Holy of Holies on Yom Kippur, which signaled that the end had come for making atonement with the blood of bulls and goats and am wondering though what was their thoughts on this? Especially since it went on for forty years before the total destruction prophesied by the one who was slain?

 

yajyu

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I'm sorry that this is off the topic but you got me curious, about this too. What are those Rabbinic sources that you're talking about? I'd like to read those. I have such a passion to learn as much as I can about Messianic Judaism, so can you recommend any other reading material ?


And once again, I'm sorry for breaking off the topic.
 
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simchat_torah

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SW,

I'll try to dig up some stuff for you later this afternoon. I know that I've got a small compilation of rabbinic sources concerning the Tearing of the curtain and the Goat's scarf.

Gotta get back to job hunting at the moment though...

shalom,
yafet.
 
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simchat_torah

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bah humbug.... (yafet begins grumbling something about the 'stupid economy')

It's not going very well achi.

I really need something fast... our bills are really starting to pile up.

Thanks for your concern, I appreciate it.
 
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Henaynei

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According to rabbinic sources, or maybe it was Josephus, shortly after Yeshua's sacrifice (though they don't attirbute it to that, of course) four things happeded repeatedly that never happened before:

1) the scarlet thread from the Azazel on Yom Kippur that was hung outside the Temple door quite turning white - thosw who ever has a red bumper sticker knows how hard it is to keep the sun from turning primitive red white.

2) the lot for the Azazel had always fallen to the same goat every year (I do forget whether it was the right or left hand goat - but it has always been consistant) - it started falling randomly to either the right or the left.

3) they could not keep the Temple doors shut - this had never been a problem in the past - they were closed each evening - but now they found open every morning.

4) they could not keep the Temple Menorah lit - it kept going out
 
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Henaynei

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simchat_torah said:
I am sorry I didn't get to the post by this afternoon... things got a bit busy around here. I'll be shooting for tommorow.

-yafet
That's ok - I'm 10 min late leaving for work - sheesh this stuff is addictive!
 
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SonWorshipper

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My Rabbi said something about a thread tied to the High Priests Turban that was red going in and white coming out.

Thank you Henaynea, that is interesting. I am hoping that Yafet has something a little more "commontary" , I would like to hear or read their thoughts on why this happened and what they did about it. What the Jewish unbelievers in particular did about this. I mean how did they feel when that Priest returned and the thread was still scarlet? How did He feel? Was more supplication made? Were some hearts turned? Did they repeat the words of the Centurion or something similar?

I think that besides the actual distruction of the Temple itself this had to be the biggest thing to happen in regards to this most solomn day.

Did sacrifices of the people increase?
 
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Henaynei

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SonWorshipper said:
I think that besides the actual distruction of the Temple itself this had to be the biggest thing to happen in regards to this most solomn day.
Actually it is this event, exactly, that cut short any "discussion" on the topic. The Jewish community became deeply embroiled in rebellion against Rome led by one false Messiah Bar Kokhba and his PR man, Rabbi Akiva. This rebellion led in turn to the razing of the Temple.
 
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I would think it would be hard to those of the Priestly service to admit that happening since all their lives those particular things that happened every year did happen until Yeshua was Sacrificed. I would think a great fear would have come over them knowing in their hearts of the changes that happened that can't really be explained without Yeshua being part of the reason.

Shalom,

Tag
 
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simchat_torah

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hmmm.... I'm having trouble finding the recording of when the curtain ripped. I had it highlithed in a particular book, but I can't seem to find it.

Basically, the curtain that was torn was not the curtain between the holy of holies and the holy place... it was the curatin on the outer doors of the temple. How were the people on the hill able to see this curtain being torn if it was the curtain to the holy place?!?! As well, there is a prophecy in Isaiah where one asked, "If a man were to lose his son he would rend his clothes. But what would G-d do if he lost his son? He would rend the curtain on the gates of the temple." (my paraphase)

I'll keep looking...
 
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simchat_torah

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First, a brief explanation of what Azazel is/was. There was a second part of the sin offering given on Yom Kippur. After the blood sacrafice took place a single goat was set aside which was inscribed as "For Azazel". This is what is referred to as the "scapegoat". The High Priest would then lay his hands upon the scapegoat and speak out a confession (I can post this if anyone is interested) which would transfer the guilt of the people upon the goat. The Priest would then turn towards the people and shout out, "You shall be clean."

A seperate priest (not the high priest) would then come out of the Temple and lead this scape goat to a high cliff in the wilderness. There was quite a processional (which I can describe again if anyone is interested) that led into the wilderness, transferring the goat from preson to person until it reached it's destination.

Taken from page 104-105 of "The Fall Feasts" by Mitch and Zhava Glaser:
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"When the goat finally arrived at the precipice, the attending priest removed the red sash from its head and divided it, returning half to the animal's horns and tying the other half to a protrusion on the cliff. He then pushed the animal backwards over the cliff, sending it, bearing Israel's sins, to its death.

In connection with this ceremony, an interesting addition arose, which is mentioned in the Mishna. A portion of the crimson sash was attached to the door of the Temple before the goat was sent into the wilderness. The sash would turn form red to white as the goat was sent into the wilderness. The sash would turn from read to white as the goat met its end, signaling to the people that G-d had accepted their sacrifice and their sins were forgiven. This was based on the verse in Isaiah where the prophet declared: "Come now, and les us reason together," says the L-rd, "though your sins are as scarlet, they will be as white as snow' though they are red like crimson, they will be like wool." (Isaiah 1:18) The Mishnah tell sus that forty years before the destuction of the Temple, the sash stopped turning white. That, of course, was approxiametely the year Yeshua died.

According to the Talmud, the destruction of the Temple did not come as a total surprise to the Jewish peole. In fact, the Talmud records that four ominous events occured approximately forty years before the destruction of the Temple. Those four events were to warn the rabbis of the Temple's impending doom. According to the Jewish tradition, all four of these 'signs' came to pass. The four signs were (Yoma 39a, b):

1. The lot for the L-rd's goat did not come up on the right hand of the high priest (I will describe this in detail later - yafet -).
2. The scarlet cord tied to the door of the Temple on the Day of Atonement stopped turning white after the scapegoat had been cast over the precipice.
3. The westernmost light on the Temple candelabra would not burn. It is believed that this light was used to light the other lights of the candelabra.
4. The Temple doors would open by themselves. The Rabbis saw this as an ominous fulfillment of Zechariah 11:1, "Open thy doors, O Lebanon, that fire may devour thy cedars." The opening of the doors to let in consuming fire foretold the destruction of the Temple itself by fire.

The sages drew two conclusions from these warnings. First, they realized that the destruction of the Temple was G-d's judgement upon the Jewish people for the ungodliness. Second, they perceived the warnings as G-ds way of giving them time to prepare for the restructuring of Judiasm around the synagouge.
========================================

More later...
shalom,
Yafet.

According to the Talmud, the desctruction of the
 
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SonWorshipper

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Thanks , that is very enlightening, some of which I knew, some not. I am especially interested in the recordings, if there are any about thoughts on the torn curtain, and the doors opening. Do you know if anywhere it is recorded that they perceived this to be a telling of who "that man" claimed to be? Do you know when this started? ( besides the veil I mean).

Also this brings to mind what the reaction was and if there is any other recording besides the Gospels of the walking of the dead and the earthquake? Was the rending of the veil considered part of that, and even perhaps the problem keeping the doors shut?

I am however confused on the Menorah thing, I thought the middle Shamash was used?
 
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