What did Jesus mean?

[Groovy]

What did Jesus mean when he was on the cross and said "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?"

I have heard that he felt abandoned from God. Is this true?

√Groovy

 

[SavedByGrace3]

Jesus was made sin for us when He took the cup in the garden. He became one with us so that when the Father raised Him (the head of the body) up, we (the body) would raise up with Him. He because one with us in the same way that we were once one with Adam. The unregenerates are still one with Adam and they have the spiritual death. We are one with Jesus because of his becoming sin for us. Now we are one with Him in righteousness.

 

[Andrew]

This is the only time Jesus called his Father "God", instead of Father.

He lost that Father-Son relationship at the cross when he bore our sins so that today, you can call God "Abba! Father!"

Yes God forsook Jesus at the cross so that today "He will never leave you nor forsake you"!

2 beautiful divine exchanges here.

 

[Simon_Templar]

Groovy,

In my opinion, and this is simply my understanding of it. At that moment, Jesus was taking on the sin of the world, he was becoming a curse for us, etc, in effect he was covered with sin. God the Father can not be in the presence of sin nor look upon sin without judging it. Thus at that moment, Jesus lost the connection he had always had with the Father, for the first and only time there was a seperation between them because God could not be one with Jesus at that time, and could not look upon him as he always had. Jesus bearing the weight of the world, travailing in agony of crucifixion as well as the tremendous stress of his situation felt the loss of the most important thing, his connection to his Father.

As a said before this is just my opinion. I havn't considered in depth the theological implications it may have, I don't know if its correct, but its what makes sense to me right off the top of my head.

 

[Groovy]

Could Jesus have said that to link it to a psalm?
Was he evangelizing on the cross?

√Groovy

 

[Groovy]

About the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "

Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani" Which means, "My God, My God, why have you forsaken me?"

The Gospel of Mark 15:34 says the exact same thing, but.... here in Luke, Jesus was on the cross and it says...

Jesus said, "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing"... 43(to the good thief) Jesus answered him, "I tell you the truth, today you will be with me in paradise.".... 46 Jesus called out with a loud voice, "Father into your hands I commit my sprit." When he had said this, he breathed his last.

So right after saying "My God, My God..." he said "Father into your hands..." why is that?

 

[tyr0ne]

Jesus actually carryed all of our sins, hence God couldnt look upon sin

 

[Johnny Be Good]

Groovy--I'm waiting for that answer too! It can only come from Him.

 

[Groovy]

Jesus actually carryed all of our sins, hence God couldnt look upon sin

But if God could not look on sin, why did Jesus say "Father into your hands..." right after that?

Why did he not say "God into your hands..."?
And why did he not say "God forgive them for they...."?

√Groovy

 

[Svt4Him]

It was a quote from the psalms, and the psalm has a happy ending (Psalm 22).

But Jesus did not take on the sins of the world, Jesus became sin, there is a difference. What happened then is beyond me.

 

[Groovy]

It was a quote from the psalms, and the psalm has a happy ending (Psalm 22).

But Jesus did not take on the sins of the world, Jesus became sin, there is a difference. What happened then is beyond me.

Ok, let me see if I have this straight.
Jesus felt cut off from God because he became sin, but only for a second?
And why would Jesus only quote the first line of the psalm?

√Groovy

 

[Groovy]

This is still not making sense, could somebody shed some light?

√Groovy

 

[Mother Vashti]

Groovy,

In my opinion, and this is simply my understanding of it. At that moment, Jesus was taking on the sin of the world, he was becoming a curse for us, etc, in effect he was covered with sin. God the Father can not be in the presence of sin nor look upon sin without judging it. Thus at that moment, Jesus lost the connection he had always had with the Father, for the first and only time there was a seperation between them because God could not be one with Jesus at that time, and could not look upon him as he always had. Jesus bearing the weight of the world, travailing in agony of crucifixion as well as the tremendous stress of his situation felt the loss of the most important thing, his connection to his Father.

As a said before this is just my opinion. I havn't considered in depth the theological implications it may have, I don't know if its correct, but its what makes sense to me right off the top of my head.

That's a good opinion. Hang on to it.

 

[Groovy]

If God can not look upon sin, Does that mean he can't look upon us, and we are continuously separated from him?

√Groovy

 

[Andrew]

God CAN look upon us becos we ARE IN Christ. And Christ is in us!

He does not see our sins but Christ in us the hope of glory.

• Heb 8:12 For I will be merciful to their unrighteousness, and their sins and their iniquities will I remember no more. [a double-negative in the Greek]

• Heb 10:17 And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.[a double-negative in the Greek]

• 2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing/counting/keeping a record their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

 

[kimbot]

Jesus new the scriptures implicitly and not one word that came from his lips during his teaching was unplanned from the very beginning.....

"In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God. He was with God in the beginning.......And the word became flesh and dwelt among us..." John1:1,2,9

The power of the Lord is in the Word. It is no coincidence that he uttered those particular words on the cross " My God, My God why have you forsaken me" identical to the very first verse of psalm 22. Written by David hundered of years before the Messiah was born, Psalm 22 are Jesus's thought whilst he is on the cross.....amazing!

Possibly this was said in fulfilment of scripture as well as showing that we will never experience a life without God once commited to Christ as when he became sin the father turned his back on him. when the father looks at those born agin he does NOT see our sin He sees his Sons perfection.

Interestingly enough "Father into your hands I commit your spirit" is verse 5 in psalm 31 which echoes sentiments of Jesus' experiences. I also feel that despite being cut off from God for a moment Jesus remained faithful and loving until the end. I think there is a subtle lesson for us there.

Yours in Christ

 

[sandman]

Groovy

This is what I have worked from the scriptures …see what you think.
____________________________________________________________






Matthew 27:46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?


John 10:30 I and my Father are one.
The word one hen neuter, means “one in purpose”
How could they be one in purpose….. and have God forsake Him on the cross; doesn’t make any sense.

How about II Corinthians 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself…
How could God be in Christ and forsake him?

John 16:32 Behold, the hour cometh, yea, is now come, that ye shall be scattered, every man to his own, and shall leave me alone: and yet I am not alone, because the Father is with me


Matthew 26:53 Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels
God would give Jesus more than 72,000 angles. At any point Jesus could have walked away with a massive amount of spiritual bodyguards.

So how do we reconcile these scriptures with Matthew 27:46 it would appear to be a contradiction of terms.
It has been said that God hated sin so much that he had to turn away during the final moments of His only begotten sons life…..I don't think so...

**One of the principles of biblical research is when you have several clear verses, and one that seemingly contradicts those clear, then it is either in our understanding, or in translation…..In this case it is translation.

The words Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani are Aramaic, that is the language Jesus spoke
There is no such Aramaic word as lama however there is a word lmna which is a declaration as in “for this reason” or “for this purpose”
The word sabachthani comes from the root word shbk which means “to spare, or to keep, to leave, or reserve”.

The word remaining in the following verses have all been translated from shbk II Kings 10:11, Deuteronomy 3:3, Joshua 10:33
Literally this should read Eli, Eli, lmna sabachthani that is to say, “My God, My God, for this reason, or for this purpose was I reserved, or spared”.
For this purpose Christ came into this world, the purpose of redemption.
Now that would be an interesting study if we left it there…but wait let’s put some icing on the cake

From the Peshitta this reads Eli, Eli, lemana shabakthani “My God, My God, for this I was spared or this was my destiny”.

Another interesting fact: All eastern Bibles have “for this purpose I was spared” while the Occidental translations read “why hast thou forsaken me”….wonder why that is?

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Bless
sandman

 

[lambano]

I have a Lamsa bible translated from the Peshitta it reads “Eli Eli lemana shabakthani” = “My God My God for this was I spared”

Makes sense to me!



lambano

 

[Groovy]

Sandman! Way to go!
You nailed most of it, You just need to complete that thought.

Here is something I learned today at church (from a Catholic Priest no less!)

In Jesus' time the Pharasees read from two sources: books known as 'The Law' and the books of the Prophets.
Most (if not all) Jews would memorize "The Law", and the way they would bring to mind a passage in those books was to quote the first line.

"The Law" consisted of five books, and was largely written in the 10th to 5th centuries B.C.

Book 1, consisted of Psalms 1-41 Mainly written by David, The Predominant divine name was "Yahweh" which means "The Lord". The frequent topics are Humans and Creation. and the resemblance to pentateuch was Genesis.

Book 2 consisted of Psalms 42-72 Mainly written by David and the Sons of Korah, The Predominant divine name was "Elohim" or "El" for short, which means "God", Frequent topics were Deliverance and Redemption. and the resemblance to pentateuch was Exodus.

Book 3 consisted of Psalms 73-89 Mainly written by Asaph, The predominant divine name was also "Elohim". The frequent topics are Worship and Sanctuary, and the resemblance to pentateuch was Leviticus.

Book 4 consisted of Psalms 90-106 Mainly written by anonymous writers. The predominant divine name was "Yahweh". The frequent topics are the Desert and God's ways. and the resemblance to pentateuch was Numbers.

Book 5 consisted of Psalms 107-150 Mainly written by David or anonymous writers. The predominant divine name was also "Yahweh". Frequent topics are God's word and Praise. and the resemblance to pentateuch was Deuteronomy.

Whew!
√Groovy