What About Churches?

[OzSpen]

Epiphoskei,

It seems the decorum police are the only ones currently disrupting this forum, but as you wish, I'm out.

I'm missing something. What is happening to you?

 

[CRfan]

The Bible does say not to forsake the assemblying of ourselves together...that's for Christians.
Being a "member" of a particular denomination or body officially doesn't save anyone. Actually, all true Christians are members of God's church.
Churches often have membership for the purposes of church discipline, leadership, and making decisions. Churches do this I assume to make sure people are putting themselves under their authority which is not an unBiblical concept. Also, it shows a commitment to a particular body. I have only been an official "member" of a church one time.
Getting involved in a church is a good thing, as iron sharpens iron. People can help each other and be discipled in a church. Also, I find that it is an encouragement to not only hear messages, but to worship with other believers.
Choosing a church can be very difficult. You will not find a perfect church that gets everything right. I've been to some very good churches in my life, but they weren't perfect. I consider myself blessed.
It is important that the church sticks to the Scripture as the only authority.
There are some areas that people can debate over, but it shouldn't divide us ultimately. I mean a person can fellowship with other Christians who have some disagreements.
I believe certain gifts ceased with the closing of the canon of Scripture, but I have had acquaintances and even a dear friend who would disagree on this.
Some interpretations of certain areas can make a difference where you decide to attend. If you believe in the Doctrines of Grace, it does make it awkward to listen to a pastor who doesn't fully believe them like my family is doing now.
At different stages in my life I have grown to have a better understanding of Scripture than some of the churches I've attended. I get my good teaching from former pastors or great teachers online like John MacArthur, John Piper, David Forsyth, Scott Ardavanis, and Jack Hughes.
God doesn't change, so I would request that you be cautious and avoid churches that don't teach the Bible...or put tradition on the same level as Scripture.
Avoid also churches that say you have to be a member of their church only to be saved. It's okay to encourage membership of a church, but no particular church is the only true church.

Well, it's great you are reading the Bible. It's also great if you are praying God will lead you to the right church. Believing involves repentance and commitment to the Lord...not just intellectual assent.
Believing certain things are essential for a church doctrinally.
You should see genuine love for the Lord and worship in a church, but please don't assume you can read a person's heart by just looking. Also, Christians have times when they feel closer to God than others. Action is more important than mere emotionalism.
Sorry to run on.

 

[Aibrean]

1) Is membership in a church NECESSARY for salvation and a Christian Life, or can these things be attained and lived without a church? What is the justification for this?
We are all members of the body of Christ. Sure, fellowship with believers is important and we are told that it's good for us. However, it is not possible for everyone to go to church. We are justified by our faith. We have been created to do good works and those works are a result of our faith, but certainly not a requirement of our salvation. Children can understand and believe in Christ, but they may not have the means to go to church and certainly not be a member.
2) If church membership is necessary, is there any indication that picking the RIGHT church is necessary? Is it the case that it is different strokes for different folks, that diversity in churches is okay and certain churches “fit” certain people, or is it that case that there is ONE church that ALL true Christians are to belong to? What is the justification for this? The Bible can be interpreted many ways. There is no absolute "right" in my opinion because we don't have the writers of the Bible to ask them what they meant. We are basing our interpretation on translation. We can hope that the Holy Spirit has led those translators correctly, but it's personal direction as to who has interpreted it properly. I've changed denominations after questioning things I was taught that didn't make Biblical sense. As I said, Christians are all a part of the body of Christ.

3)If there is a right church (or a type of right church), what SIGNS do I look for to find that right one? Is SOLA SCRIPTURA (“scripture alone”, the doctrine that all religious teaching and doctrine is to be found in the Scriptures) a necessary teaching in a church, or is additional reliance on TRADITION necessary to fill apparent gaps? Are SPIRITUAL GIFTS a sign that a church is true, or is that something that ended long ago? What is the justification for this? Does it make sense, can what they believe stand up to the test of being cross-referenced? Do they take everything within context? Do they believe the Bible is the word of God? I also agree that the Bible needs to be absolute authority. As I said, it's up to personal direction. I don't go to my mom's church because I don't believe what they preach. They are wrong to me, but not the people who go there. Don't believe what you have been taught just because someone told it to you. Investigate to substantiate and see if it's sound according to the Bible.

 

[Sarcalogos Deus]

1) Is membership in a church NECESSARY for salvation and a Christian Life, or can these things be attained and lived without a church? What is the justification for this?

This depends and opinions vary widely on this, Baptism is necessary for salvation, but membership in a Church is not. Membership in a Church is however very helpful to the spiritual life of a Christian and therefore a aid to salvation

2) If church membership is necessary, is there any indication that picking the RIGHT church is necessary? Is it the case that it is different strokes for different folks, that diversity in churches is okay and certain churches “fit” certain people, or is it that case that there is ONE church that ALL true Christians are to belong to? What is the justification for this?

I'm Catholic so i am obviously going to say that the Catholic church is right and the "one" Church

3) If there is a right church (or a type of right church), what SIGNS do I look for to find that right one? Is SOLA SCRIPTURA (“scripture alone”, the doctrine that all religious teaching and doctrine is to be found in the Scriptures) a necessary teaching in a church, or is additional reliance on TRADITION necessary to fill apparent gaps? Are SPIRITUAL GIFTS a sign that a church is true, or is that something that ended long ago? What is the justification for this?

Sola Scriptura is a man-made doctrine. You need Sacred Tradition in addition to Scripture. The Catholic Church had been in existence for 300 years when she finally compiled the Bible. We have the oral tradition of the Apostles that has been handed down to us guiding the Church in her interpretation of Scripture.

I think the issue of the “right” church can be made easier if it is determined whether the church was supposed to be unchanging and universal or if it is supposed to change with the time and place it occupies to more efficiently conduct ministry and fellowship. If the former is true, we should model churches off how churches were in the earliest times of Christianity, but that is a hard task today as some information from that time period is missing. If the latter is true, then it may make the task easier, but some sort of boundary would have to be established where a church is definitively no longer Christian, or else we could easily fall into religious pluralism. It seems that these are questions all Christians should consider.

It is a mixture of both a Church is supposed to be universal, but it is also supposed to change. The key is not changing too much like say the Episcopal Church ordaining gay clergy or Liberal Protestant denominations that condone abortion. Now that is changing too much.

 

[Sketcher]

1) Is membership in a church NECESSARY for salvation and a Christian Life, or can these things be attained and lived without a church? What is the justification for this?

For salvation, no. For Christian life, you need to at least have a few other believers that you can worship with, look at Scripture with, and pray with. As you develop trust with trustworthy believers, you should be able to lean on them, as they should be able to lean on you.

2) If church membership is necessary, is there any indication that picking the RIGHT church is necessary? Is it the case that it is different strokes for different folks, that diversity in churches is okay and certain churches “fit” certain people, or is it that case that there is ONE church that ALL true Christians are to belong to? What is the justification for this?

The one right Church is not confined to any one denomination of churches. However, there are bad ones which you should avoid. Mormons, Jehovah's Witnesses, "Christian" Scientists, etc. These groups do not preach the Gospel, but a perversion of it.

If there is a right church (or a type of right church), what SIGNS do I look for to find that right one? Is SOLA SCRIPTURA (“scripture alone”, the doctrine that all religious teaching and doctrine is to be found in the Scriptures) a necessary teaching in a church, or is additional reliance on TRADITION necessary to fill apparent gaps? Are SPIRITUAL GIFTS a sign that a church is true, or is that something that ended long ago? What is the justification for this?

I'm a Sola Scriptura guy. That's all I can recommend to you, though some churches with what they call sacred tradition are better than nothing. If they focus more on that than on Jesus Christ being God in the flesh, coming down to earth being born of a virgin, living a perfect life, dying to take the punishment from our sins, rising from the grave, and ascending back to Heaven with the promise of coming again, then get out. No hierarchy is more important than that.

I think the issue of the “right” church can be made easier if it is determined whether the church was supposed to be unchanging and universal or if it is supposed to change with the time and place it occupies to more efficiently conduct ministry and fellowship. If the former is true, we should model churches off how churches were in the earliest times of Christianity, but that is a hard task today as some information from that time period is missing. If the latter is true, then it may make the task easier, but some sort of boundary would have to be established where a church is definitively no longer Christian, or else we could easily fall into religious pluralism. It seems that these are questions all Christians should consider.

The Gospel and the rest of God's word are eternal. Worship and ministry traditions change, though - and you'll find that they even changed within the Roman Catholic and Eastern Orthodox churches as far back as their history goes. If you want my opinion, problems occur when God moves people in a way that is in agreement with Scripture, but church officials oppose it for the sake of preserving a non-biblical tradition which is younger than Scripture by a few hundred years.

 

[kit]

It is interesting that there is a bias toward Christian Scripture. The fact of the matter is that the Christian Church existed for hundreds of years before it decided what was and was not scripture. That scripture was canonized to express the Tradition of the church. It was not intended to be the authority of God on Earth. It was to aid the church in teaching the faithful.

Christ established a church and sent out apostles as the church. Jesus did not write scripture nor did he command the writing of scripture. There are three Communions which trace their history back to the original Church. Most common to us is the Roman Catholic. The next largest Communion is the Orthodox Churches (in the US Greek Orthodox tends to be the most visible). The Oriental Orthodox Churches are the third (perhaps the most well known of these is the Tawahedo Ethiopian Church. Armenians and Thomasite Indians are also within this communion. Anglican/Episcopalians kind of trace their history back to Christ but that is debatable since they spent most of their history in the Roman Catholic communion.

One of the things that astounds me in our culture is how much people want the church to conform to them-entertain them, "speak" to them, etc. It seems much more important to go to church to worship, to sacrifice, to serve God rather than to get God, or God to serve the person.

Go to a couple of Catholic Masses and Orthodox Divine Liturgies each. Go to a couple of Liturgical Protestant churches. Go to several Free Protestant services. Narrow down which branches are coherent. Get Baptized if you want to be Christian. Over and over and over again the scripture says that when one is baptized the Spirit comes to you. Follow that Spirit.

If I were to go back to Christianity, which I am not, I would probably end up in the Community of Christ. It is a Church in the Latter Day Saint Tradition.

 

[Ivy]

1) Is membership in a church NECESSARY for salvation and a Christian Life, or can these things be attained and lived without a church? What is the justification for this?

2) If church membership is necessary, is there any indication that picking the RIGHT church is necessary? Is it the case that it is different strokes for different folks, that diversity in churches is okay and certain churches “fit” certain people, or is it that case that there is ONE church that ALL true Christians are to belong to? What is the justification for this?

3) If there is a right church (or a type of right church), what SIGNS do I look for to find that right one? Is SOLA SCRIPTURA (“scripture alone”, the doctrine that all religious teaching and doctrine is to be found in the Scriptures) a necessary teaching in a church, or is additional reliance on TRADITION necessary to fill apparent gaps? Are SPIRITUAL GIFTS a sign that a church is true, or is that something that ended long ago? What is the justification for this?

I think the issue of the “right” church can be made easier if it is determined whether the church was supposed to be unchanging and universal or if it is supposed to change with the time and place it occupies to more efficiently conduct ministry and fellowship. If the former is true, we should model churches off how churches were in the earliest times of Christianity, but that is a hard task today as some information from that time period is missing. If the latter is true, then it may make the task easier, but some sort of boundary would have to be established where a church is definitively no longer Christian, or else we could easily fall into religious pluralism. It seems that these are questions all Christians should consider.

1. It's not necessary for salvation, but we need other people to learn to "love one another," for instance. That's not something we can practice at without interaction. Also, it is very strengthening to hear other people state their faith in their own words--another thing that can't happen if we go it alone.

2. Well, the Scriptures say that each part of the Body needs all the others, that all parts belong. So I think it is a matter of discerning, with the help of the Holy Spirit, which part you are meant to be a "part" of, so to speak , not which part is the most "right".

3. IMHO it may be better not to make ourselves too busy trying to figure out who doesn't belong, who is no longer Christian. We can spend the rest of our lives spinning our wheels on wording in all kinds of doctrinal statements and documents and miss living out the Gospel. Plus there is the danger of misjudging others and causing serious spiritual harm to them in so doing.

Look at the fruit instead--are the members humble and gentle, do they care for the practical needs of others, do they love prayer? The point of a church is to replicate characteristics of Jesus such as these in its members.