Watchtower and Act 4:12

[eksesar]

the last chapter of the "live forever" book says this:



14 Do not conclude that there are different roads, or ways, that you can follow to gain life in God’s new system. There is only one. There was just the one ark that survived the Flood, not a number of boats. And there will be only one organization—God’s visible organization—that will survive the fast-approaching "great tribulation." It is simply not true that all religions lead to the same goal. (Matthew 7:21-23; 24:21) You must be part of Jehovah’s organization, doing God’s will, in order to receive his blessing of everlasting life.—Psalm 133:1-3

If you are Jehovah's Witness, after read above and Read in the Book of ACTS 4:12 Which is said (ACT 4:12 NWT )Furthermore, there is no salvation in anyone else, for there is not another name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must get saved.”

in Which side you have to Stand for ? Bible as a Supreme Authority or Governing Body of Jehovah's Witness ?

 

[Peterson]

JWs aren't the only exclusivist group. There are many others, including the oldest group around, and all those who are dedicated to the Athanasian Creed, and the doctrine of the Trinity.

"Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith, Which Faith except everyone do keep whole and undefiled, without doubt he shall perish everlastingly."

Last sentence: " This is the Catholic Faith, which except a man believe faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved."

"One true churches" come in all sizes, shapes and doctrines - take your pick.

 

[rowena]

JWs aren't the only exclusivist group. There are many others, including the oldest group around, and all those who are dedicated to the Athanasian Creed, and the doctrine of the Trinity.

"Whosoever will be saved, before all things it is necessary that he hold the Catholic Faith, Which Faith except everyone do keep whole and undefiled, without doubt he shall perish everlastingly."

Last sentence: " This is the Catholic Faith, which except a man believe faithfully and firmly, he cannot be saved."

"One true churches" come in all sizes, shapes and doctrines - take your pick.

Actually, the Catholic Church believes that a person who isn't Catholic can be saved because salvation is through Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ alone. Most Catholics who know their doctrine will not presume to say who is saved or who isn't (including themselves) because they believe we all have to work out our salvation "in fear and trembling".

 

[True Believer]

Actually, the Catholic Church believes that a person who isn't Catholic can be saved because salvation is through Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ alone. Most Catholics who know their doctrine will not presume to say who is saved or who isn't (including themselves) because they believe we all have to work out our salvation "in fear and trembling".

Which is exactly the same stance as the Jehovah's Witnesses.
We only try to supply ones with information to make an informed choice because we are commanded to go forth and make disciples, disciples for Jehovah not the WBTS which contrary to popular beief we ourselves are not.
We belong to no man or group of men we are Jehovah God's and his alone. We are a group which recognizes the men who write articles as Godly men trying to lead and teach all men to get a knowledge of Jehovah. They are as fallibly as any men but and it is a big but they recognize they are responsible and will be held accountable before Jehovah so they do their utmost to be accurate in all they write and speak. We beieve we have a correct understanding but then all of those who are not JWs also feel they are the ones with the correct understanding hence the division which exist among men.
Agape', TB

 

[Peterson]

Actually, the Catholic Church believes that a person who isn't Catholic can be saved because salvation is through Jesus Christ and Jesus Christ alone. Most Catholics who know their doctrine will not presume to say who is saved or who isn't (including themselves) because they believe we all have to work out our salvation "in fear and trembling".

Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus; "Outside the Church there is no salvation" is a doctrine of the Roman Catholic faith.

"There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which no one at all is saved." (Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, 1215.)

"We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff." (Pope Boniface VIII, the Bull Unam Sanctam, 1302).

"There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which no one at all is saved." (Lateran Council IV, 1215)

I think we can be assured that "Church" as used here, means the Roman Catholic Church exclusively. These quotes are from www. catholicism.org.

 

[2ducklow]

If you are Jehovah's Witness, after read above and Read in the Book of ACTS 4:12 Which is said (ACT 4:12 NWT )Furthermore, there is no salvation in anyone else, for there is not another name under heaven that has been given among men by which we must get saved.”

in Which side you have to Stand for ? Bible as a Supreme Authority or Governing Body of Jehovah's Witness ?

Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

To me this verse is only affirming that salvation if by faith in Jesus and his name.

the last chapter of the "live forever" book says this:



14 Do not conclude that there are different roads, or ways, that you can follow to gain life in God’s new system. There is only one. There was just the one ark that survived the Flood, not a number of boats. And there will be only one organization—God’s visible organization—that will survive the fast-approaching "great tribulation." It is simply not true that all religions lead to the same goal. (Matthew 7:21-23; 24:21) You must be part of Jehovah’s organization, doing God’s will, in order to receive his blessing of everlasting life.—Psalm 133:1-3

In a sense some of this is true. there will only be one church that survives the oncomming tribulation. But that church doesn't exist today.e that church will be made up of those saints of god who come out of the denominations into a new chruch. that new chruch is called two things in the b ible there are 2 types of it. the bride of christ and t he manchild of revelation.

Revelation 19:7 Let us be glad and rejoice, and give honour to him: for the marriage of the Lamb is come, and his wife hath made herself ready.
made ready means made perfect. When the spirit of the lord comes down like the rain and god raises up a standard against the enemy those that enter into to that move of God will be perfected by the purifiying power of God's spirit.

here is another type of the same thing.

Revelation 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast down to the earth, he persecuted the woman that brought forth the man child.

Revelation 12:5 And she was delivered of a son, a man child, who is to rule all the nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and unto his throne.

the manchild is raptured (bride of christ) the woman of revelation (the church) misses the rapture because it rejected the manifestation of gods spirit just as the phrasiees did.
notice the first verse.

Revelation 12:1 And a great sign was seen in heaven: a woman arrayed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars;

Thats the church and it gets chased into the wilderness to a place preppared for it by God. the moon represents the ot because it reflects the true light which is Jesus christ.

now .

 

[rowena]

Extra Ecclesiam Nulla Salus; "Outside the Church there is no salvation" is a doctrine of the Roman Catholic faith.

"There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which no one at all is saved." (Pope Innocent III, Fourth Lateran Council, 1215.)

"We declare, say, define, and pronounce that it is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff." (Pope Boniface VIII, the Bull Unam Sanctam, 1302).

"There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which no one at all is saved." (Lateran Council IV, 1215)

I think we can be assured that "Church" as used here, means the Roman Catholic Church exclusively. These quotes are from www. catholicism.org.

This is a recent post from the OBOB and it quotes from the Cathecism of the Catholic Church. At the time those quotes were made the only groups around that weren't Catholic were either heretical or the Orthodox Church. The heretical groups were groups that even today wouldn't be considered saved by most Christians. As for the Orthodox Church, from what I understand at the time neither Church thought the other was saved.

I highly recommend that anyone that has a question about what Catholics really believe to go ask it in OBOB. The denominational forums now have special subforums where even nonChristians can ask questions.

 

[Robbie_James_Francis]

This is a recent post from the OBOB and it quotes from the Cathecism of the Catholic Church.

A very good post to link to. The understanding of what the "Church" is, is not as simple as it may appear. As it says in my sig, "Outside of the Church there is no salvation, but where the boundaries of that Church are only God can say." Another excellent quote about the matter is this: "We can be certain where the Church is, but we cannot say where It is not."

All those in whom the Grace of God, by the superabundant Merit of Christ, is working and being co-operated with by freewill--moved by Grace--can be said to be mystically united to the Church, the Body of Christ. Furthermore, among the baptised, there exists a material unity though it can still truly be said that, "the fullness of Christ's Church subsists solely in the Catholic Church."

 

[Peterson]

I think if you ask your local priest, and if he is honest with you, he will point out that in order to be saved, one must be catechized and baptised into the Roman Church. Currently there is this effort at ecumenism among trinitarianism, but even so, the Vatican refers to Protestants as "departed brethren," which implies they must return to Rome, if they have any hope at all. Rome emphatically claims to be the only representative of God on earth.

 

[rowena]

I think if you ask your local priest, and if he is honest with you, he will point out that in order to be saved, one must be catechized and baptised into the Roman Church. Currently there is this effort at ecumenism among trinitarianism, but even so, the Vatican refers to Protestants as "departed brethren," which implies they must return to Rome, if they have any hope at all. Rome emphatically claims to be the only representative of God on earth.

That might be what it implies to you, but to me it implies exactly what it says. That we are still their brothers and sisters in Christ even though we have choosen to depart or seperate ourselves from the Catholic Church. I have never found a Catholic who would tell me I wasn't saved, but I've met plenty of Protestants who would tell me I wasn't or would tell a Catholic they weren't.

 

[eksesar]

Which is exactly the same stance as the Jehovah's Witnesses.
We only try to supply ones with information to make an informed choice because we are commanded to go forth and make disciples, disciples for Jehovah not the WBTS which contrary to popular beief we ourselves are not.
We belong to no man or group of men we are Jehovah God's and his alone. We are a group which recognizes the men who write articles as Godly men trying to lead and teach all men to get a knowledge of Jehovah. They are as fallibly as any men but and it is a big but they recognize they are responsible and will be held accountable before Jehovah so they do their utmost to be accurate in all they write and speak. We beieve we have a correct understanding but then all of those who are not JWs also feel they are the ones with the correct understanding hence the division which exist among men.
Agape', TB

Yup, Governing Body of Jehovah's Witness who wrote that and PUBLISHED IT to the whole members in the Watchtower.

Sounds Like Sugar Coated Doctrines to me and contradited with the bible itself.

Same as Watchtower Prophecies which are never happenned or occured, then published it thru Watchtower Magazines. 6000 years blaaa....blaaa.blaaaa...., Few years again the world would end. etc. Sounds like False Prophets in DEUT 18:18-22

BTW, you still believing in Watchtower Society who said that. and The society said if you are NOT the Annoited one, such and such.

 

[eksesar]

Which is exactly the same stance as the Jehovah's Witnesses.
We only try to supply ones with information to make an informed choice because we are commanded to go forth and make disciples, disciples for Jehovah not the WBTS which contrary to popular beief we ourselves are not.
We belong to no man or group of men we are Jehovah God's and his alone. We are a group which recognizes the men who write articles as Godly men trying to lead and teach all men to get a knowledge of Jehovah. They are as fallibly as any men but and it is a big but they recognize they are responsible and will be held accountable before Jehovah so they do their utmost to be accurate in all they write and speak. We beieve we have a correct understanding but then all of those who are not JWs also feel they are the ones with the correct understanding hence the division which exist among men.
Agape', TB

You can't do that by Man-Made Rules Organization.

You CAN do that if you knew Whole Bible.

 

[eksesar]

Where is JW defender

Hi TB, where are you.

Have you seen my topic that Watchtower said 1918 ?
here is the link.

http://www.christianforums.com/t2223104-watchtower-and-1918-predictions.html


I guess you can't avoid this, this just make Watchtower a false prophets among us as written in the bible in DEUT 18:18-22.

I think you can't defend it.

any denial from you TB ?