Was waiting worth it for you?

[seeingeyes]

I don't quite understand amicable divorces. I mean it is obviously the best way to divorce, and I support the concept of using mediation and mutual respect to maximize both parties' happiness. It's definitely the mature way to handle a separation, especially with children because the parenting relationship is on-going, and it's an improvement over the typically nasty divorces our parents' generation had.

But if I was able to get along with someone like that, I'd just want to salvage the marriage in the first place!

On the other hand, it's always a lot easier to get along with someone who doesn't live at your house.

 

[Kylie]

Yeah, I've heard that before. But I don't agree. I think a person can adjust their needs, and accommodate their spouse, if that's their priority. I mean let's face it, if we just pursued our wants and perceived needs, it would be like falling down an abyss trying to get to the bottom of it. We're unquenchable. I think it's more about being content and focusing on our responsibilities and appreciating what we have, than pursuing some romantic "need." Not to mention that a couple has obviously found romantic fulfillment at some point. The potential is there. It seems like an amicable relationship is a pretty friendly environment for pursuing it, compared to what many struggling marriages face.

How can a person adjust their needs?

And even if a person can, why should they? Why should I have to change to be the person my husband wants me to be? If he can't accept me as I am, then that's his problem, not mine.

And besides, if I changed who I am, then how could I possibly be the girl he fell in love with?

I far prefer to see it as you find someone who you love, and then you learn to accept the little things about them that aren't what you were after. My husband's a pilot. I hate flying. If I had the opportunity to choose, I never would have chosen a pilot as a partner. But I fell in love with him for a whole variety of reasons, and I learnt that him being a pilot is something that wasn't a deal-breaker. So I live with it. I don't change to be someone who likes flying. I don't expect him to change to be someone who doesn't fly. I accept that he is, and he accepts that I don't like flying. And we live with it.

But if it was something that WAS a deal-breaker, say he didn't enjoy sex and had no interest in having sex with me. I couldn't live with that. I need sex in a romantic relationship in order to be fulfilled. So what would I do? Demand that he goes against his nature and give me the amount of sex I want? Or should I go against my nature and live in an unfulfilling relationship? Or should I cheat on him and find my sex behind his back? None of those options are fair to either one of us. By far the bet option is to end the relationship. And if we go into a platonic friendship that has no expectation of sex, then why wouldn't that kind of relationship work well for us?

 

[peckaboo]

I didn't wait; my husband did.

Once or twice he's mentioned that he wonders what it would have been like to have a "wilder" youth, but he also says he feels some remorse over the things he did do, so I think it's more curiosity that he feels than any real, persistent regret that he didn't sleep with more women.

For my part, I wish I'd waited. Partly because it caused some problems in my marriage, but partly just because I feel like I gave myself a bad deal. At the time I thought the body was just cells and tissue and it didn't matter what you did with it, but now I believe it's more than that, and I wish I'd treated it with more respect. I slept with people for the stupidest reasons - I felt sorry for them, or they made me feel pretty, or I felt obligated. The biggest effect on our marriage from my own point of view was that my earlier experiences gave me a particular idea of what was "normal" in a sexual relationship. It turned out that there's really no such thing - everybody has their own "normal" - but I brought a certain set of expectations to the marriage bed that ended up being arduous and somewhat painful to work through. Not direct comparisons of size or technique or whatever, more like a general impression of how sex was "supposed to be". Now we have a great sex life and don't think about that stuff, but it added some extra stress / heartache to the already stressful first year of marriage.

 

[Audiomechanic]

I'm going to get dishonest answers due to people not wanting to admit this if their spouse also visits the board...

But anyways, I was curious if the wait before marriage for sex was worth it for you? Or if it sex ended up being overrated/you felt a slight regret for what you missed out on waiting?

Also for those who didn't wait for marriage, do you feel the previous relationships/encounters you were involved with were positive experiences overall? Or was it horrible for you?

I didn't wait to have sex before marriage, but my wife did. She was a virgin.

My previous sexual experiences were...."meh." Sex now is 1000 better (not kidding).

My wife and I never had sex with each other before marriage and I'm glad for that, because she was a virgin and that was important to her. Therefore, it became important to me.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

I don't quite understand amicable divorces. I mean it is obviously the best way to divorce, and I support the concept of using mediation and mutual respect to maximize both parties' happiness. It's definitely the mature way to handle a separation, especially with children because the parenting relationship is on-going, and it's an improvement over the typically nasty divorces our parents' generation had.

But if I was able to get along with someone like that, I'd just want to salvage the marriage in the first place!

It's easier to have an amicable divorce sometimes than an amicable marriage. When we were married, we were miserable. The only thing that made us not miserable was the mutual realization it wasn't working and it wasn't going to work. After spending years trying to beat a square peg into a round hole, the overwhelming relief, satisfaction, and peace that came in knowing it was now done, we could move on, and everybody was fine with it was what changed everything.

Saying that because we were able to get along during the divorce that we could have salvaged the relationship or make it work is like saying because I'm friends with somebody, we would be great a great husband and wife duo. But that's not the case.

It's very easy to get along with somebody when the promise of never having to deal with them again if you don't want to is just on the horizon.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Yeah, I've heard that before. But I don't agree. I think a person can adjust their needs, and accommodate their spouse, if that's their priority. I mean let's face it, if we just pursued our wants and perceived needs, it would be like falling down an abyss trying to get to the bottom of it. We're unquenchable. I think it's more about being content and focusing on our responsibilities and appreciating what we have, than pursuing some romantic "need." Not to mention that a couple has obviously found romantic fulfillment at some point. The potential is there. It seems like an amicable relationship is a pretty friendly environment for pursuing it, compared to what many struggling marriages face.

Again, it's not like an amicable divorce means you were amicably married. You make it seem like amicable divorce means the marriage wasn't good or bad, and just one day, people decided to divorce.

I can promise that if we'd said "hey, this divorce is going great, we are getting along great, let's try being married again" we would have ended up where we were again. This idea that the divorce happened because one or both put their needs before the other and "if only" people would be more giving, "if only" they'd do this, "if only" they'd do that makes it seem like the reason for the marital failure isn't because there was a real, insurmountable issue... It was they lacked the sanctimony required to apply an "if only."

 

[akmom]

I guess I can understand it in terms of being amicable to make the end goal easier. From your description, the conversation just sounded like concessions and agreeability coming from a place of genuine love and concern or even endearment.

I was just at a family picnic for my daughter's school, and was surprised to see one of the families sitting together - both parents and the kids - just like a regular family, having a good time. I thought, "Good for them," because I knew the parents had been divorced for a long time and at least one was remarried. But apparently they were able to attend school functions for their kids with a "family like" demeanor, and I'm sure that was nice for the kids.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

I guess I can understand it in terms of being amicable to make the end goal easier. From your description, the conversation just sounded like concessions and agreeability coming from a place of genuine love and concern or even endearment.

Genuine love? No. Concern? Yes. Endearment? I'm not sure if that's the word I'd use, but a sense of past loyalty and connection as a reason to not be a big a-hole during the divorce we both want? I think that's fair.

It's the difference between "I love you enough to be married to you" and "I like you enough to not want to be a jerk to you." We were in the latter grouping, knowing if we'd stayed married, it wouldn't have worked. The marriage was not salvageable and hadn't been for some time. I didn't want to take him to the cleaners, and he didn't want to see me ruined because there was a sense of concern for each other... At the same time, though, we very definitely didn't want to be married to each other because there were some huge, unfixable issues that would always pop up.

I was just at a family picnic for my daughter's school, and was surprised to see one of the families sitting together - both parents and the kids - just like a regular family, having a good time. I thought, "Good for them," because I knew the parents had been divorced for a long time and at least one was remarried. But apparently they were able to attend school functions for their kids with a "family like" demeanor, and I'm sure that was nice for the kids.

We've tried to start doing stuff like this for the kids from my husband's first marriage, after years upon years of his ex, him, and me just not getting along. I'm not sure we'd qualify as friends, but we are friendly. We (him and his ex) exchange social texts maybe 2-3 times a week now, when we had the kids she was invited over to watch them do an egg hunt for Easter that we were doing, when we went to baseball to watch them she invited me to dinner so the kids could play. BFFs? No, but the kids are much better off to see us as a unified front. Maybe one day we'll progress to friends, though I'm pretty sure my husband would prefer we didn't (I'm on the fence... Some days I am OK with it, other days, not so much. I suspect she's much the same).

The point is, there is always a reason behind the divorce, but that reason doesn't necessarily carry over to being civil, even friendly, maybe even to a degree loyal or concerned for the other. It falls under the fact that I'm sure we know lots of people we would rather not see bad things happen to, but on the same coin, would certainly not want to be married to.

 

[hitops]

I'm going to get dishonest answers due to people not wanting to admit this if their spouse also visits the board...

But anyways, I was curious if the wait before marriage for sex was worth it for you? Or if it sex ended up being overrated/you felt a slight regret for what you missed out on waiting?

Also for those who didn't wait for marriage, do you feel the previous relationships/encounters you were involved with were positive experiences overall? Or was it horrible for you?

I'll be honest with you (no spouse on board). I have no clue whether waiting was worth it. Sex is mediocre, and if could go back in time, I would probably just avoid meeting my current wife and look for someone else. Or, if for some reason in this sci-fi plot fantasy I could go back and was bound to marry her again (or turn into a pumpkin), I would probably just have as much sex as possible until meeting her again.

That said, it's possible all the pre-marital sex would have been 'meh' as well. I have no way of knowing. And there are other consequences, primarily emotional (but some physical), to pre-marital sex.

There is one profound, most important truth I want to share with you: It has nothing to do with whether you wait or not, what matters is the partner. If she a loving, caring, attractive, self-motivated person, sex will be great. If she's not, it won't. It has nothing to do with the timing, and little/nothing to do with how much sex you had before.

My wife and I have fairly frequent (2-3x week), fairly uninspiring sex. Occasionally, it's fantastic. Why is that? It all comes down to whether she wants it or not. On the rare occasions that she is horny and engaged - it's amazing and fulfilling. The rest of the time, I'm not sure she even wants me around. Why is she sometimes interested and sometimes not? There is no telling - only the person themselves can decide they are motivated, nobody else.

But there are clues, and these clues can help you truly make a wise decision in your partner. You cannot change a lazy unmotivated, fickle and uncaring partner. What you can do is avoid picking one in the first place.

A motivated, loving, Christ-like, caring, attentive, friendly, sacrificial, obedient, humble woman will be a great sexual partner. It doesn't matter if the wedding night is a hilarious awkward non-starter. She is a gem, and her desire to love you will eventually make sex an amazing and bonding experience.

Easy right? Wrong, since 90%+ of even church-going, Christian women are not that woman, and you can't easily know who is. The following are clues to help. These are not magical or sound-bite worthy, they are just accurate and borne of experience:
- How much time does she spend watching TV?
- How much does she like to eat out?
- Does she hit the gym?
- Does she like to gossip?
- When bored for 5 or more seconds, does this require her to stare into her phone until something worthy of attention appears?
- Does she sleep in?
- Does she serve others in any significant way that does not include a paycheck?
- Does she have a good relationship with her parents?
- Do her parents have a great relationship
- Is her mom a sacrificial, loving, sweet, attractive, soft-spoken, ladylike women of God? (ALERT: Jackpot criteria here, DON'T MISS)
- Does she complain a lot about others, work, situations etc?

This is the most important decision of your life. Don't settle for a typical north american self-indulgent, directionless, overweight complainer with a token verbal acceptance of being Christian. Find a real woman who models herself on Christ.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

Well... Awkward silence...

LoL!

 

[Ascendo]

I'll be honest with you (no spouse on board). I have no clue whether waiting was worth it. Sex is mediocre, and if could go back in time, I would probably just avoid meeting my current wife and look for someone else. Or, if for some reason in this sci-fi plot fantasy I could go back and was bound to marry her again (or turn into a pumpkin), I would probably just have as much sex as possible until meeting her again.

That said, it's possible all the pre-marital sex would have been 'meh' as well. I have no way of knowing. And there are other consequences, primarily emotional (but some physical), to pre-marital sex.

There is one profound, most important truth I want to share with you: It has nothing to do with whether you wait or not, what matters is the partner. If she a loving, caring, attractive, self-motivated person, sex will be great. If she's not, it won't. It has nothing to do with the timing, and little/nothing to do with how much sex you had before.

My wife and I have fairly frequent (2-3x week), fairly uninspiring sex. Occasionally, it's fantastic. Why is that? It all comes down to whether she wants it or not. On the rare occasions that she is horny and engaged - it's amazing and fulfilling. The rest of the time, I'm not sure she even wants me around. Why is she sometimes interested and sometimes not? There is no telling - only the person themselves can decide they are motivated, nobody else.

But there are clues, and these clues can help you truly make a wise decision in your partner. You cannot change a lazy unmotivated, fickle and uncaring partner. What you can do is avoid picking one in the first place.

A motivated, loving, Christ-like, caring, attentive, friendly, sacrificial, obedient, humble woman will be a great sexual partner. It doesn't matter if the wedding night is a hilarious awkward non-starter. She is a gem, and her desire to love you will eventually make sex an amazing and bonding experience.

Easy right? Wrong, since 90%+ of even church-going, Christian women are not that woman, and you can't easily know who is. The following are clues to help. These are not magical or sound-bite worthy, they are just accurate and borne of experience:
- How much time does she spend watching TV?
- How much does she like to eat out?
- Does she hit the gym?
- Does she like to gossip?
- When bored for 5 or more seconds, does this require her to stare into her phone until something worthy of attention appears?
- Does she sleep in?
- Does she serve others in any significant way that does not include a paycheck?
- Does she have a good relationship with her parents?
- Do her parents have a great relationship
- Is her mom a sacrificial, loving, sweet, attractive, soft-spoken, ladylike women of God? (ALERT: Jackpot criteria here, DON'T MISS)
- Does she complain a lot about others, work, situations etc?

This is the most important decision of your life. Don't settle for a typical north american self-indulgent, directionless, overweight complainer with a token verbal acceptance of being Christian. Find a real woman who models herself on Christ.

You have an attitude problem.

Do some dishes. Make her breakfast. Tell her she's beautiful. Write her a love letter.

Stop being a whiny entitled boy.

 

[Inkachu]

Seriously...

 

[akmom]

I have to seriously disagree with considering her mother's character or her parents' relationship when seeking a wife. Women do not necessarily model their mothers. Good women can forge their lives despite awful mothers, and good mothers can produce selfish daughters. You aren't marrying her mother, and you aren't inheriting the parents' relationship.

It's a shame that so many men and women are bothered by attributes in their spouse that they didn't consider before marriage. But you can't consider everything, or predict every behavior that might grow to annoy you. And even if you could know all the criteria for your perfect spouse, I don't think you'd find that person. We are all full of flaws. But it takes a godly man to model Christ and love his wife more than his own body, like Christ loved the church.

I really think marital happiness is less about selecting the right spouse, and more about making yourself the perfect spouse, which will inspire the same in your spouse. I don't know how much a man would appreciate it, but I recommend the book Green Dolphin Street by Elizabeth Goudge. It is not an explicitly Christian novel, but it shows how two people who definitely chose the wrong spouse learned to have peace and happiness and eventually love, by forfeiting their needs and devoting themselves to the other person. I think it's very close to what God expects of us as Christians - not just in marriage, but with people in general.

 

[Kylie]

I have to seriously disagree with considering her mother's character or her parents' relationship when seeking a wife. Women do not necessarily model their mothers. Good women can forge their lives despite awful mothers, and good mothers can produce selfish daughters. You aren't marrying her mother, and you aren't inheriting the parents' relationship.

Couldn't agree more. I tend to over think things, which is very much the opposite of my mum's "live in the moment" attitude.

 

[SiyoNqoba]

Why is she sometimes interested and sometimes not?

Probably because you call her a porker, consider sex with her mediocre and make her feel awful about herself.

Just a hunch.

 

[favoritetoyisjoy]

When you're a "one and only" couple there is nothing to compare to, sex is forever the best you ever had, thank God. And if your spouse is the love of your life, sex is everything and always what God intended it to be, beautiful, profound, sacred, bonding, spiritual, special, and I could go on and on.

I couldn't have asked for more and I never have.

 

[Inkachu]

I have to seriously disagree with considering her mother's character or her parents' relationship when seeking a wife. Women do not necessarily model their mothers.

This. My personality is completely opposite of my mother.

When you're a "one and only" couple there is nothing to compare to, sex is forever the best you ever had, thank God. And if your spouse is the love of your life, sex is everything and always what God intended it to be, beautiful, profound, sacred, bonding, spiritual, special, and I could go on and on.

I couldn't have asked for more and I never have.

How beautiful

 

[favoritetoyisjoy]

This. My personality is completely opposite of my mother.



How beautiful

Thanks!

 

[Inkachu]

My name is Stephanie Lewis and I'm a casting director in NYC. I wanted to reach out because we are working with a major cable network on a new series about committed couples ages 35 and over who have yet to consummate their relationships.

Each couple will have the opportunity to go on a weekend-long intimacy retreat with world renowned Christian relationship experts as they work together on their journeys. Whether you have chosen abstinence for spiritual, medical, or emotional reasons, we will work with two committed people who are interested in taking the next steps in their relationship. The goal of this retreat and the ultimate series is to build a strong foundation as each couple embarks on a new and exciting chapter. If you would like the chance to work with the best sexual therapists in the country to enhance your emotional and physical life with your partner, this opportunity is for you.

For more information and to talk to a casting director, please email RelationshipRetreatCasting at gmail dot com

You've posted this half a dozen times in various areas of the site. Not only is this spamming and against the rules, but you're very careful with your wording... "committed couples" rather than "married couples". Shameful.

 

[DannLeavitt]

I'll be honest with you (no spouse on board). I have no clue whether waiting was worth it. Sex is mediocre, and if could go back in time, I would probably just avoid meeting my current wife and look for someone else. Or, if for some reason in this sci-fi plot fantasy I could go back and was bound to marry her again (or turn into a pumpkin), I would probably just have as much sex as possible until meeting her again.

That said, it's possible all the pre-marital sex would have been 'meh' as well. I have no way of knowing. And there are other consequences, primarily emotional (but some physical), to pre-marital sex.

There is one profound, most important truth I want to share with you: It has nothing to do with whether you wait or not, what matters is the partner. If she a loving, caring, attractive, self-motivated person, sex will be great. If she's not, it won't. It has nothing to do with the timing, and little/nothing to do with how much sex you had before.

My wife and I have fairly frequent (2-3x week), fairly uninspiring sex. Occasionally, it's fantastic. Why is that? It all comes down to whether she wants it or not. On the rare occasions that she is horny and engaged - it's amazing and fulfilling. The rest of the time, I'm not sure she even wants me around. Why is she sometimes interested and sometimes not? There is no telling - only the person themselves can decide they are motivated, nobody else.

But there are clues, and these clues can help you truly make a wise decision in your partner. You cannot change a lazy unmotivated, fickle and uncaring partner. What you can do is avoid picking one in the first place.

A motivated, loving, Christ-like, caring, attentive, friendly, sacrificial, obedient, humble woman will be a great sexual partner. It doesn't matter if the wedding night is a hilarious awkward non-starter. She is a gem, and her desire to love you will eventually make sex an amazing and bonding experience.

Easy right? Wrong, since 90%+ of even church-going, Christian women are not that woman, and you can't easily know who is. The following are clues to help. These are not magical or sound-bite worthy, they are just accurate and borne of experience:
- How much time does she spend watching TV?
- How much does she like to eat out?
- Does she hit the gym?
- Does she like to gossip?
- When bored for 5 or more seconds, does this require her to stare into her phone until something worthy of attention appears?
- Does she sleep in?
- Does she serve others in any significant way that does not include a paycheck?
- Does she have a good relationship with her parents?
- Do her parents have a great relationship
- Is her mom a sacrificial, loving, sweet, attractive, soft-spoken, ladylike women of God? (ALERT: Jackpot criteria here, DON'T MISS)
- Does she complain a lot about others, work, situations etc?

This is the most important decision of your life. Don't settle for a typical north american self-indulgent, directionless, overweight complainer with a token verbal acceptance of being Christian. Find a real woman who models herself on Christ.

??? Are you serious? Was this meant to be a joke?

It sounds like your wife might have some problems with her self-image, and based on the description that you have given of her, it's not much of a wonder why. That breaks my heart. I'd really love to see the wedding vows that you COMMITTED AND PROMISED TO ADHERE TO and see if there was anything in there about unconditional love. Christians are supposed to show that kind of love to EVERYONE, not to mention their wives.

But unfortunately you've fallen into the trap of blaming her for everything. Let's look.

A motivated, loving, Christ-like, caring, attentive, friendly, sacrificial, obedient, humble woman will be a great sexual partner.

Honestly, I don't think a Christ-like character makes you any better in bed. In fact, none of this matters when it comes to sex partners. How come people out in the world are able to have "good sex" without any of these qualities? They don't have anything to do with sex.

My wife and I have fairly frequent (2-3x week), fairly uninspiring sex. Occasionally, it's fantastic. Why is that? It all comes down to whether she wants it or not.

Okay, so you're having sex against her will. If someone were having sex with me when I didn't want to have sex, it would probably end a lot worse than you are dealing with. If sex is so bad, then stop forcing her to have sex when she doesn't want to, and then maybe things will get a little better.
FYI, many married couples confidently report without shame that they have sex roughly once a week. For you to be having "fairly frequent uninspiring sex" 2-3x a week means your wife is a lot more passive than most. How about giving her a break..?

- How much time does she spend watching TV?
- How much does she like to eat out?
- Does she hit the gym?
- Does she like to gossip?
- When bored for 5 or more seconds, does this require her to stare into her phone until something worthy of attention appears?
- Does she sleep in?
- Does she serve others in any significant way that does not include a paycheck?
- Does she have a good relationship with her parents?
- Do her parents have a great relationship
- Is her mom a sacrificial, loving, sweet, attractive, soft-spoken, ladylike women of God? (ALERT: Jackpot criteria here, DON'T MISS)
- Does she complain a lot about others, work, situations etc?

A wife that fits all these criteria is a figment of your imagination. What kind of question is "Does she sleep in"? Don't we all? And you are complaining that she complains about others, work, situations etc? Hypocrite! You are supposed to be the one she is able to confide in, yet you turn it around and call her an un-godly wife for being a human.

My word. When you got married, you gave wedding vows. Those vows were supposed to be the conditions to a life-long covenant between you and your wife. If your wife is truly lazy, then you obviously didn't take the time to get to know her well enough before you got married. And even still, there are much better ways to address these problems without being emotionally abusive to your wife.

Ephesians 5:25-33 [ESV]
25 Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, 26 that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, 27 so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish.[a] 28 In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, 30 because we are members of his body. 31 “Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.” 32 This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church. 33 However, let each one of you love his wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband.

The Bible is pretty clear. In fact, I would say the ending line here indicates that a wife can't even see anything respectable in her husband until he loves her as he loves himself. Show your wife some real true love. That doesn't mean sex, it means give her your full attention and respect.