Was the Last Supper a Seder?

AbbaLove

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If you are done kvetching, could you answer my original question, please?
See #454 for answer ... Maybe, you also missed Hark's misinterpretation of "between the evenings" as contradicting the Torah of GOD (Exodus 12:9-10) ... any parts of the roasted lamb that aren't eaten are to be burned before morning (of Nisan 14) ...

Exodus 12:9-10 (CJB)
9 Don’t eat it raw or boiled, but roasted in the fire, with its head, the lower parts of its legs and its inner organs.
10 Let nothing of it remain till morning; if any of it does remain, burn it up completely.

The OP's understanding of "between the evenings" is contradicting Yahweh's instruction ... "Let nothing of it remain till morning". Hark has misinterpreted "between the [two] evenings" as the second evening is still during the night of Nisan 14 according the the Word of Yahweh (Exodus 12:10).
The Passover lamb is to be slaughtered between the evenings. Passover begins at sundown at the end of the 13th. This begins the 14th. Passover ends at the evening of the 15th. The Passover lamb must be slaughtered between these two evenings.
WRONG!
It's as literal as can be from the command of Yahweh (Exodus 12:10) that the slaying, roasting and eating is done during the night ... before morning. Is Hark the one that is "kvetching" or is he blind to the literal command of Yahweh?


 
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GedaliahMaegil

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See #454 for answer ...

All right, I'll be blunt.

Whether he is right or he is wrong, you are pursuing his posts with targeted kvetching, seemingly for the sake of kvetching. You also speak to other posters, giving not only what you think of his posts but also what you've judged his character to be. That is לשון הרע , and it's not profitable.

If you want to lecture on Torah, look to yourself first.
 
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pinacled

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See #454 for answer ... Maybe, you also missed Hark's misinterpretation of "between the evenings" as contradicting the Torah of GOD (Exodus 12:9-10) ... any parts of the roasted lamb that aren't eaten are to be burned before morning (of Nisan 14) ...

Exodus 12:9-10 (CJB)
9 Don’t eat it raw or boiled, but roasted in the fire, with its head, the lower parts of its legs and its inner organs.
10 Let nothing of it remain till morning; if any of it does remain, burn it up completely.

The OP's understanding of "between the evenings" is contradicting Yahweh's instruction ... "Let nothing of it remain till morning". Hark has misinterpreted "between the [two] evenings" as the second evening is still during the night of Nisan 14 according the the Word of Yahweh (Exodus 12:10).

WRONG!
It's as literal as can be from the command of Yahweh (Exodus 12:10) that the slaying, roasting and eating is done during the night ... before morning. Is Hark the one that is "kvetching" or is he blind to the literal command of Yahweh?


Everyone reading here sees that magnolia and kevherk are desperate for water
 
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AbbaLove

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Whether he is right or he is wrong, you are pursuing his posts with targeted kvetching, seemingly for the sake of kvetching.
When it comes to one of the most significant Feasts Of The LORD, it's not helpful when Hark puts forth a Pesach timeline for the slaying of the lambs "between the evenings" that we've never heard of before and that's no kvetching. Do you actually think Hark's "between the evenings" timeline for slaying the lambs is any where close to the literal meaning of the Torah.

Where can you find Hark's timeline for slaying the lambs in any Messianic or Rabbinic Jewish commentary. Hark's timeline for slaying the lambs is so far-fetched that even the Talmud would view it as heretical so it doesn't qualify as "kvetching" (trivial whining).

You guys should've seen a red flag when Hark decided to serve up this breaking curve ball as if he could get it past us without notice ... "the end of the evening of the 15th" ... as the second evening with the first evening beginning at "sundown at the end of the 13th". Do you interpret Hark's timeline to be a 24 hr day when lambs can be slaughtered (Exodus 12:6). Apparently Hark doesn't take into account the literal meaning of Exodus 12:10 after the lambs are roasted and eaten the night of the 14th ...

10 You shall not reserve any of it until the morning. And what is left of it until the morning you shall burn with fire. (CLV)​

Hark is obviously misinterpreting the timeline for the slaying of the lambs. He needs to be challenged, so others aren't so easily misled and that's no kvetching (whining). Especially when we're discussing such an important Jewish festival as the Passover Feast Of The LORD.

Exodus 12:14 (CJB)
“‘This will be a day for you to remember and celebrate as a festival to Adonai; from generation to generation you are to celebrate it by a perpetual regulation.​
 
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AbbaLove

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Between The Evenings ... בין שני ערבים ... Ben Ha Arbayim

Hark is deviating from the instructions of the Word of Elohim and that's NO kvetching.

When Hark is wrong, Hark is wrong! Hark is mistaken if he actually thinks "between the evenings" is ... "between sundown at the end of the 13th" and "the end of the evening of the 15th"
The Passover lamb is to be slaughtered between the evenings. Passover begins at sundown at the end of the 13th. This begins the 14th. Passover ends at the evening of the 15th. The Passover lamb must be slaughtered between these two evenings.
Can you guys not see that his timeline of "between the evenings" contradicts Elohim's literal instruction? How does Hark reckon Exodus 12:10 (he doesn't) ...

Exodus 12:10 (CJB)10 Let nothing of it remain till morning; if any of it does remain, burn it up completely.​

Why did Hark write "the end of the evening of the 15th" instead of "sundown at the end of the 14th" ? Do you guys not realize Hark is pulling the wool over your eyes? So who's pulling the wool over Hark's eyes?

Where can you find Hark's timeline in any Messianic or Rabbinic Jewish commentary. Hark's timeline for slaying the lambs is so far-fetched that even the Talmud would view it as heretical so it doesn't qualify as "kvetching" (trivial whining).
 
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AbbaLove

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Deflection isn't going to help. Is what you're doing לשון הרע or not? Yes or no?
Definitely NOT (NO) when it comes to trusting the Word of Yahweh instead of Hark's misinterpreted timeline of "between the evenings" when the lamb's are to be slaughtered, roasted, eaten and any remains burned before the morning of Nisan 14. The Israelites are to be in haste (Exodus 12:11) so why would they be still slaying lambs beyond the morning of the 14th when that is contrary and לשון הרע to the Torah of Yahweh ...

Exodus 12:7-8, 11 (CLV)
7 They will take some of the blood and put it on the two jambs and on the lintel, on the houses in which they are eating it. 8 Then they will eat the flesh on this night, roasted with fire, and with unleavened cakes; over bitter herbs shall they eat it.
8 Then they will eat the flesh on this night, roasted with fire, and with unleavened cakes; over bitter herbs shall they eat it.
11 And thus shall you eat it, with your waist girded, your sandals on your feet and your stick in your hand. You will eat it in nervous haste. It is the passover to Yahweh.
The Passover lamb is to be slaughtered between the evenings. Passover begins at sundown at the end of the 13th. This begins the 14th. Passover ends at the evening of the 15th. The Passover lamb must be slaughtered between these two evenings.
Does Hark really believe "between the evenings" is a 24 hour window? What Hark doesn't take into account is that the blood from the slaughtered lambs is to be put on the "lintel and two jambs" (CLV) before midnight of the 14th. That in itself invalidates Hark's interpretation of "between the evenings" as bogus.

Exodus 12:24-27 (CLV)
24 Now you will observe this word as a statute for you and for your sons unto the eon. 25 It will come to be when you are entering to the land which Yahweh is giving to you just as He spoke, then you will observe this service. 26 And it will come to be when your sons are saying to you: What is this service to you? 27 Then you will say: It is the sacrifice of passover to Yahweh, Who passed over the houses of the sons of Israel in Egypt, when He struck the Egyptians, yet our households He rescued. So the people bowed their heads and bowed themselves down.
Hark's timeline for "between the evenings" (Exodus 12:6) is not only מְבַלבֵּל it is also defaming to the instruction of Yahweh. Orthodox Judaism would also view Hark's "between the evenings" timeline as לשון הרע as according to the Talmud lambs were only to be slain in the afternoon of Nisan 14 ...

Shemot 12:6 (The Complete Jewish Bible With Rashi Commentary) ...
And you shall keep it for inspection until the fourteenth day of this month, and the entire congregation of the community of Israel shall slaughter it in the afternoon.
בין הערבים AT EVENTIDE — The period beginning at six hours (reckoning from six o’clock in the morning) and hence forward is called בין הערבים (Mekhilta d'Rabbi Yishmael 12:6:5), because the sun then inclines in the direction of the place of its setting to become darkened. The expression בין הערבים appears to me to denote those hours which are between the darkening of the day and the darkening of the night. The darkening of the day is at the beginning of the seventh hour in the day, from when the shadows of evening decline; and the darkening of the night is at the commencement of the night (this period is therefore from noon until the beginning of night). ... commentary by Rashi

Both the pharisaical leaders of the Sanhedrin and Rashi would consider Hark's timeline defaming and heretical. Assuming Hark were Jewish living at the time of Yeshua and he suggested the Sanhedrin take under consideration his "between the evenings" timeline they would show him to the door for what they considered a defamation of their Talmud (oral law).​
 
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HARK!

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Shemot 12:6 (The Complete Jewish Bible With Rashi Commentary) ...
And you shall keep it for inspection until the fourteenth day of this month, and the entire congregation of the community of Israel shall slaughter it in the afternoon.

Clearly, if we were to slaughter the lamb on the afternoon of the 13th; we wouldn't have kept the lamb until the fourteenth. This would be in violation if Torah. The afternoon of the fourteenth is between the evening of the fourteenth, and the evening of the 15th. The evening of the fifteenth begins the first day of Hag Matzot. Unleavened bread is to be eaten for 7 days.

Exodus 12:9-10 (CJB)
9 Don’t eat it raw or boiled, but roasted in the fire, with its head, the lower parts of its legs and its inner organs.
10 Let nothing of it remain till morning; if any of it does remain, burn it up completely.

Burn what? That which remains until morning. That would indicate that it should be burnt after morning arrives.


(CLV) Num 33:3
They journeyed from Rameses in the first month, on the fifteenth day of the first month. On the morrow after the passover the sons of Israel went forth with a high hand before the eyes of all the Egyptians

(CLV) Num 33:4
while the Egyptians were entombing those whom Yahweh had smitten among them, every firstborn, when Yahweh had executed judgments on their elohim.

When did Israel leave Egypt? On the fifteenth. This was right after the death angel passed over them in the evening of the 15th, as the blood of the lamb that was slaughtered in the afternoon, between the evenings of the 14th and the 15th was covering their doors.
 
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pinacled

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The Egyptians perhaps wailed in agony during the begining(evening) of the 14th.
Yet after a consequence decided to first negotiate a similitude of truce before preparing a rest place for their loss and further agony.
A lesson worthy of listening to.
During avail the Egyptians mourned for a single yom(day) or perhaps a certain number of hrs if closely inspected.
The 15th of nisan.
[ 15th nisan evening/morning ]
Giving the chosen a yom as a head start.

While the chosen prepared to leave with unleavened bread matzah during pesach the enemy plotted.

At the decline of the sun(afternoon) before nissan 15, further preparations are in order till traveling during the evening when a certain number of stars give credence, guidance, and provision.

Till Pharoah pursued on a certain yom

Blessings Always
 
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