Volume Levels

[AndrewCS]

Let us look at another component – VOLUME

We visited a church attending their morning service yesterday and the pastor announced he was going to continue preaching on the topic at the evening service so we decided to go which included our four-year-old son.

At the beginning of the evening services, they bring the young ones to the front of the auditorium. We were about four rows back and by the third song, the music was hurting my ears, the kick & snare were drowning out the vocals, the driving guitars we right at the front and also drowning the choir.

More important, if my ears were hurting after a few minutes the concern was that this could not be healthy for our son’s ears (as younger developing ears are more sensitive).

I went down to the front and I could see by the expression on his face that this was way too loud for him. Therefore, we took him outside. The ushers helped to open doors etc and asked why we were going outside and when we explained that it was too loud the ushers told us that several people wear earplugs (including several youth) and offered some to us.

We decided to leave the service and my ears were still sore this morning.

Call me old fashioned but I cannot understand why I see folk cutting their grass with noise protectors over their ears and will then subject themselves to excessive volumes like that in worship.

Certainly if Hymns were at one stage seen as changing the style of worship that does not detract from the physics of the human ear and what decibel levels will cause damage and pain.

In most of the cases I have been exposed to what I would call heavy rock worship (due to beating the drum kit and stomping the guitar overdrive) it goes hand in hand with overkill volume.

I am open to a new style of music but I believe there are certain dictations filtering through here from styles of the world.

Blessings

 

[YahsAncientRestoration]

Im not making an excuse i think its wrong also. But i can tell you that if you have an immature sound board person, or the position of stuff is wrong, they really dont notice a lot of time. Like for example i saw a sound board up in the balcony. Except volume and the highs or lows (i cant remember right now) dont cary well up there. So he had it cranking below, but sounded great to us up in the balcony.

Did you ever let the pastor know in a way that wasnt condemning there style? I probobably would have just told him is there a reason it has to hurt peoples ears while they play.

I dont know, but thanks for bringing up a good point !

 

[ALABALE]

Andrew CS - It never hurts (forgive the pun) to write an e-mail or a letter to the Pastors informing them of your experience.

When I have shared my thoughts with a Pastor I have worded it in a fashion similar to this: "...I really enjoyed your service; the energy, the passion and the song selections. Unfortunately, I was not able to fully appreciate some of the new songs I heard because the music was overpowering the voices." Something to that affect.

Here is where you can share your opinions or ideas, without demeaning or questioning their choice of sound levels.

Many churches don't realize the harm they are doing to their very own congregations, let alone peoples hearing.

 

[SGM4HIM]

You should never have to wear ear plugs in worship service to tolerate it and make it through it. And never be ashamed to mention it or write an email later. Just be sincere and let them know its not the style of music that upsets you but the volume. Chances are someone else has told them this info before and they may need reminding from another source

 

[firechild]

I have very sensitive ears, and i have to wear earplugs during the service i go to even though it isn't that loud. I don't think you should have to, as a safe volume doesn't require it to be quiet, just not painfully loud.

I agree with the above poster that the mix could be the problem. And experienced soundboard person should be able to tell if it's too loud, if the balance is right between the instruments/voices, and if the equalization is causing problems.

An e-mail to your pastor, or talk with the worship leader should help. Letting them know what you are thinking is good. It doesn't mean you're condemning their style of music. And other people are probably feeling much the same way.

 

[lostwithoutu]

The true measure of a skilled musician. How loud to play when.

 

[flightangel777]

Well am sorry that happen and heres what was wrong cheap aquipment thats whats wrong if its hurting your ears the music isn't clear and i would walk out to i know what you mean i have been to meeting like that but since the spirit of God was moving i didn't say anything i would tell you that Hillsong is a great alternative Thay have clear sound qulity plus there a great worship band go check them out on the web also if your interested in online church theres a great site you can go to called
Extream Profitic.com its a great site with lots to do on there plus you can join there online church for free so go check it out God Bless Sister hope your ears feel better.

 

[ElderChris]

Many instrumentalists (and possibly soundmen) may have come out of the world and only know how to play one way....LOUD! And by the way....loud does not equal skilled....loud does not equal worshipful.

In my opinion, it is copying a "rock concert" method in the church to try to make seekers feel welcome. When did we decide that was biblical. Hey ...I'm caught up in it myself...I play the drums in church. I've been through all the scenarios. Bottom line is that there is no reason people should have to leave instead of worshipping. If I had to guess, we probably won't be wearing earplugs in heaven.

My friend had to leave a church because it was too loud for his wife. She had a brain tumor removed two years ago and is subject to headaches. He discussed it with the Pastor but it was basically..."that's the way they play". So he was willing to send someone away from the fellowship instead offending the musicians. Something wrong with that picture.

 

[lostwithoutu]

Many instrumentalists (and possibly soundmen) may have come out of the world and only know how to play one way....LOUD! And by the way....loud does not equal skilled....loud does not equal worshipful.

In my opinion, it is copying a "rock concert" method in the church to try to make seekers feel welcome. When did we decide that was biblical. Hey ...I'm caught up in it myself...I play the drums in church. I've been through all the scenarios. Bottom line is that there is no reason people should have to leave instead of worshipping. If I had to guess, we probably won't be wearing earplugs in heaven.

My friend had to leave a church because it was too loud for his wife. She had a brain tumor removed two years ago and is subject to headaches. He discussed it with the Pastor but it was basically..."that's the way they play". So he was willing to send someone away from the fellowship instead offending the musicians. Something wrong with that picture.

wow , that's messed up. I play drums too and I know how difficult it is to keep volumes down especially for not professional musicians. Or when the juices are flowing but there's a time and place. Even then, there's no need to be annoyingly loud to sound good.

 

[LeadWorship]

Well am sorry that happen and heres what was wrong cheap aquipment thats whats wrong if its hurting your ears the music isn't clear and i would walk out to

Sorry, but a good sound tech can make cheap equipment sound good, It's a culmination of several things: Instrumentalists controlling thier volumes (including percussion-how hard to bang and when), a bad sound tech, or even other people coming in to the church during the week and "listening to cds" through the board. Digital sound boards are great. Get the levels set and make them default and if they get changed, just set them back to your default!

 

[ElderChris]

One solution that I have seen used is this...

Spend the money to give the instrumentalists "in-ear monitors" Then they can have the music as loud as they want and nobody else has to hear it. This will let the overall monitor mix on the platform/stage be much lower. Then you don't need to blast the PA so much to overpower the monitors in the auditorium mix. To make this successful, you also have to drop the overall volume of the drums.....hard to do without some co-operation from the drummer or shielding the drum sound. There are different ways to do this....

I have seen this done at one church.... The drummer was in a room beside the platform with a window in it so the other musicians and vocalists could still see him and make eye contact. The drum volume was totally controlled by the sound system.

Another idea is to create an enclosure for the drums. You can buy or make units like this. This can tone it down also. One thing to be aware of...you need to put ventilation in the enclosure or the drummer will die of heat exhaustion

The easiest thing is a drum shield (which I play behind). I don't know what the numbers are but this cuts the sound down some for sure. You can put some sound absorbing material in there to help also.

If they already have in-ear monitors or some of these solutions, then it's more of a soundman or leadership preference for loud music IMHO.

 

[BergySmalls]

One solution that I have seen used is this...

Spend the money to give the instrumentalists "in-ear monitors" Then they can have the music as loud as they want and nobody else has to hear it. This will let the overall monitor mix on the platform/stage be much lower. Then you don't need to blast the PA so much to overpower the monitors in the auditorium mix. To make this successful, you also have to drop the overall volume of the drums.....hard to do without some co-operation from the drummer or shielding the drum sound. There are different ways to do this....

I have seen this done at one church.... The drummer was in a room beside the platform with a window in it so the other musicians and vocalists could still see him and make eye contact. The drum volume was totally controlled by the sound system.

Another idea is to create an enclosure for the drums. You can buy or make units like this. This can tone it down also. One thing to be aware of...you need to put ventilation in the enclosure or the drummer will die of heat exhaustion

The easiest thing is a drum shield (which I play behind). I don't know what the numbers are but this cuts the sound down some for sure. You can put some sound absorbing material in there to help also.

If they already have in-ear monitors or some of these solutions, then it's more of a soundman or leadership preference for loud music IMHO.

Excellent post. I agree, especially with the problem of main house volume over monitor problem. That is an issue at my church, which is small/medium sized (seats about 250-300). When everyone on stage can finally hear themselves, there is more volume coming from the stage than from the main speakers. It does start with getting the drums under control, and we also have a dB meter that tells us how loud it's getting at the sound booth. Then there is no guess work as to what's too loud. If the dB (decibel, a measure of volume) level gets too high, we have to start turning down. Which I never like because I play guitar and have a Vox AC-30 which loves to be loud

 

[Praising4eva]

I don't necessarily agree it comes down to the instrumentalists. I never have any idea what it sounds like in the auditorium as the sound on stage is so different. We really have to trust the soundies as they do the mixing. Unless I have them in my foldback, I can't hear the musicians on the other side of the stage and they can't hear me. Sometimes I sound right out of place to myself so just have to trust that the soundies have it sounding right 'out there', which they do.

As far as ear-plugs, I am in the same country as the original poster and our church offers ear plugs. Not because it is too loud, though some always think it is while others think it is not loud enough, but because it is now a government agency rule that we must have ear plugs available in churches in this country.

Question for the OP - which city was that church in?

Personally, I think it's great that we are able to claim some rock sounds for our children. Gives them an alternative to listen to that is relevant for their age group yet has clean lyrics.

 

[underthesouthercross]

yeh..i reckon they should surport people...not deaf them too deaf...
i think people should understand..that praise and worship in a church is not a rock concert but its a time to get intimate with God...and havent loud music that sounds like that isnt good at all...

 

[BergySmalls]

I don't necessarily agree it comes down to the instrumentalists. I never have any idea what it sounds like in the auditorium as the sound on stage is so different. We really have to trust the soundies as they do the mixing. Unless I have them in my foldback, I can't hear the musicians on the other side of the stage and they can't hear me. Sometimes I sound right out of place to myself so just have to trust that the soundies have it sounding right 'out there', which they do.

I think that's true for larger churches with in ear monitors, but smaller churches fight excessive stage volume at times. When you have guitar amps and acoustic drums, those have a volume regardless of the front of house mix, so they are out of the sound engineer's control.

The only way to truly give the engineer's total control is to have either a separate drum booth with fully mic'd drums, electronic drums (blah), and all other instruments going directly into the board, also blah. That doesn't sound good and is not an option for many churches.

I think it is just a balancing act of proper stage volume, which can mean a little swallowing of the pride for some musicians, and good sound engineers who know the room and the equipment.

 

[AndrewCS]

Ultimately, it should not be about any of this nonsense.

It should be about GOD.

Personally, this whole thing is very sad. Churches that have signs up offering ear protectors for excessive volumes, please. That is just a band-aid to cover up the real issues.

Compare this to smoking.
Most Christians will say they are anti-smoking because the smoker is defiling the temple of our body.

So, what you think excessive decibels of volume do to our ears. Are our ears not parts of our body?

Perhaps in five to ten years when governments wake up (sadly the churches will wait to be spoon-fed) that the percentage of deafness will cost the states millions and all the other spin offs from the obvious results of pleading ignorance.

On the other hand, we will end up with a whole bunch of deaf Christians seeking faith healing to cure their deafness. I have no doubt that there will be vast amounts of demons cast out all in the name of Jesus.

 

[BergySmalls]

Ultimately, it should not be about any of this nonsense.

It should be about GOD.

Personally, this whole thing is very sad. Churches that have signs up offering ear protectors for excessive volumes, please. That is just a band-aid to cover up the real issues.

Compare this to smoking.
Most Christians will say they are anti-smoking because the smoker is defiling the temple of our body.

So, what you think excessive decibels of volume do to our ears. Are our ears not parts of our body?

Perhaps in five to ten years when governments wake up (sadly the churches will wait to be spoon-fed) that the percentage of deafness will cost the states millions and all the other spin offs from the obvious results of pleading ignorance.

On the other hand, we will end up with a whole bunch of deaf Christians seeking faith healing to cure their deafness. I have no doubt that there will be vast amounts of demons cast out all in the name of Jesus.

That's a bit idealistic and broad sweeping. I have never been in a church where earplugs were needed. I would say those may be 2% of all churches, so saying a whole bunch of Christians are going to be deaf is a bit of a stretch, don't you think? There is going to be more hearing damage done to people because of excessive iPod volume than there will be because of worship music.

It is about God, but how does proper volume management and sound engineering take anything away from God? And what are the real issues ear protection is covering up? And what does casting out demons have anything to do with this topic?

 

[SGM4HIM]

It is about God, but how does proper volume management and sound engineering take anything away from God? And what are the real issues ear protection is covering up?

Proper volume management and sound engineering does not take anything away from God. I'm not sure what percent are too loud.

Another problem is going to a church service to be ministered by a nationally known group that is on tour. Many times they bring their own sound team. I have been to 2 church services involving well known groups where my ears where ringing the next day. I liked their music, style and message but not the volume. They can affect many people in many churches and ought to be made aware of it.

No conspiracy cover up plot

 

[BergySmalls]

Another problem is going to a church service to be ministered by a nationally known group that is on tour. Many times they bring their own sound team. I have been to 2 church services involving well known groups where my ears where ringing the next day. I liked their music, style and message but not the volume. They can affect many people in many churches and ought to be made aware of it.

Agreed. That's difficult to deal with because they are using engineers who are more accustomed to larger, concert friendly venues, not smaller churches where people aren't coming to hear loud music.